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RLWC 2017 Qualification


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#41 Viking Warrior

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 08:50 PM

france ahead of the usa they are extracting the urine in the past wo tournaments france have won 1 game 


"Why is Napoleon crying ?" said one sailor to the other, "poor ###### thinks he's being exiled to st helens" came the reply.



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#42 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 08:55 PM

france ahead of the usa they are extracting the urine in the past wo tournaments france have won 1 game

Ok, we get it. You don't like France!
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#43 Viking Warrior

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 09:10 PM

not that wellsy its just that they are being kept in the top 6 artificially 


"Why is Napoleon crying ?" said one sailor to the other, "poor ###### thinks he's being exiled to st helens" came the reply.



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#44 yipyee

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 10:31 PM

The message seems to be more that you get rewarded on the field and not behind the scenes.

Your reward for behind the scenes should be what transpires on the field.

If it's not about what happens on the field, then what's the point of playing?


it should go off rankings and therefore reward teams who

a) can be bothered to play internationals

B) dont bring in heritage players for the big games!

#45 nec

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 10:40 PM

not that wellsy its just that they are being kept in the top 6 artificially

Which teams below them could field a tem of indigenous players that have come through the local youth system that would beat France?
Rugby League is a sport that desperately needs to expand its geographical supporter base and its player base. This imperative means that all other requirements are secondary until this is done.

All power in the game should be with governing bodies, especially international governing bodies.

Without these actions we will remain a minor sport internationally and nationally.

#46 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 10:42 PM

it should go off rankings and therefore reward teams who

a) can be bothered to play internationals

B) dont bring in heritage players for the big games!


How could you enforce the second one?

As for the first one, it's a sad state of affairs when we talk about nations being bothered to organise games. It just shows the mess the international game is.
Established nations shouldn't have to arrange games. The RLIF should be arranging competitions for its member nations to compete in, with consequences for those that don't.
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#47 keighley

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 10:48 PM

Only Jamaica are currently even eligible for the world cup. Lebanon and South Africa both have wel established domestic leagues though

 

As do the USA and Italy and Canada. Samoa on the other hand.....



#48 Evil Homer

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 11:01 PM

Is this thread for real? Why are so many people debating which nations have been included when it is clearly stated that the 2013 quarter finalists are the ones that have qualified automatically? This isn't some arbitrary measure about domestic strength or pulling names out of a hat, they've been granted automatic qualification based on their performance in the previous WC and the rest have to go through qualifying. What on earth is wrong with that?

 

france ahead of the usa they are extracting the urine in the past wo tournaments france have won 1 game 

France are there because they made the quarter finals in 2013. USA aren't there because there are issues with their RLIF membership which need to be resolved before they can play international matches again. This has already been explained.


Edited by Evil Homer, 03 August 2014 - 11:02 PM.


#49 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 11:15 PM

Is this thread for real? Why are so many people debating which nations have been included when it is clearly stated that the 2013 quarter finalists are the ones that have qualified automatically?

No it doesn't.
"Seven nations, who were all quarter finalists in the 2013 tournament – Australia, New Zealand, England, Fiji, France, Samoa and Scotland – have all received an automatic place."
It says they were quarter finalists, and it says they received an automatic place, but it doesn't say they received it BECAUSE they were quarter finalists. Otherwise they would HAVE to mention why there aren't right automatic qualifiers.

This isn't some arbitrary measure about domestic strength or pulling names out of a hat, they've been granted automatic qualification based on their performance in the previous WC and the rest have to go through qualifying. What on earth is wrong with that?

I think that would be fair and good if it was something they announce BEFORE they know which teams finish in those places. It would be like deciding the positions of the teams that qualify for the SL play offs AFTER the regular rounds.

France are there because they made the quarter finals in 2013. USA aren't there because there are issues with their RLIF membership which need to be resolved before they can play international matches again. This has already been explained.

It wasn't explained in that press release. In fact, there was no mention of the USA at all. You'd think it'd be a pretty important fact!

Where has this been explained as the reason?

I'm not saying it isn't (in fact, it makes complete sense), but a lot of the debate has come about purely because of the lack of detail into why some teams have/haven't been automatically picked.
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#50 Evil Homer

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 11:25 PM

No it doesn't.
"Seven nations, who were all quarter finalists in the 2013 tournament – Australia, New Zealand, England, Fiji, France, Samoa and Scotland – have all received an automatic place."
It says they were quarter finalists, and it says they received an automatic place, but it doesn't say they received it BECAUSE they were quarter finalists. Otherwise they would HAVE to mention why there aren't right automatic qualifiers.

I think that would be fair and good if it was something they announce BEFORE they know which teams finish in those places. It would be like deciding the positions of the teams that qualify for the SL play offs AFTER the regular rounds.

It wasn't explained in that press release. In fact, there was no mention of the USA at all. You'd think it'd be a pretty important fact!

Where has this been explained as the reason?

I'm not saying it isn't (in fact, it makes complete sense), but a lot of the debate has come about purely because of the lack of detail into why some teams have/haven't been automatically picked.

USA situation is explained here: http://www.heraldsco...ace.1407058274? They shouldn't really have been in the last WC and the fact that the RLIF are finally getting their act together regarding this situation is long overdue, and TBH a step forward for the sport if anything

 

I mean it seems pretty ridiculous to suggest that 7 nations have been granted automatic qualification, that they happen to be 7 of the 8 quarter finalists from the last event and that the two aren't somehow linked. I understand what you're saying about knowing this beforehand but it's not like the spurious logic from last time when Cook Islands were included because they were 2009 Pacific Cup runners up, every team was looking to progress and fielded their strongest sides in the WC so it really isn't a big issue. If it was up to me, only the semi-finalists would qualify automatically but we aren't at that stage yet.


Edited by Evil Homer, 03 August 2014 - 11:29 PM.


#51 keighley

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 11:26 PM

Which teams below them could field a tem of indigenous players that have come through the local youth system that would beat France?

Wales and PNG.



#52 nec

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 12:21 AM

PNG, yes if it is in PNG. Wales not yet with locally trained players
Rugby League is a sport that desperately needs to expand its geographical supporter base and its player base. This imperative means that all other requirements are secondary until this is done.

All power in the game should be with governing bodies, especially international governing bodies.

Without these actions we will remain a minor sport internationally and nationally.

#53 Jim from Oz

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 12:40 AM

I find it very odd that PNG - the ONE country in the world where RL is the national sport – have to qualify, whereas Scotland - with, what, 4 teams in the entire country? - get an automatic spot. (And this is NOT an attack on Scotland RL).

 

Also, I find it very odd that out of PNG, Tonga and the Cook Islands - 3 relatively strong RL countries - only 2 will qualify.



#54 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 12:58 AM

USA situation is explained here: http://www.heraldsco...ace.1407058274? They shouldn't really have been in the last WC and the fact that the RLIF are finally getting their act together regarding this situation is long overdue, and TBH a step forward for the sport if anything

I mean it seems pretty ridiculous to suggest that 7 nations have been granted automatic qualification, that they happen to be 7 of the 8 quarter finalists from the last event and that the two aren't somehow linked.

It does, you're right. But without any explanation as to why all eight weren't automatic, then it doesn't really got together properly.

That Scottish report explains in a lot more detail than the official press report. Had that been the official one, it would have been a lot better!

I understand what you're saying about knowing this beforehand but it's not like the spurious logic from last time when Cook Islands were included because they were 2009 Pacific Cup runners up, every team was looking to progress and fielded their strongest sides in the WC so it really isn't a big issue. If it was up to me, only the semi-finalists would qualify automatically but we aren't at that stage yet.

I'd prefer the semi finalists at the very most also. More meaningful internationals in the mean time then to get more qualifiers.

Edited by Wellsy4HullFC, 04 August 2014 - 12:58 AM.

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#55 Evil Homer

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 01:10 AM

I find it very odd that PNG - the ONE country in the world where RL is the national sport – have to qualify, whereas Scotland - with, what, 4 teams in the entire country? - get an automatic spot. (And this is NOT an attack on Scotland RL).

 

Also, I find it very odd that out of PNG, Tonga and the Cook Islands - 3 relatively strong RL countries - only 2 will qualify.

Why do you find it odd when the reasoning is quite obvious? And why do you think it's a bad thing that we now have a fair system and certain nations are not simply being handed a place at the sport's showpiece event?

 

That post represents a typical backwards, disorganized RL mentality TBH. "People from PNG like RL, get them in. Oh, Tonga have some good players, throw them in there too". No, that's not how international sport works. Shedding this parochial, shambolic approach is a major step forwards for international RL.



#56 brooza

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 09:04 AM

In terms of full members qualifying groups are:

Europe: Wales, Ireland, Russia, Ukraine, Serbia
Americas: Jamaica
Asia-Pacific: PNG, Tonga, Cook Islands
Middle East-Africa: Lebanon, South Africa

Looking at that though I imagine they'll bring USA and Italy in. Otherwise Jamaica would be invited having never played before in the finals and the 3rd European qualifier would ship 100 points a game whilst a much stronger Cook Islands sits it out

No France?

 

EDIT: Ignore me, I misremembered the list!


Edited by brooza, 04 August 2014 - 09:19 AM.

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#57 brooza

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 09:20 AM

france ahead of the usa they are extracting the urine in the past wo tournaments france have won 1 game 

And if the US were members of the RLIF, they would be in it too


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#58 Dave T

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 11:21 AM

I'd agree with this if they came out and said it! They really need to address the USA situation. This would have been a perfect time to say "you've got to sort your problems out, this is a consequence for the mess you're in."

But if we are to have any credibility, automatic qualification needs to be arranged before we know the teams, not after. "These teams in the quarters are alright, so we'll say it's because of that!"

Well I think by not giving them an automatic place, that is exactly what they have said. What they haven't done is drag a negative and ugly episode into a positive piece. 

 

Most articles I have seen have given context around the USA though, but not sure it should be part of the official release.



#59 londonrlfan

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 02:56 PM

In terms of full members qualifying groups are:

Europe: Wales, Ireland, Russia, Ukraine, Serbia
Americas: Jamaica
Asia-Pacific: PNG, Tonga, Cook Islands
Middle East-Africa: Lebanon, South Africa

Looking at that though I imagine they'll bring USA and Italy in. Otherwise Jamaica would be invited having never played before in the finals and the 3rd European qualifier would ship 100 points a game whilst a much stronger Cook Islands sits it out

 

USA, Canada, Greece, Spain, Ghana, Czech Republic and maybe Malta will all probably be full members by 2015. 



#60 londonrlfan

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 03:00 PM

I don't agree with having that many auto qualifiers, it would be more than half if a proper federation was in place in the USA. Nations like Scotland will just end up going backwards, as they have no reason to develop the sport with a guaranteed place. At least there will be a proper global spread this time, with the Americas and Africa/ME (probably Lebanon) also having an entrant. Anyone know if they're still stopping teams full of heritage players in qualifiers or will they back down from that? 






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