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Lobbygobbler

Enabling Closer games as opposed to tryfest blowouts

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This is the problem - and Lobby himself started this in the OP. He stated that very few games are split by less than 6 points - that is true, but then there are lots of great games which can finish with a margin of 12-18pts or so.

Look at the Saints v Wire playoff game. This was a great battle, some great defence, some great tries and a classic semi final - yet the difference was 18 pts in the end.

Look at the Grand Final - great game, but a winning margin of 8 points, and therefore a reason to move back to 5m according to Lobby!

Is Lobby suggesting any winning margin greater than 6 points is a blowout? Exciting games are usually close scorelines or one where a team losing by several scores makes a comback. The issue was raised before (I believe Lobby was the OP in that case) with the notion that blowouts are becoming incereasignly common place but over the last 5 seasons there has been no real increase.

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Very few games these days are within less than a converted try. This makes the game a turn off despite the so called improvements like the 10m rule and penalties for holding on for more than a nanosecond to make the game more open. In actual fact, making the game more open has the adverse affect and leads to blowouts. I'd rather see a 9-8 close game than tryfests. This would also make more sense than trying to get all teams to be superhuman - which is not going to happen on limited sky money. I also dont think the game is as enjoyable to play now due to too much emphasis on getting back 10m rather than playing the core game of rugby league.

I'd like to see us take a small step backwards and look at reducing the 10m rule and also minimise the impact if a refs whistle (i.e. tackle count does NOT go back to one after a penalty).

All penalties should see the tackle count restarted IMO.

But I do think that maybe they should that maybe there should be different kind of penalties, such as a tap penalty for technical infringements rather than a full penalty. Things like offside seem to be cherry picked because of the impact it has on the game giving a penalty. If they just allowed a tap, you'd see more offsides picked up IMO.

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Lobby has raised this passim, I have posted many scores from pre-10m rule and pre SL where there have been blow out score after blow out score.

Most blow outs happen in the last ten minutes or so usually in my opinion.

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I played with a 5m rule and it enabled skill to get through defences rather than making it easier for the attacking team. Basically pace and power are now dominant given the extra yardage which results in larger score margins. Why are we constantly trying to make RL progressively more difficult to play as well from a fitness point of view. What next -a15m rule and 11a side?

Absolute hogwash!

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1983-84 Season

York 44 Doncaster 10

York 40 Doncaster 9

Widnes 30 Hull 0

Widnes 42 Wakefield 14

Warrington 58 Fulham 32

Swinton 42 Deswbury 2

Swinton 66 Keighley 1

Salford 50 Oldham 10

Saints 50 Wakefield 12

Rochdale 40 Doncaster 20

Halifax 50 Rochdale 9

Oldham 54 Wakefield 4

Oldham 50 Salford 10

Hull KR 54 Leeds 0

Leeds 48 Whitehaven 8

Barrow 48 Huyton 8

Hunslet 52 Huyton 0

Hunslet 50 Doncaster 18

Hull KR 47 Leigh 8

Hull 66 Wakefield 12

Hull 58 Salford 6

Fev 52 Whitehaven 10

Widnes 40 Fev 4

Cas 46 Fev 22

Widnes 54 Dewsbury 10

Dewsbury 42 Rochdal 15

Cas 50 Whitehaven 2

Bradford 45 Whitehaven 4

Hull 42 Bradford 12

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1983-84 Season

Widnes 42 Wakefield 14

Saints 50 Wakefield 12

All that time ago yet I still get a warm feeling looking at those two scorelines

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nope. Maybe a 5 yard rule, though. As that is less than 5 metres, then surely that would be even better.

We can learn a lot from american football. I think they have a one inch rule?

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1983-84 Season

York 44 Doncaster 10

York 40 Doncaster 9

Widnes 30 Hull 0

Widnes 42 Wakefield 14

Warrington 58 Fulham 32

Swinton 42 Deswbury 2

Swinton 66 Keighley 1

Salford 50 Oldham 10

Saints 50 Wakefield 12

Rochdale 40 Doncaster 20

Halifax 50 Rochdale 9

Oldham 54 Wakefield 4

Oldham 50 Salford 10

Hull KR 54 Leeds 0

Leeds 48 Whitehaven 8

Barrow 48 Huyton 8

Hunslet 52 Huyton 0

Hunslet 50 Doncaster 18

Hull KR 47 Leigh 8

Hull 66 Wakefield 12

Hull 58 Salford 6

Fev 52 Whitehaven 10

Widnes 40 Fev 4

Cas 46 Fev 22

Widnes 54 Dewsbury 10

Dewsbury 42 Rochdal 15

Cas 50 Whitehaven 2

Bradford 45 Whitehaven 4

Hull 42 Bradford 12

Pretty much ends the thread really.

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Pretty much ends the thread really.

But... but... but........ SUPER LEAGUE IS RUBBISH!

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So anything over 6 points difference is a blowout? Does that mean anything over 1-0 in football is a blowout also?

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Swinton 66 Keighley 1

I love the defiant drop goal.

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Pretty much ends the thread really.

Erm - not really. Those are scores are for both divisions over the whole season. Noteworty is that there are not many scores over 50 points and only one I counted over 60. There have been many of those this year. I wonder if Padge would be kind enough to all post score margins for last season for all three divisions using the same margin discriminator?

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Early 1960s Swinton put 100 points past Salford in just two games. We Swinton fans were very very happy!

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Noteworty is that there are not many scores over 50 points and only one I counted over 60. There have been many of those this year.

May I suggrst that it is for you to try to justify your assertion. Your words above imply that you have the facts at your fingertips.

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Erm - not really. Those are scores are for both divisions over the whole season. Noteworty is that there are not many scores over 50 points and only one I counted over 60. There have been many of those this year. I wonder if Padge would be kind enough to all post score margins for last season for all three divisions using the same margin discriminator?

Give over. You implied (not for the first time) that modern RL was responsible for one sided blowouts. We can see it isn't yet you're now trying to move the criteria.

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We're they under the "new" 4 point try scoring?

And they were definately played in winter on poor grounds to keep the score down...

Blowout scores are nothing new in the slightest, but I'd say any game these days with a winning margin of less than 10 has been a very tight encounter - and even those that werent that close tended to blow out in the last 5 mins

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Erm - not really. Those are scores are for both divisions over the whole season. Noteworty is that there are not many scores over 50 points and only one I counted over 60. There have been many of those this year. I wonder if Padge would be kind enough to all post score margins for last season for all three divisions using the same margin discriminator?

If you don't have the figures to back up your argument then how did you reach your conclusion?

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We're they under the "new" 4 point try scoring?

Yes.

And they were definately played in winter on poor grounds to keep the score down...

Blowout scores are nothing new in the slightest, but I'd say any game these days with a winning margin of less than 10 has been a very tight encounter - and even those that werent that close tended to blow out in the last 5 mins

Exactly

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This should be an easy argument to solve. Can't some statto somewhere calculate the average winning margin in each division, in each year, and then we see if there are more blowouts in the modern game or not.

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This should be an easy argument to solve. Can't some statto somewhere calculate the average winning margin in each division, in each year, and then we see if there are more blowouts in the modern game or not.

No need, Lobby says it was very rare, that's his argument, its been shown they were not rare in the past, that's the end of his argument. He is though slowly doing his usual thing of adjusting his opening argument now that he has been shown to be completely wrong.

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Absolute hogwash!

Pace and power have become much more dominant though that much he is right about.

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No need, Lobby says it was very rare, that's his argument, its been shown they were not rare in the past, that's the end of his argument. He is though slowly doing his usual thing of adjusting his opening argument now that he has been shown to be completely wrong.

But the evidence on both sides of the argument has been anecdotal. There has been no real analysis of blowout scores (definition of a blowout has not even been defined) how often they occur. There have also been assertions like that a 10 point winning is a close game which is complete nonsense because the only data you have is the end score. Also the assertion that blowout scores occur in the last last 10 minutes which is also unsupported and in general untrue.

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This should be an easy argument to solve. Can't some statto somewhere calculate the average winning margin in each division, in each year, and then we see if there are more blowouts in the modern game or not.

If I've got a spare half hour on Sunday I will do. Watch this space.

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