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John Drake

Energy bills

47 posts in this topic

Because you have a conscience and you would not like to see children brought up in poverty and secondly you will want a pension one day and it would be nice if there was somebody working to help pay for it.

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Because you have a conscience and you would not like to see children brought up in poverty and secondly you will want a pension one day and it would be nice if there was somebody working to help pay for it.

I prefer to see children not born into poverty, rather than brought up in it. Offering money for children encourages breeding to get your hands on the money and sod the children.

I fail to see what your pension point has to do with subsidised breeding. Unless you mean that if we stop breeding we have no workforce to pay tax to pay pensions, I negate that by saying, if we stop paying people to breed we have more money for pensions.

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In this day and age NO pensioner should die from lack of heating in winter due to cold weather payments,the problem is these payments are paid in cash to the pensioners to which some buy better xmas presents for their grand children or children,the payment should be paid direct to their energy supplier so its used for what is was assigned to do

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some buy better xmas presents for their grand children or children

I assume you have evidence for that assertion?

###### the grandchildren....I spend mine on booze :D

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The regulation of the energy industry goes against Tory free market philosophy, so take any headline banners with a pinch of salt.

'Regulations' will be so loosely written and enforcred that they will become redundant as the companies employing the bright sparks either put out press releases saying that they'll send their energy tax revenues abroad or they design ways around the regulations within 12 months, and we'll be in the same boat.

Neither the left or right wing governments have got to grips with a national energy policy in recent times, so now we are left with subsidising the French energy consumer a la EDF.

My first thoughts around this when was announced was that 'it'll be my bills that go up then, because I switch'. And I personally know people who don't bother to switch or save electricity/gas because it won't make any difference and have their heating set at about 27 - 28 degrees cos its nice and cosy. These people will see a saving for nothing.

A future energy policy has to be comprehensive as we are all in it together. Maybe the tarriffs have to be related to size of property, number of rooms, number of occupants, etc. An older person living in a small property in sheltered housing should not be paying similar to a family in a 3 bedroom semi. I'm not saying they do, but that should be the principle.

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Neither the left or right wing governments have got to grips with a national energy policy...

too true.

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too true.

That can be applied to all too many policies over the last few years I'm afraid.

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When I was young, we had frost on the *inside* of our windows. No joke.

AND coats on the bed.

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When I was young, we had frost on the *inside* of our windows. No joke.

AND coats on the bed.

Same here.

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Happy days though. :)

I never remember feeling cold though. Even now I rarely put the thermostat above 20 degrees. Mrs isn't always too happy though!

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I am also suspicious that if Cameron is true to his word and the companies are forced to offer the lowest tariff the choice will be reduced and those people like myself who regularly shop around and switch will actually end up paying more.

I am also suspicious that if Cameron Miliband is true to his word and the companies are forced to offer the lowest tariff  freeze pricesthe choice will be reduced and those people like myself who regularly shop around and switch will actually end up paying more.

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I am also suspicious that if Cameron Miliband is true to his word and the companies are forced to offer the lowest tariff  freeze pricesthe choice will be reduced and those people like myself who regularly shop around and switch will actually end up paying more.

 

A rather selective quote. Here it is in full to give it the proper context:

 

Spot on John. The myth of competition is protected by the labyrinth like complexity of the energy companies multiple tariffs Like Gazza77 states in his post why not have a single price per provider so that we can make a proper comparison of one company against another? Because that would expose the fact that all the providers are in collusion and fix their prices to be pretty much the same.

I switched (again) a couple of weeks ago. When my current provider (First Utility) found out I was leaving them they miraculously found a better tariff to offer me. I compared this with the one I was moving to, a task that took me about half an hour in Excel to do. I reckon that I'm reasonably savvy with numbers and this type of analysis, but it still took me half an hour because it is so difficult to compare like for like.

I am also suspicious that if Cameron is true to his word and the companies are forced to offer the lowest tariff the choice will be reduced and those people like myself who regularly shop around and switch will actually end up paying more.

 

Also, if you'd follow my argument throughout the thread you'd see I was trying to point out that I was very much in the minatory (a link I provided in one post to Fact Check estimates that fewer than 10% change supplier).  ATEOTD I am fortunate enough to manage an increase in the price I pay, may are not.

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As I pointed out on the other topic, I'll try to explain what is wrong with the energy market.

When the market first was open there were lots of small and medium sized companies supplying energy to the grid. These sold this directly to the consumer. The big Six i.e the companies that were created after the break up of the CEGB and British Gas, started to undercut these smaller companies. It worked like this:

Smallgas co has enough gas to sell to 50,000 houses it pitches price X to me,, I switch. Powergen know I've switched to Smallgas co and approach me and undercut Smallgas co (so that Powergen are basically selling to me at break even) so I switch back. This happens to the other 50,000 houses the bigger player undercuts Smallgas co. So Smallgas co has no option but to sell gas to one of the big players. It has been forced out of the market by the size of the bigger players.

So 12 months on Smallgas co is no longer able to compete in the domestic/ retail market, so Powergen up my price, once this happens all the others follow suit. It is a cartel the energy price is set as high as the market can get away with.

If you don't think it is a cartel then here is an example as to why it operates as one:

Some bright spark thought of a way around the high price domestic of energy. If they got enough households together then they could got onto the retail market and buy large amounts of energy in the way that a commercial high user could, and get energy at a much reduced price than the domestic tariff. But guess what, because it was obvious that the gas was going to domestic use, non of the cartel would offer comparative prices to those for a commercial buyer of the same size.

I'm not as clue'd up on the petrol market but I suspect it is very similar.

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As I pointed out on the other topic, I'll try to explain what is wrong with the energy market.

When the market first was open there were lots of small and medium sized companies supplying energy to the grid. These sold this directly to the consumer. The big Six i.e the companies that were created after the break up of the CEGB and British Gas, started to undercut these smaller companies. It worked like this:

Smallgas co has enough gas to sell to 50,000 houses it pitches price X to me,, I switch. Powergen know I've switched to Smallgas co and approach me and undercut Smallgas co (so that Powergen are basically selling to me at break even) so I switch back. This happens to the other 50,000 houses the bigger player undercuts Smallgas co. So Smallgas co has no option but to sell gas to one of the big players. It has been forced out of the market by the size of the bigger players.

So 12 months on Smallgas co is no longer able to compete in the domestic/ retail market, so Powergen up my price, once this happens all the others follow suit. It is a cartel the energy price is set as high as the market can get away with.

If you don't think it is a cartel then here is an example as to why it operates as one:

Some bright spark thought of a way around the high price domestic of energy. If they got enough households together then they could got onto the retail market and buy large amounts of energy in the way that a commercial high user could, and get energy at a much reduced price than the domestic tariff. But guess what, because it was obvious that the gas was going to domestic use, non of the cartel would offer comparative prices to those for a commercial buyer of the same size.

I'm not as clue'd up on the petrol market but I suspect it is very similar.

Problem with petrol is the rediculous levels of duty. Easiest way to get better prices is to bunker or keep a bulk tank but not practical for all. Ironically I bought red diesel for a customer a week ago and paid 73ppl.

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. It is a cartel the energy price is set as high as the market can get away with.

Then everything sold is sold by a cartel

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Ever so slightly off topic, but isn't it an amazing coincidence that British Gas put up their prices by 10% just at the time most people are thinking about putting their heating timer back on?

 

Most energy companies are guilty of this whilst occasionally reducing prices just at the summer approaches!

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The UK population has risen by 21% in the last 50 years.

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/population

 

Electricity consumption has roughly doubled

 

Gas consumption has roughly quadrupled

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/244767/chapter_1_overall_factsheet.pdf

 

Thi si not the game it was , way back when and "no amount of hysterical right left wing ranting from certain quarters can change that"

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