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thepimp007

England 17 for the opening game

56 posts in this topic

1. Tomkins

2. Cudjoe

3. Shenton

4. Atkins

5. Hall

6. Brown

7. Dobson

8. Graham

9. Sinfield

10. Morley

11. Ellis

12. Burgess

13. O'Loughlin

14. Lunt

15. Crabtree

16. Westwood

17. Tomkins / Heighnington

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I wouldn't argue with many of these teams tbh, and it does look like quite a strong fresh team, despite a couple of injuries.

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1. Paul Wellens

2. Tom Briscoe

3. Michael Shenton

4. Ryan Atkins

5. Ryan Hall

6. Sam Tomkins

7. Matty Smith (Why not? In form, prefer him to Myler at the mo)

8. Adrian Morley

9. Kevin Sinfield

10. James Graham

11. Gareth Ellis

12. Ben Westwood

13. Sam Burgess

14. James Roby

15. Andy Lynch/Stuart Fielden

16. Sean O'Loughlin

17. Joel Tomkins

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Tomkins S.

Cudjoe

Atkins

Gleeson

Hall

Sinfield

Myler (Eastmond, if fit)

Graham

Roby

Morley

Ellis

Burgess

O'Loughlin

Crabtree

Fielden

Tomkins J.

Westwood

I'm not saying the team above is ideal and one potential problem is that Roby would probably have to do the full 80. However, I would always go with four forwards on the bench against Aus and NZ. Additionally, I've picked three quarters that are amongst the biggest in the British game.

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1. sam tompkins (our best attacking threat)

2. ryan hall

3. michael shenton

4. ryan atkins

5. tom briscoe

6. kevin brown

7. matty smith or paul deacon (someone with a decent long kicking game)

8. adrian morley

9. kevin sinfield

10. stuart fielden

11. gareth ellis

12. sam burgess

13. sean o'loughlin

14. westwood

15. james graham

16. joel tompkins

17. james roby

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1 S Tomkin

2 Cudjoe

3 T Briscoe

4 Shenton

5 Hall

6 Brown

7 Brough (Eastmond not fit, Burrow to predicatable, Robinson doesn't play scrum half for his club, Myler not picked for cup final, so not ready for internationals then).

8 Graham

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1) Wellens

2) Briscoe

3) Atkins

4) Gleeson

5) Hall

6) Tomkins

7) Eastmond

8) Morley

9) Sinfield

10) Graham

11) Ellis

12) Burgess

13) O'Loughlin

14) Roby

15) Westwood

16) Fielden

17) Crabtree

I'd also like to see Joel Tomkins, Liam Watts, Leroy Cudjoe & Kevin Brown in the squad. It's not ideal having Sinfield at 9 but whilst we have a load of good young hookers none of them has really made an irresistible case for selection (this time next year it could be an interesting choice between Lunt, Roby, Ellis & Houghton). If Eastmond doesn't make it I'd move Tomkins to 7 and play Sinfield at 6. Roby would have to start at 9 but I'd prefer to have him coming off the bench.

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I think Michael Dobson for halfback. He has been in the SL dream team this year, and always performs well as a creative halfback- which is what England sorely need. Eastmond and Tomkins are too similar as both are ball runners. England need someone to steer the team around th epark, and Dobson can do that.

Yes, I know Dobson was born in OZ, but he qualifies for England both through his parents and through residency. He has played most of his career in the ESL, and should be considered is England are genuine about winning. The precedent has been set anyway with Faasavalu.

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as HKR players have been added to the squad I'm guessing he's not available. I hope its because he considers himself Australian and doesn't want to play for England even though he qualifies, wich is exactly as it should be.

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Tomkins is a quality player without a doubt.

The Australians calculate the plays like a War room.

They will see his weight/height and defensive/attack skills and Coach their team to a point against him.

Small/light, defensively questionable.

Answer

Isolate him under the kick.

Target him with running back rowers.

Hit him hard and if nothing else blunt his attack options.

Put him one on one with speedy faster 100kg+ backs that might step him, run over him or beat him for pace.

Fullback will be England's hot spot this 4 Nations.

The most dynamic attacking players are picked to play full back in the NRL. Billy Slater, Matt Bowen, Preston Cambell, Josh Duggan, the young kid at Cronula with those 2 length of the field tries this year and Jarryd Hayne. Only one of them is what you would call BIG for a full back.

The way you beat Australia is by scoring more points than them, you do not out defend them. And if you think his defence is questionable then you ain't seen him play.

Put him one on one with speedy faster 100kg+ backs you say sorry mate they don't exist!

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Seeing as there's no way on Earth Eastmond will be travelling to Aus due to all his injuries & him keep picking up injuries this year who are England's options in the Halves? Kevin Brown, Sam Tomkins, Luke Robinson, Rob Burrow & who else?

Sinfield showed the roles of Hooker & Captain of England to be his in last year's G4N so I think he needs to keep those roles this year too.

Edited by HappyDave

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The most dynamic attacking players are picked to play full back in the NRL. Billy Slater, Matt Bowen, Preston Cambell, Josh Duggan, the young kid at Cronula with those 2 length of the field tries this year and Jarryd Hayne. Only one of them is what you would call BIG for a full back.

The way you beat Australia is by scoring more points than them, you do not out defend them. And if you think his defence is questionable then you ain't seen him play.

Put him one on one with speedy faster 100kg+ backs you say sorry mate they don't exist!

Maybe but.. fine players that they are Cambell and Bowen are no longer at the top of their game, Preston is 33 years old and has never reached State selection let alone Test and Bowen had a very limited Test career against the likes of the USA over 6 years ago.

Slater 5 ft 10 in & 13 st 8 lb

Hayne 6 ft 2 in & 16 st 1 lb

Boyd 6 ft 1 in & 14 st 13 lb

Coote 5 ft 10 in & 13 st 5 lb

Minichiello 5 ft 11 in & 14 st 5 lb

Dugan 6 ft 2 in & 13 st 12

Tomkins 5 ft 10 in & 12 st 2 lb

Sam looked far less effective last year in the Four Nations final as a half when his obvious big step had been noted and allowed for.

Scoring more points than any team you play wins the game, but if you do not restrict the points Australia puts on you the chances of blowing them off the field with your own attack is an unlikely outcome.

An open expansive game on dry Australian pitches will not work against their structured defense and pace they posses to outplay them at their own game.

Tomkins defense against Scott Donald in a recent game did not give me the confidence in his ability that you have.

Tomkins would not be as fast as half of the Oz fullbacks mentioned above over more than a short sprint, Hayne and Boyd are nearly the fastest players in the NRL.

Play Sam in the Halves and blood a new player at Fullback.

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cant be bothered finding the other thread but thurston is out with injury.

mitchell pearce or todd carney will be the aussie half back, or cronk

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Just one problem, i think he is scottish ;):rolleyes:

No he isn't, he's from Dewsbury.... I believe that is in England. Plus he turned his back on Scotland after the World Cup, saying if you want to play in the big internationals, with no GB you have to choose England, so he has.

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No he isn't, he's from Dewsbury.... I believe that is in England. Plus he turned his back on Scotland after the World Cup, saying if you want to play in the big internationals, with no GB you have to choose England, so he has.

And he has switched back to Scotland again.

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If Sinfield doesn't play, where does the kicking game come from?

For mine, Tomkins has to play in the halves. Putting him at fullback, isolates far too much. As has been mentioned, he would get pinpointed and all the traffic would be put at him, rendering him knackered and ineffective. In an ideal world, a structured, organising scrum half would be an ideal foil. The only one I can think of is Deacon, it would certainly address the kicking game also, but is this a retrograde step too far?

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Our problem does seem to be in the halves and it does worry me.

Tomkins has played his best stuff at full back and we dont really have one at the moment. FB is the most attacking position so it makes sense to have our most attacking player play there.

Every year it seems there is a need to explain what a FB does. It isnt a defensive position!!!!!!!!!!!!

How can you send traffic at someone who is behind the line??????????????????????????? FB is the most protected position on the field!!

Having said that weve got no halves, so he might have to play there with Widdop at FB who will prob do a good job.

Other options:

Sinfield - Big NO at 6. Doesnt take the line on, hips never square, no threat and too lateral. 9 if hes going to play.

Myler - maybe but cant get in wire team

Brown - Decent season might not be a bad option

Robinson - as above

Burrow - has the experience but poor form

And thus were struggling!!

Id go with:

Widdop

Briscoe Atkins Gleeson Hall

Tomkins Brown

Morley Lunt Graham

Burgess Ellis

o'Loughlin

Westwood, Tomkins, Roby, a.n. other

Squad - Sinfield, Shenton, Cudjoe, Fox, Robinson, Lynch, Crabtree, Harrison

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Maybe but.. fine players that they are Cambell and Bowen are no longer at the top of their game, Preston is 33 years old and has never reached State selection let alone Test and Bowen had a very limited Test career against the likes of the USA over 6 years ago.

Slater 5 ft 10 in & 13 st 8 lb

Hayne 6 ft 2 in & 16 st 1 lb

Boyd 6 ft 1 in & 14 st 13 lb

Coote 5 ft 10 in & 13 st 5 lb

Minichiello 5 ft 11 in & 14 st 5 lb

Dugan 6 ft 2 in & 13 st 12

Tomkins 5 ft 10 in & 12 st 2 lb

Sam looked far less effective last year in the Four Nations final as a half when his obvious big step had been noted and allowed for.

Scoring more points than any team you play wins the game, but if you do not restrict the points Australia puts on you the chances of blowing them off the field with your own attack is an unlikely outcome.

An open expansive game on dry Australian pitches will not work against their structured defense and pace they posses to outplay them at their own game.

Tomkins defense against Scott Donald in a recent game did not give me the confidence in his ability that you have.

Tomkins would not be as fast as half of the Oz fullbacks mentioned above over more than a short sprint, Hayne and Boyd are nearly the fastest players in the NRL.

Play Sam in the Halves and blood a new player at Fullback.

All the top NRL sides are playing their best "maverick" player at full back, Tomkins is our best maverick player. We cant out defend them we have to out attack them to stand any chance.

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And he has switched back to Scotland again.

Yeah so I've just seen in RLE from 2 weeks ago... Sorry. I'd pick Burrow or Myler, not sure which, not that happy with either really.

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I would take Darrell Goulding as a squad player. He has been excellent for Wigan this season and can cover centre and wing positions.

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Yeah so I've just seen in RLE from 2 weeks ago... Sorry. I'd pick Burrow or Myler, not sure which, not that happy with either really.

At least Burrows had some game time recently,something Myler hasn't.

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At least Burrows had some game time recently,something Myler hasn't.

To be fair, he has only actually missed two games. Admittedly they were two of the biggest of the season, but he has still been playing.

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To be fair, he has only actually missed two games. Admittedly they were two of the biggest of the season, but he has still been playing.

It wasn't a dig,it just seems strange for Tony Smith to drop him at the sharp end of the season.

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At least Burrows had some game time recently,something Myler hasn't.

I'd have Robinson over Burrow, been in superb form this season, interchange at 7 or 9, defence has come on leaps and bounds too

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