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Hornetto

Salford Trouble/Salford Takeover

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It seemed a fairly open meeting with over 700 attending apparently. In summary - we owe £350,000 and need £600,000 to start Super league in under 6 weeks or we are finished. There are no concrete investors or buyers yet.

Read the rest yourselves for the gory details - I have had enough for now - :(

THANK YOU.

It was notable that without Barton there would be no licence. Bet the RFL/SLE didn't refer that decision to the licensing puppet panel.

No season tickets in case they don't start to protect fans money. Done the decent thing there.

Also notable the offer of the opportunity to invest in Salford has been on the table a long time, during which investors have presumably taken a watching brief to see how the Stadium performed.

I wonder if anyone can see any return in it now?

I wonder how potential investors now view the decimated playing squad?

I did not pick up any question of Mr. Wilkinson as regards why isn't he and fellow directors going to bankroll the club for the £600K through this time if there are returns to be had?

I assume they have had enough and see no return themselves??

THANK YOU AGAIN

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THANK YOU.

It was notable that without Barton there would be no licence. Bet the RFL/SLE didn't refer that decision to the licensing puppet panel.

No season tickets in case they don't start to protect fans money. Done the decent thing there.

Also notable the offer of the opportunity to invest in Salford has been on the table a long time, during which investors have presumably taken a watching brief to see how the Stadium performed.

I wonder if anyone can see any return in it now?

I wonder how potential investors now view the decimated playing squad?

I did not pick up any question of Mr. Wilkinson as regards why isn't he and fellow directors going to bankroll the club for the £600K through this time if there are returns to be had?

I assume they have had enough and see no return themselves??

THANK YOU AGAIN

I agree - no one want to buy Salford. The £350,000 is the immediate debts (HMRC, ex-players = people on the winding up order). This does not included the £1million + owed to Salford Council, which is aloan repaid quarterly I think. The directors are owed lots too, but seem to have indicated they will drop this if someones wants to take over.

I think they have tried everything now - they don't want to spend anymore of their own cash (recession & want to retire?). I guess the money they

got from selling Holdsworth & Moon have allowed wages to be paid, but not much longer. The winding up court date in end of Jan, my guess is we will be extinct by then ...

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I agree - no one wants to buy Salford. The £350,000 is the immediate debts (HMRC, ex-players = people on the winding up order). This does not included the £1million + owed to Salford Council. The directors are owed lots too, but seem to have indicated they will drop this if someones wants to take over. I think they have tried everything now - they don't want to spend anymore of their own cash The winding up court date in end of Jan, my guess is we will be extinct by then ...

No one wanted to buy Wakefield or Bradford either in terms of riding in on a white charger with saddlebags of cash. It seems the owners there were prepared to come in and try to run these clubs as a going concern, with newmarket being key, and Odsal being in the hands of the RFL also being key. Both these clubs have a significant access to junior players (albeit they have to raid local CC club areas) and fans, both capable of 10K crowds.

Salford however are reliant on buying players in if they can find them and an unresponsive public. What hit me most was the RFL/SLE wanting to kick them out if they had not got Barton. We will see what happens as time unfolds, maybe they will survive, if not the debate will be who else will be out, or who may come in. Time for messrs Abbot and Nahaboo to show their cards?

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Darwen - Its not the strongest that survives but the ones most responsive to change

Change is afoot in RL land, cash cows are saying no more and clubs are cutting the clothe based on a short term survival policy eg current Academy disaster, twinning etc

Clubs with great facilities and subsequent revenue streams, not embroiled in debt and who have gone through the change are ready to step in

If Salford go bump I expect to see Leigh in at short notice.

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If Salford go bump I expect to see Leigh in at short notice.

When would you then expect to see Leigh go bump?

Featherstone's turn.

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When would you then expect to see Leigh go bump?

Featherstone's turn.

The process is tick a box and you win the right to apply.

In the good old days Sheffield would be in this year and Fev last year, but the CHANGE that clubs adjusted to was tick the box and apply.

The stadium is probably the best in RL, best pitch, 1500 parking spots, HD floodlights, Undersoil heating, 22 corporate boxes, catering for 500 diners in banqueting halls and no debt attached to it. The stadium gets great income all year from Education, Employment and Health services located in its superb office facilities, and hence the rent to LRLFC is now variable and affordable as submitted to the RFL during the Bradford fiasco. Add to this the envious training facilities used by many SL and Premiership soccer clubs to attract players !!!!

If playing out of a poophole last time with no parking and little cover with a no hope team got 5000 into it then 6500+ is easy to hit and 7500 with a competitive team in year 2, let alone the extra corporate opportunities. Also remember LRLFC made a profit in SL 2005 - how much would we make in 2013??

LSV is easy to get to for a huge population, and has the facilities to keep them if the product on display is of the correct quality.

Fev are a great club with none of the above to close the deal.

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Did rugby at the willows become an unforttunate and neglected side show to the variety club?

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Did rugby at the willows become an unforttunate and neglected side show to the variety club?

I dont think so.

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The process is tick a box and you win the right to apply.

In the good old days Sheffield would be in this year and Fev last year, but the CHANGE that clubs adjusted to was tick the box and apply.

The stadium is probably the best in RL, best pitch, 1500 parking spots, HD floodlights, Undersoil heating, 22 corporate boxes, catering for 500 diners in banqueting halls and no debt attached to it. The stadium gets great income all year from Education, Employment and Health services located in its superb office facilities, and hence the rent to LRLFC is now variable and affordable as submitted to the RFL during the Bradford fiasco. Add to this the envious training facilities used by many SL and Premiership soccer clubs to attract players !!!!

If playing out of a poophole last time with no parking and little cover with a no hope team got 5000 into it then 6500+ is easy to hit and 7500 with a competitive team in year 2, let alone the extra corporate opportunities. Also remember LRLFC made a profit in SL 2005 - how much would we make in 2013??

LSV is easy to get to for a huge population, and has the facilities to keep them if the product on display is of the correct quality.

Fev are a great club with none of the above to close the deal.

If this happens and we can't sort out our problems - I would be glad that Leigh would take our place.

I wonder if we don't get the money we need, which is the most likley outcome right now, what will happen to us? Chairman said playing at Barton is only viable for SL rugby - so no ground, no money - looks like no club. I know our fans trust (Forever Reds) is taking pledges so we have as fans some funds to restart something - but where? It is the worst time of year for this - people are skint, holidays make gathering momentum hard and the winding up hearing is January 7th ....

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Here's the list for Oldham's 'Golden Era' of 50s and 60s

1950/51 15th

1951/52 5th

1952/53 8th

1953/54 12th

1954/55 2nd

1955/56 9th

1956/57 1st

1957/58 1st

1958/59 4th

1959/60 9th

1960/61 8th

1961/62 10th

1962/63 d1 15th

1963/64 d2 1st

1964/65 9th

1965/66 9th

1966/67 10th

1967/68 22nd

1968/69 16th

1969/70 29th

In the last 3 seasons of a single division Oldham finished 16th, 13th and 9th.

Post WWII until 1950 their highest was 8th and lowest 23rd.

So from 1950 to 1960 they were never out of the top 12 in a 30 team league including being league leaders twice, Champions at least once and in the top 4 playoffs another twice.

They then got relegated but bounced right back and were again in the top 10 of a 30 team league for three seasons from 64 to 66 and then the decline started to kick in. To me that would indicate that they were a top team. You have your own agenda and deny this to be so. I beg to differ. They were a top level team by my definition.

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Neither Leigh nor Featherstone applied for a SL licence last time. Halifax did and got a grade C, but not enough to get them a licence. So, logically, they should be the ones asked to take Salford's place, if it comes to that. But, then again, this is RL, when did logic apply?

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Neither Leigh nor Featherstone applied for a SL licence last time. Halifax did and got a grade C, but not enough to get them a licence. So, logically, they should be the ones asked to take Salford's place, if it comes to that. But, then again, this is RL, when did logic apply?

Leigh had not earned the right to apply under the rules last time, the previous time we had the infamous 'we can't judge the LSV as you haven't played in it' fiasco to get Crusaders in. Logically the teams who have earned the right do so and the best package goes up, should Salford fold, and logically Leigh have the best case of those able to apply, imo of course

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The decision of Salford council not to help out the Reds looks like cutting your nose off to spite your face. With the demise of the Reds caused partly by their lack of assistance, they will be left with a white elephant of a stadium with only Sale as a tenant and , if they get relegated, which looks likely, no top level team to play in it.

Maybe they could have a re visit of their decision.

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The decision of Salford council not to help out the Reds looks like cutting your nose off to spite your face. With the demise of the Reds caused partly by their lack of assistance, they will be left with a white elephant of a stadium with only Sale as a tenant and , if they get relegated, which looks likely, no top level team to play in it.

Maybe they could have a re visit of their decision.

I believe the 'rental agreement' will be much friendlier after the club folds, allowing Salford to build again and join SL2 in 2014.

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They were a top level team by my definition.

They were in the top 4 in only 4 years out of 20. and that was then in the golden age of our game, before motorways, bypasses, large scale modern housing developments out of town centres, universal TV ownership, large scale personal transport ownership, etc changed the sporting landscape forever.

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They were in the top 4 in only 4 years out of 20. and that was then in the golden age of our game, before motorways, bypasses, large scale modern housing developments out of town centres, universal TV ownership, large scale personal transport ownership, etc changed the sporting landscape forever.

They were in the top 10 for ten years in a row. I lived through that era, I was a supporter of the game and I am telling you guys they were considered a top team. If there had been a SL of the top 14 clubs, Oldham would have qualified to be in it. This is in comparison to where they ended up subsequently in Division 2, a yo yo team and subsequent 1 season in the first SL, followed by bakruptcy. resurrection and their current location in CC1. The whole post was about the decline of RL in the Manchester area and, given their league placings and stature in the game in those years they were very much a top team compared to what they became later. I can't believe this is even being questioned

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The decision of Salford council not to help out the Reds looks like cutting your nose off to spite your face. With the demise of the Reds caused partly by their lack of assistance, they will be left with a white elephant of a stadium with only Sale as a tenant and , if they get relegated, which looks likely, no top level team to play in it.

Maybe they could have a re visit of their decision.

I think it is too late for that. The council move so slowly and we have until 7th January to have the money - or we get wound up. I think that door is closed. Unfortunately in their decision to not lend us anymore - understandable in the climate of budget cuts - it means they will lose the money we owe them, when we go out of business soon. I think we will have paid back about 20% of the £1.5l loan at most ... We are needing a miracle :unsure:

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I think it is too late for that. The council move so slowly and we have until 7th January to have the money - or we get wound up. I think that door is closed. Unfortunately in their decision to not lend us anymore - understandable in the climate of budget cuts - it means they will lose the money we owe them, when we go out of business soon. I think we will have paid back about 20% of the £1.5l loan at most ... We are needing a miracle :unsure:

The club needs to go into administration like Bradford and then get the administrator to keep postponing the liquidation date whilst further investors are targeted. It might be a last hope but whilst rhere's life there's etc etc.

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I can't believe this is even being questioned

well, it is. a tp team for only 20% of the time. What I find hard to believe is that there is no recognition of the fact that we live in an entirely different world now than we did when you and I were young. There is no going back to some imagined golden age that never existed anyway. In the 1950 and 60s large numbers lived, worked ad recreated within a few miles of Watersheddings. A trip to an away game was an event n itself. Now, there are a number of successful Sl clubs within 30 to 45 minutes reach of town centre Oldham. Only a hard core few are going to watch Oldham when there is so much better on offer just a stones throw away.

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The club needs to go into administration like Bradford and then get the administrator to keep postponing the liquidation date whilst further investors are targeted. It might be a last hope but whilst rhere's life there's etc etc.

I dont know if adiminstrators can do much against a winding up order issued in court? And that is what we face in 20 days ...

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well, it is. a tp team for only 20% of the time. What I find hard to believe is that there is no recognition of the fact that we live in an entirely different world now than we did when you and I were young. There is no going back to some imagined golden age that never existed anyway. In the 1950 and 60s large numbers lived, worked ad recreated within a few miles of Watersheddings. A trip to an away game was an event n itself. Now, there are a number of successful Sl clubs within 30 to 45 minutes reach of town centre Oldham. Only a hard core few are going to watch Oldham when there is so much better on offer just a stones throw away.

Just so, that's what the series of posts were about, the decline of RL in Oldham and why it happened.

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I did not pick up any question of Mr. Wilkinson as regards why isn't he and fellow directors going to bankroll the club for the £600K through this time if there are returns to be had?

I assume they have had enough and see no return themselves??

THANK YOU AGAIN

Correct assumption there Parky.

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I think it is too late for that. The council move so slowly and we have until 7th January to have the money - or we get wound up. I think that door is closed. Unfortunately in their decision to not lend us anymore - understandable in the climate of budget cuts - it means they will lose the money we owe them, when we go out of business soon. I think we will have paid back about 20% of the £1.5l loan at most ... We are needing a miracle :unsure:

Hound we dont need £600k for 7th January. Surely the two players can be sorted with a deal of some kind and maybe the IR as well if they see there is nowt left in the pot. I am more hopeful than you and the fans are rallying - not in numbers akin to Bradford - but at least there is movement.

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I lived through that era, I was a supporter of the game and I am telling you guys they were considered a top team. If there had been a SL of the top 14 clubs, Oldham would have qualified to be in it.

I am 90 years old and i lived through the 1920's, and I am telling you St. Helens Recreation were a top team. If there had been an SL of the top 14 clubs in that era Recs would be in it.

In the mid 30's Liverpool Stanley would have been in it.

In the late 40's through to the early 50's Workington would have been in it

In the mid 70's Bramley would have been in it.

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So from 1950 to 1960 they were never out of the top 12 in a 30 team league including being league leaders twice, Champions at least once and in the top 4 playoffs another twice.

They then got relegated but bounced right back and were again in the top 10 of a 30 team league for three seasons from 64 to 66 and then the decline started to kick in. To me that would indicate that they were a top team. You have your own agenda and deny this to be so. I beg to differ. They were a top level team by my definition.

Oldham's decline began as early as 1961/62 and came to a head towards the end of that decade.

At then end of the 1967/68 eason Oldham recorded a profit, the first since 1961, of £7,936, in the previous season, 66/67, they had lost £14,000. The turnaround in fortunes wasn't by actually getting more people in to watch them though, they sold several players in order to balance the books.

Oldham were in deep trouble at the start of the 68 season with attendances falling, after a game against Hunslet only drew 2,141 and receipts of £314 the Oldham board held a crisis meeting because the figures were so alarming. They even experimented with a Friday evening game against Warrington but that drew less than 2,000 spectators. Their highest attendance in the first quarter of the 68/69 season was 4,577 but that didn't help Oldham's cash crisis since the game was a Lancashire cup game which meant the receipts were split.

In the 68/69 season they lost £17,000 and had to put club captain Geoff Fletcher up for transfer at £6,000 in a desperate attempt to get in some cash. John Stringer Oldham's secretary said at the time "We don't want to lose Geoff but our financial situation leaves us no choice. We need the money" and the Chairman Ken Fisher had this to say in October 69 "You can't go on forever drawing £300 and spending £600"

So in the 50's Oldham had a few seasons as a leading light but what followed the seasons in the sun was the onset of a terminal decline.

Other clubs, most notably Bradford had problems in the 60's, however I would hardly put Oldham down as a leading light through the 60's.

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