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UKIPpery


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1233 replies to this topic

#381 Bedford Roughyed

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 06:22 PM

Benefitted from the housing bubble too...


With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

#382 gingerjon

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 06:25 PM

Benefitted from the housing bubble too...

 

Benefitting from another one now.


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#383 Bedford Roughyed

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 06:25 PM

http://www.buzzfeed....sioned-letter-t


With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

#384 Griff9of13

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 06:32 PM

http://www.buzzfeed....sioned-letter-t


A pretty fair assessment there from Ben.

Still, JohnM will be along shortly to tell us how hard done by he is because of the low interest rates. <_<
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#385 ckn

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 08:03 PM

A pretty fair assessment there from Ben.

Still, JohnM will be along shortly to tell us how hard done by he is because of the low interest rates. <_<

He could have gone a lot further as well.  For example, the current political generation has pulled up the ladder behind itself with higher education, in the past you got free education and paid it back through your far greater likelihood of higher income and resulting higher taxes, now youngsters have to pay full-fat fees, take out big loans and then still pay the same taxes as before.


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#386 Bostik Bailey

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 08:57 AM

Not one word of that is an exaggeration.

The pension bill is comfortably more than half the social security budget. All pensioners in addition receive fuel winter payments and free travel on buses. Services for older people are ringfenced and cannot be cut when councils have to balance the books - in contrast to services for disabled people, children and young people. Older people are far more of a burden on the National Health Service than any other group what with them being more likely to be ill and need support and, of course, they don't pay for their prescriptions unlike every other adult.

They get all of that whether they've been a good person or a bad person and they get a lot if it whether they're a rich person or a poor person. It's universal. And there's no hint of scaling it back now that we're in a situation where the bills for older people go up but there are fewer younger people to pay taxes to fund it. In fact all that's happening is the support and benefits for younger or working age people are cut whilst at the same time the age at which that generation will receive their pension goes comically upwards.

Those are all just facts. You can interpret them as you like.


Your right we should just get everyone over the age of 50 into a stadium and laser them all ( we could fit flashing red lights to their palms).

That way we can remove a drain on our public funds.

#387 gingerjon

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 09:41 AM

Your right we should just get everyone over the age of 50 into a stadium and laser them all ( we could fit flashing red lights to their palms).

That way we can remove a drain on our public funds.

 

Hysterical reaction rather makes the point for me.


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#388 JohnM

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 10:40 AM

I've been away for a week and during that time the volume of male genitals talked on here has not diminished one iota, nor has peoples' willingness  to display their ignorance on here.   :P  :P  :P  :P  :P


Edited by JohnM, 25 May 2014 - 10:40 AM.


#389 WearyRhino

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 12:13 PM

I've been away for a week and during that time the volume of male genitals.. on here has not diminished one iota, nor has peoples' willingness  to display their ignorance on here.   :P  :P  :P  :P  :P

 

You're right John, the petition to have all your posts deleted was rejected by the mods.


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#390 Johnoco

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 12:35 PM

It's not an over exaggeration, it's true. However what you say is also true for most,but not all elderly people.

If someone has paid into NI for their working life, then they are entitled to whatever they get. That was the original idea behind the NHS...cradle to grave. We pay in many more times than we get out.

#391 gingerjon

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 02:15 PM

they are entitled to whatever they get

 

Everyone is entitled by your argument.  Everyone pays NI so everyone should get support.  You'll have to explain why at a time of austerity it is only services and benefits for older people that are protected.

 

No point having cradle to grave support and only supporting the bit near the grave.  The contract's broken.


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#392 Johnoco

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 02:55 PM

Everyone is entitled by your argument. Everyone pays NI so everyone should get support. You'll have to explain why at a time of austerity it is only services and benefits for older people that are protected.

No point having cradle to grave support and only supporting the bit near the grave. The contract's broken.

? My argument?

If someone has paid into the system all their working life, they are entitled to help if needed. No argument about it. If you haven't put in, you shouldn't be automatically entitled.

#393 gingerjon

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 06:19 PM

Showing the tough ride the mainstream media are giving Ukip still here's an actual genuine screen grab from BBC Sport:

 

Boej9FrIgAA3Wwc.jpg


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#394 tonyXIII

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 08:26 PM

Everyone is entitled by your argument.  Everyone pays NI so everyone should get support.  You'll have to explain why at a time of austerity it is only services and benefits for older people that are protected.

 

No point having cradle to grave support and only supporting the bit near the grave.  The contract's broken.

 

I think I can address the two issues you raise.

 

Why protect the services and benefits of older people and not younger ones? Firstly, I'm not entirely sure that the picture you paint is quite so black and white, but even if it is, there is a reason to protect the benefits of the older members of the population more than those of younger ones because those who are closer to retirement have less time to redress any shortfall in their benefits. Someone in their twenties/thirties can make adjustments now to their pension arrangements which will provide them with the benefits they need in thirty/forty years time. Someone in their fifties/sixties cannot possibly do that now.

 

The contract is broken? The country has known for decades that there was going to be a serious problem with pension provision sooner or later. Our politicians failed to take the hard decisions until it was too late to adjust things without causing serious damage to many people's retirement provision.

 

I tend to agree that the pain should be shared equally, but see my point above. Also, as I said at the start, I'm not sure about the basic premise that my pension benefits are protected. I've checked online and I won't be getting anything like the £142 pw minimum entitlement. Because I've lived abroad for a good few years, I'll be about £50 short of that figure. Living abroad was my decision and I will live with the consequences.


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#395 Ramite

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 08:39 PM

But someone in there 50/60s would person for person already have a pension much more generous than someone in there 20/30s.
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#396 Bedford Roughyed

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 10:48 PM

Are UKIP a result of a self fulfilling prophecy?  The press say they will do well, put them on every broadcast, then wonder why they rose in popularity?


With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

#397 iglard

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Posted 26 May 2014 - 06:56 AM

Your right we should just get everyone over the age of 50 into a stadium and laser them all ( we could fit flashing red lights to their palms).

That way we can remove a drain on our public funds.

Pinochet didn't need lasers. Have you gone soft?



#398 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 26 May 2014 - 09:59 PM

Are UKIP a result of a self fulfilling prophecy?  The press say they will do well, put them on every broadcast, then wonder why they rose in popularity?

 

The BBC especially should take some responsibility I think for the masses of free publicity that they have given UKIP over the last few weeks.

 

Whilst much more interesting than usual, I think the rise of UKIP has highlighted the fickle way with which many people vote. I really struggle to comprehend how somebody who claims to have voted Labour (or Lib Dem say) all their life can suddenly be voting for UKIP. Immigration and the EU are two policies, however if you were a 'Labour man all your life' the rest of what UKIP stands for is the total opposite to what you've been voting for all your life.

 

We like to think that people consider the policies and then vote for their favourites but this clearly doesn't happen as often as it should. Many people see a political party like the allegience of a sporting club, somebody to stick up for. The people switching from Labour to UKIP are like the people that have suddenly started supporting Man City or Chelsea in the last few years because their team isn't winning any more.



#399 Bearman

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Posted 26 May 2014 - 10:48 PM

The BBC especially should take some responsibility I think for the masses of free publicity that they have given UKIP over the last few weeks.

Whilst much more interesting than usual, I think the rise of UKIP has highlighted the fickle way with which many people vote. I really struggle to comprehend how somebody who claims to have voted Labour (or Lib Dem say) all their life can suddenly be voting for UKIP. Immigration and the EU are two policies, however if you were a 'Labour man all your life' the rest of what UKIP stands for is the total opposite to what you've been voting for all your life.

We like to think that people consider the policies and then vote for their favourites but this clearly doesn't happen as often as it should. Many people see a political party like the allegience of a sporting club, somebody to stick up for. The people switching from Labour to UKIP are like the people that have suddenly started supporting Man City or Chelsea in the last few years because their team isn't winning any more.


My clients most of whom are elderly and often traditional labour voters believe that immigration is THE single most important issue facing Britain today.
When I explain that UKIP is essentially hard line Conservatism they tend to just shrug.
They are concerned that it is immigration that is causing the problems by putting a strain on the infrastructure of the NHS, housing, schools and the welfare/ benefits system.
That is the message that has been so successfully exploited by UKIP.
They look at Milliband, Cameron and Clegg ( the 3 stooges) and see three public schoolboy clones who appear interchangeable. Farage with a pint in his hand comes across as a down to earth pragmatist.
UKIP and the Scots Nats are exploiting that spin far better than any of the other parties.

My clients also know that despite the demonisation of UKIP the 3 stooges wouldn't hesitate to sup with the devil with a short spoon if doing so kept their noses in the trough.

Edited by bearman, 26 May 2014 - 10:51 PM.

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#400 longboard

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Posted 27 May 2014 - 03:06 PM

My clients most of whom are elderly and often traditional labour voters believe that immigration is THE single most important issue facing Britain today.
When I explain that UKIP is essentially hard line Conservatism they tend to just shrug.
They are concerned that it is immigration that is causing the problems by putting a strain on the infrastructure of the NHS, housing, schools and the welfare/ benefits system.
That is the message that has been so successfully exploited by UKIP.
They look at Milliband, Cameron and Clegg ( the 3 stooges) and see three public schoolboy clones who appear interchangeable. Farage with a pint in his hand comes across as a down to earth pragmatist.
UKIP and the Scots Nats are exploiting that spin far better than any of the other parties.

My clients also know that despite the demonisation of UKIP the 3 stooges wouldn't hesitate to sup with the devil with a short spoon if doing so kept their noses in the trough.

 

Perhaps perceptions are more important than reality, but didn't Milliband go to state schools here and in the USA, and didn't Farage go to a private school, ie Dulwich College? He is a city boy from a privileged background. Unlike most other party leaders these days he did not go to university.






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