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ParisSurtout

Gareth Ellis is man of the match in the NRL's Sunday prime telecast

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Gareth Ellis scored two fantastic tries for Wests Tigers against Penrith Panthers. It was the icing on the cake of an outstanding performance by the Englishman, who was awarded the Channel 9 Man of the Match award. The Channel 9 commentators, especially Peter Sterling, were ecstatic. Millions of Australians have by now seen or read about the English rugby league star Gareth Ellis.

Ellis already had an excellent reputation last year, winning the West Tigers players' player award in 2009. But now he is even exceeding that powerful reputation.

This all accompanies the huge reputation that Sam Burgess has built in Australia for his magnificent performances in the South Sydney Rabbitohs team. Burgess is one of the key players in the Souths team.

These two Englishmen rank with Australia's Sam Thaiday as among the top five backrowers in the entire world.

Without a doubt both Ellis and Burgess have benefited from playing in the NRL. They are both better players today than they were at the beginning of this season. James Graham has suggested that he is interested in following them. I would hope that more English players like Graham can follow Ellis and Burgess down under. Once that happens I foresee the English pack establishing clear dominance over the Aussie pack in the 4 Nations and World Cup. From that position of forward strength Sam Tomkins and Kyle Eastmond can weave their magic. However Gareth Widdop may swap or alternate the number 6 and number 1 jersey with Sam Tomkins.

All that will be still left to do is to find a decent set of three quarters who can finish off the good work of the English forward and half back stars.

Edited by ParisSurtout

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Well I never, English players as good as Aussies, who'd thought it possible. :O

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Well I never, English players as good as Aussies, who'd thought it possible. :O

A lot of people on here don't think so.

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I am sick of those past it players all going down under to top up their pensions taking the place of good young Ozzy players who don't get chance to develop..... ; :P :P :D :D :lol: :lol: :lol:;) ;)

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Aussie players are better than Brits from birth pure and simple - at least that's what Shaun McRae and half of the internet keep saying.

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All that will be still left to do is to find a decent set of three quarters who can finish off the good work of the English forward and half back stars.

Thats the problem, we need some players who are the match of Inglis, Hodges, Slater and co.

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Wrong forum.

Not this time. Valid subject relevant to UK and European rugby league.

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Not this time. Valid subject relevant to UK and European rugby league.

Ellis has good game in Australia?

What has that got to do with Super League?

If the original poster has his way, every player in the UK would be moving to Australia. We could then do away with all the forums, apart from the Aussie one.

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These two Englishmen rank with Australia's Sam Thaiday as among the top five backrowers in the entire world.

No chance. Thaiday is nowhere near the class of those two.

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No chance. Thaiday is nowhere near the class of those two.

He's Australian, and therefore a superman.

Get with the programme.

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Ellis has good game in Australia?

What has that got to do with Super League?

If the original poster has his way, every player in the UK would be moving to Australia. We could then do away with all the forums, apart from the Aussie one.

Try rereading the original post. I explained it all there.

Edited by ParisSurtout

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Try rereading the original post. I explained it all there.

Thinly disguised attempt to talk about Aussie RL.

Wrong forum.

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Thinly disguised attempt to talk about Aussie RL.

Wrong forum.

The moderator has adjudicated the relevance of this topic to the forum. But you refuse to accept the referee's decision.

There is a legitimate issue of how and why English players have been able to step up a level in performance when they have made the move to Australia. You don't want even to think about it this matter, let alone discuss it.

Instead you offer a predictable negativity. You have nothing constructive to contribute to this thread, or in fact to any thread that I have seen on this forum.

Edited by ParisSurtout

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The moderator has adjudicated the relevance of this topic to the forum. But you refuse to accept the referee's decision.

There is a legitimate issue of how and why English players have been able to step up a level in performance when they have made the move to Australia. You don't want even to think about it this matter, let alone discuss it.

Instead you offer a predictable negativity. You have nothing constructive to contribute to this thread, or in fact to any thread that I have seen on this forum.

Have they? I think that the only difference is that the Aussies have heard of them. I haven't seen anything in Burgess' game that he wasn't doing at Braford and Ellis has been amongst the world's best second rowers for years.

Burgess and Ellis were two of the world's best players before they went to Aus and they still are. Just like Graham, Peacock, Roby and others are - and Eastmond, Tomkins and many others will be (or indeed, already are).

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Have they? I think that the only difference is that the Aussies have heard of them. I haven't seen anything in Burgess' game that he wasn't doing at Braford and Ellis has been amongst the world's best second rowers for years.

Burgess and Ellis were two of the world's best players before they went to Aus and they still are. Just like Graham, Peacock, Roby and others are - and Eastmond, Tomkins and many others will be (or indeed, already are).

I disagree. Ellis was a good player at Leeds before he went to Australia. But he was not a great player. He has become a great player at West Tigers. Whether it was Tim Sheens' coaching or the need to prove himself, or both, I don't know. But no one would have rated him so highly before he went to Australia.

Burgess is a slightly different case. He had been outstanding on occasion when playing in Britain. His Four Nations final performance was superb. But he was inconsistent in the level of his performances. Now he is at South Sydney there is greater consistency in his outstanding performances. Now he plays a great role at Souths that has made him a key figure in the squad. He ranks with Isaac Luke, Dave Taylor and Nathan Merritt as one of the team's stars. (go here: http://www.rabbitohs.com.au/ Sam is the first cab off the rank in the list of club stars.) Also Sam Burgess is now a media celebrity in Australia. This is a sign of how much he has developed in less than one year in the NRL.

Edited by ParisSurtout

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wrong forum

You and Hannibal should form a comedy troupe: The Homeless Reactors: Opinionators Without Premises.

Edited by ParisSurtout

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I disagree. Ellis was a good player at Leeds before he went to Australia. But he was not a great player. He has become a great player at West Tigers. Whether it was Tim Sheens' coaching or the need to prove himself, or both, I don't know. But no one would have rated him so highly before he went to Australia.

Burgess is a slightly different case. He had been outstanding on occasion when playing in Britain. His Four Nations final performance was superb. But he was inconsistent in the level of his performances. Now he is at South Sydney there is greater consistency in his outstanding performances. Now he plays a great role at Souths that has made him a key figure in the squad. He ranks with Isaac Luke, Dave Taylor and Nathan Merritt as one of the team's stars. (go here: http://www.rabbitohs.com.au/ Sam is the first cab off the rank in the list of club stars.) Also Sam Burgess is now a media celebrity in Australia. This is a sign of how much he has developed in less than one year in the NRL.

male genitals.

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Ellis and Burgess were fine players in Super League. They now play in a competition in which, I feel, the opposition are consistently stronger than in SL. They have carried on progressing as players and have improved. This is great news for the England RL side.

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male genitals.

Beat me too it.

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I like Ellis, I think he's an excellent Secoond Row but isn't he currently under investigation by the NRL for a possible 'Chicken Wing' challenge on an opponent? The thing is NRL players & fans both like 'Big Hits' and so they happen more in the Aus than they do over here. The problem is although well executed they look superb but if they're poorly executed they can lead to injury and even if it's only 5 percent of the time they're mistimed/badly done that's still 5 percent of those 'hits' could lead to injury. I haven't watched much NRL but take Shenton being hospitalised in the G4N final last year or Luke Burgess going to hospital with a broken jaw at the weekend

as examples of what can happen in poorly executed shoulder charges. So, going to the NRL can help a player greatly not everything about it is great, in my opinion.

I think Eastmond needs to learn how to become a play-maker but I think neither him, either Tomkins or Westwood need to go Down Under to improve.

Edited by HappyDave

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I disagree. Ellis was a good player at Leeds before he went to Australia. But he was not a great player. He has become a great player at West Tigers. Whether it was Tim Sheens' coaching or the need to prove himself, or both, I don't know. But no one would have rated him so highly before he went to Australia.

Burgess is a slightly different case. He had been outstanding on occasion when playing in Britain. His Four Nations final performance was superb. But he was inconsistent in the level of his performances. Now he is at South Sydney there is greater consistency in his outstanding performances. Now he plays a great role at Souths that has made him a key figure in the squad. He ranks with Isaac Luke, Dave Taylor and Nathan Merritt as one of the team's stars. (go here: http://www.rabbitohs.com.au/ Sam is the first cab off the rank in the list of club stars.) Also Sam Burgess is now a media celebrity in Australia. This is a sign of how much he has developed in less than one year in the NRL.

I haven't really seen enough of Ellis at Wests to comment. I understand that he has been better this year than last, but I haven't seen anything in his game that suggests he is a better player now than when he went to the NRL.

Burgess, I think, is not quite the same player as he was. At Bradford, in his breakthrough year, he was in a very strong pack - in 2009, when he needed to carry the team, he was not quite capable of this. He is in a similar position at Souths - in a pack with old men, trundlers and fatties, and his game is suffering under the weight of expectations. He is committing many more unforced errors than he ever did at Bradford and there doesn't seem to be an improvement in his game - although I accept that would be hard, with him having reached such heights at his young age.

This would be similar to suggesting that Andrew Johns improved himself during his time at Warrington (and I'm sure PJM will tell you he did :P ).

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I see, so because the Souths bill Burgess as a 'star' on their website and the Aussie media are in love with him, that is irrefutable evidence that Sam has only become a good player because of the NRL and the move he made to play there? Absolute rubbish, like most of the stuff you post on here.

Not wishing to get too personal but it is increasingly hard to take anything you post on here seriously PS due to the way you either completely sensationalise your point (i guess in your own eyes it makes it more valid) or in some cases completely make up issues that are complete non-stories i.e. the Menzies contract (or lack of it) at Bradford.

In the case of Burgess, having seen a number of Souths games this season, he is doing nothing different to what he was doing at Bradford most weeks (except for the short period where his mind was obviously on the move and not on the Bulls). A very good player with the potential to only get better and better; always has been, always will be regardless of whether he plays in the NRL or the Super League.

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I haven't really seen enough of Ellis at Wests to comment. I understand that he has been better this year than last, but I haven't seen anything in his game that suggests he is a better player now than when he went to the NRL.

Burgess, I think, is not quite the same player as he was. At Bradford, in his breakthrough year, he was in a very strong pack - in 2009, when he needed to carry the team, he was not quite capable of this. He is in a similar position at Souths - in a pack with old men, trundlers and fatties, and his game is suffering under the weight of expectations. He is committing many more unforced errors than he ever did at Bradford and there doesn't seem to be an improvement in his game - although I accept that would be hard, with him having reached such heights at his young age.

Both of the above statements could be because they are playing in a stronger competiton. I.E. You think Ellis may not be a better player now than when he left SL - I think he is because, at the very least, he is reproducing his SL form against better coached and better conditioned players week-in / week-out. I think his recent England games have shown him to be our best forward by a good mark.

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