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Dewsbury 12 Sheffield 28 - Predictions, discussion, highlights


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#61 Jason Basin

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 09:37 AM

gifted them 12 points thanks to naive play. the ball steal was within the rules of the game unfortunately for us and in the second half austin should have been expecting the pass from karl. as has been mentioned he did make himself available and there was nothing wrong with the ball. bonus point or not we were chasing the game and eight points behind with time ticking so had to be a little more adventurous.

 

austin also should have done better in the right hand corner in the second half. he was flat footed and i expected him to do better as an experienced attacking player.

 

as hard as dale morton runs he can be a liability defensively. not so much his tackling, which is ok, but his positional play. he may have slipped for taulapapa's try but in reality he wouldn't have got there anyway as he was way out of position. he was also out of position for a 40/20 and was bailed out on more than one occasion by karl.

 

was a bit worried when i saw karl named at full-back as he isn't quick enough off the mark, but i thought he played well. he made his tackles, didn't make any errors fielding kicks and he was drawing three defenders at kick returns. his ball for austin's try was a peach. he also put his body on the line for the ball in the second half!!

 

think we missed his defence in the threequarters. for the second week in a row we were found out out wide. would be tempted to put hale in one centre and beckett on his wing. just need to get hale to pass!

 

after a nightmare first couple of minutes, briggs looked very good. he usually plays at loose and did yesterday, but i'd be tempted to put him in the halves with thacks. tg has to come off the bench.

 

sorely missing brown and spicer in defence and scott and godwin going forward. aside from thackeray and gallagher, those are probably the four players i'd least want to lose.

 

stringer's a tool and should have walked for his elbow. knowles was as bad as ever although taulapapa actually behaved himself.

 

scott turner's developed into a fine player, and his departure is one of the more unfortunate legacies of the warren jowitt era. would also love to have pat walker back at six for us if briggs doesn't work out.

 

bloem was poor, like he was at swinton, but he's not the reason we lost.



#62 Jason Basin

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 09:44 AM

also hyde needs to keep a lid on his emotions. unfortunately he's developing a reputation as a penalty machine and other sides will start targeting him.



#63 Griff

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 10:03 AM

Rams 28 seagulls 12

 

So close !!


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#64 Griff

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 10:07 AM

Looked more than 867 but worrying if true, considering that we had 4 junior teams playing who all had parents at games. I actualy thought the crowd looked over 1,000 though( Sheffield must if brought 50-70 fans if that?)

 

There were more than that in the main stand.  Not everyone has to wear some sort of regalia, you know.


Edited by Griff, 16 June 2014 - 10:07 AM.

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#65 Official Rams Updates

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:08 AM

Footage available here:


Follow us on twitter @DewsburyRams

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Our website: http://www.dewsburyrams.co.uk/

Email: info@dewsburyrams.co.uk


#66 NickD

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:57 AM

think we missed his defence in the threequarters. for the second week in a row we were found out out wide. would be tempted to put hale in one centre and beckett on his wing. just need to get hale to pass!

 

 Hale has thrown one pass all season.  If we were ever to resort to playing him at centre I for one would not be paying to watch.  Price can pass and tackle.  He needs to be one centre.  Grady is the best centre we have had for years and should be the other.  Grayston should be full back.

We are missing Rob Spicer, but more especially Brown.



#67 muddyfunster

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 12:27 PM

 

as hard as dale morton runs he can be a liability defensively. not so much his tackling, which is ok, but his positional play. he may have slipped for taulapapa's try but in reality he wouldn't have got there anyway as he was way out of position. he was also out of position for a 40/20 and was bailed out on more than one occasion by karl.

 

Don't think you can really put all the blame on Morton for that one slip or not there was a 4 to 1 overlap. As for Pryce, kids are taught to drive the ball away, good basics IMO. The pass should never have gone so close to the line. Pryce needs to stand up and drive the ball in without stopping, but he stops too easily


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#68 Blind side johnny

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 01:57 PM

Don't think you can really put all the blame on Morton for that one slip or not there was a 4 to 1 overlap. As for Pryce, kids are taught to drive the ball away, good basics IMO. The pass should never have gone so close to the line. Pryce needs to stand up and drive the ball in without stopping, but he stops too easily


Especially when three men are tackling him.
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#69 Wakefield Ram

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 05:58 PM

Hadn't noticed before but Morton's positioning and defence looks poor.

#70 grumpyoldram

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 07:31 PM

gifted them 12 points thanks to naive play. the ball steal was within the rules of the game unfortunately for us and in the second half austin should have been expecting the pass from karl. as has been mentioned he did make himself available and there was nothing wrong with the ball. bonus point or not we were chasing the game and eight points behind with time ticking so had to be a little more adventurous.

 

austin also should have done better in the right hand corner in the second half. he was flat footed and i expected him to do better as an experienced attacking player.

 

as hard as dale morton runs he can be a liability defensively. not so much his tackling, which is ok, but his positional play. he may have slipped for taulapapa's try but in reality he wouldn't have got there anyway as he was way out of position. he was also out of position for a 40/20 and was bailed out on more than one occasion by karl.

 

was a bit worried when i saw karl named at full-back as he isn't quick enough off the mark, but i thought he played well. he made his tackles, didn't make any errors fielding kicks and he was drawing three defenders at kick returns. his ball for austin's try was a peach. he also put his body on the line for the ball in the second half!!

 

think we missed his defence in the threequarters. for the second week in a row we were found out out wide. would be tempted to put hale in one centre and beckett on his wing. just need to get hale to pass!

 

after a nightmare first couple of minutes, briggs looked very good. he usually plays at loose and did yesterday, but i'd be tempted to put him in the halves with thacks. tg has to come off the bench.

 

sorely missing brown and spicer in defence and scott and godwin going forward. aside from thackeray and gallagher, those are probably the four players i'd least want to lose.

 

stringer's a tool and should have walked for his elbow. knowles was as bad as ever although taulapapa actually behaved himself.

 

scott turner's developed into a fine player, and his departure is one of the more unfortunate legacies of the warren jowitt era. would also love to have pat walker back at six for us if briggs doesn't work out.

 

bloem was poor, like he was at swinton, but he's not the reason we lost.

Briggs will work out just fine ;) Wouldn't want patch back myself - Ok when he's playing behind a dominant pack, but anonymous when the going gets tough. Turner's OK, but doesn't look hugely improved since his Rams days to me - our current crop of backs (Grady apart) are flattering the opposition TBH.



#71 JimbobRam

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 07:59 PM

Think turner looks better me. Looks stronger taking the ball in thought he was lightweight for us.
Think ossy is on holiday Chris.

#72 Superdave

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:07 PM

the ball steal was within the rules of the game

 

At the time (and I was not alone I might add) I thought otherwise.  I am however am willing to be corrected by those more knowledgeable on the laws of the game than I am. 

 

From the RFL website:

 

Tackle player 1. A player in possession may be tackled by an in possession opposing player or players. It is illegal to tackle or obstruct a player who is not in possession.

When tackled: 2. A player in possession is tackled:

Grounded ( a ) when he is held by one or more opposing players and the ball or the hand or arm holding the ball comes into contact with the ground.

Upright ( b ) when he is held by one or more opposing players in such a manner that he can make no further progress and cannot part with the ball.

Succumbing ( c ) when, being held by an opponent, the tackled player makes it evident that he has succumbed to the tackle and wishes to be released in order to play the ball.

Hand on player ( d ) when he is lying on the ground and an opponent already grounded places a hand on him.

 

“Stealing” from tackled player 9. Once a tackle has been completed, no player shall take or attempt to take the ball from the tackled player.

 

As I saw it the Sheffield player played at the ball (and stole it) whilst it was in posession of the Dewsbury player prone on the ground.  Is it the case therefore that provided he made no contact with the Dewsbury player directly and only the ball ( d ) does not apply?  And ( c ) does not apply because the grounded player was not held, despite his obvious intent to succumb?  Hence no tackle was completed and so if you can grab the ball from a prone player, without touching him, then the correct ruling is to play on?

Or..... in playing at the ball in the posession of another player you are considered to be trying to affect a tackle, I'm pretty sure if the ball carrier was stood upright that the defending player would be counted as a tackler.  If that's the case the tackle was completed on contact and ball stealing is an offence.

 

I honestly don't know

 

This may be a new thread!



#73 EQUALIZER

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:48 PM

Can i get half a point got correct score wrong team



#74 EQUALIZER

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:54 PM

Thanks Ramite, I have finished my course of therapy and have been released back into the community to taunt my neighbours. I was hoping they would release My mate Coolie but criticising the establishment ......... Still tranquilliser did OK after his lobotomy :lol:

A up old lad good to see your winning again, hence the post.



#75 Tom Coates

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 10:40 AM

Congratulations on speculating that we will end up with 47 points BSJ.  I have no idea how I could start working out what our total might be since I have no idea what team will turn up from week to week.  Go to Doncaster and win.  The week after loose at home to Whitehaven.  We get hammered by Sheffield one week and then week after we ease past Workington and dont allow them a bonus point (a very rare event).  Loose at swinton (they've won 4 all season) and then week after hammer the Doggies, the week after that we get hammered by Keighley...and it goes on... bet bookies love us...I hope you are right about the 47; some weeks its easy to believe than others

BTW I have nothing for admiration for the chaps who mange this site but why was this thread (on relgation versus play offs) mergeed with the thread on the Sheffield game???

 

Sorry, Nick - that's my mistake. Trying to group all match discussion together and may have bundled together unrelated messages. Will stick them in a separate thread.



#76 RedAndGoldArmy

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 11:52 AM

A fair summary but with, I believe, a couple of factual errors. It was Scott Hale who had the ball stolen by Turner and Pryce didn't knock-on but threw out a hopeless pass that Buchanan dropped in front of the post for your last try.


You were correct and I quickly amended the mistakes. Thanks for the feedback.

PS - Get Donny beat at the weekend, could do with gaining a bit of ground on them!

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#77 Blind side johnny

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 12:43 PM

At the time (and I was not alone I might add) I thought otherwise. I am however am willing to be corrected by those more knowledgeable on the laws of the game than I am.

From the RFL website:

Tackle player 1. A player in possession may be tackled by an in possession opposing player or players. It is illegal to tackle or obstruct a player who is not in possession.
When tackled: 2. A player in possession is tackled:
Grounded ( a ) when he is held by one or more opposing players and the ball or the hand or arm holding the ball comes into contact with the ground.
Upright ( b ) when he is held by one or more opposing players in such a manner that he can make no further progress and cannot part with the ball.
Succumbing ( c ) when, being held by an opponent, the tackled player makes it evident that he has succumbed to the tackle and wishes to be released in order to play the ball.
Hand on player ( d ) when he is lying on the ground and an opponent already grounded places a hand on him.

“Stealing” from tackled player 9. Once a tackle has been completed, no player shall take or attempt to take the ball from the tackled player.

As I saw it the Sheffield player played at the ball (and stole it) whilst it was in posession of the Dewsbury player prone on the ground. Is it the case therefore that provided he made no contact with the Dewsbury player directly and only the ball ( d ) does not apply? And ( c ) does not apply because the grounded player was not held, despite his obvious intent to succumb? Hence no tackle was completed and so if you can grab the ball from a prone player, without touching him, then the correct ruling is to play on?
Or..... in playing at the ball in the posession of another player you are considered to be trying to affect a tackle, I'm pretty sure if the ball carrier was stood upright that the defending player would be counted as a tackler. If that's the case the tackle was completed on contact and ball stealing is an offence.

I honestly don't know

This may be a new thread!


An interesting question and this was discussed inconclusively after the try was scored.

Ignoring the fine points of interpretation for the moment I would say that it was a fair try: Hale "succumbed" as you say, actually making this a voluntary tackle if nothing else. From my viewpoint Turner simply plucked the ball from his hands without an attempt at a tackle.

The ref did get a fair few things wrong in the game (both ways) but this one I reckon he got right.
Believe what you see, don't see what you believe.


John Ray (1627 - 1705)




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