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Derwent

An Interesting Approach to Dual Reg.....

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it's a feeder system, pure and simple.some of us said it was the thin end of the wedge when it was brought in.

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it's a feeder system .....

What do you understand by the term "feeder system" ?

Just asking .....

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I`m not that naive that I think Widnes are anything other than the senior in this but surely it has to be mutually beneficial. And to be fair to Widnes they are saying all the tight things so far. We can only wait and see just what happens.

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I'm here. They can still only play up to 5 at a time. They still need their own squad of Workington players.

And the Workington players are going to feel like 2nd class citizens in their own country. They are only to be picked if no Widnes players are available. The team spirit and morale at Workington will plummett in my opinion. Workngton might move up the league because of these Widnes imports but it's an eratz sort of success.

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A step too far i think by Workington

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Don't like the sound of this myself. I don't want to my team finish higher than their core squad would suggest because they have the use of fringe Widnes first team squad players - its empty success. Neither do I want to see my team being relegated because all other teams are in bed with SL teams and have that advantage of fringe first teamers (I'm not calling it dual reg anymore, as its moved on from that) and can pick and choose those 'available' to suit a particular game or opposition.

How about picking a certain 'aggresive' player wind him up a bit to take the opposition playmaker out in a particular important game. He does so, the team wins but he is cited and cops a 3 match suspension but the Championship team still have a pool of players they can call upon, and it does not affect them in any way.

I don't want my teams results determined by the third of the team who are from elsewhere.

A far better system for me is that 5 players are registered in 2 or 3 monthly blocks, of which a max of 3 can be played in the 17 at anyone time. The SL clubs agrees not to recall those 5 players in that 3 month block. After 2/3 months the 5 players are assessed by both clubs and announced and re-arranged very quickly to go into the next 2/3 month block.

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So is there anything to stop Widnes allowing Workington 5 of their top players if say Workington had a key game in the bid to avoid relegation and Widnes had a weekend free? If not, surely this is just the modern equivalent of having ringers in your side.

Spot on. It's making a farce of the independence of C teams. How could you sleep at night knowing you were only in the league or only the champions because of some other teams players. It's also a slap in the face of all the clubs ploughing their own furough. If Featherstone or Halifax fail to gain the grand final because they were beaten by Widnes first team players at Workington or any other team doing the same, say Hunslet playing half the SL champions squad on a vacant weekend for the Rhinos, this could deprive the losing team of the necessary criterium of winning a trophy to tick their SL application box.

This cannot be right. Justice must not only be done it must be seen to be done.

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Workington could save a fortune by ditching the coaching staff and letting Widnes pick the side every week.

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Its regrettable but entirely predictable, its the only way the twinning system can work for the SL club. Take Widnes as a convenient example but it could be most clubs, they have a 30 man 1st squad most of whom are too old to play u19s, 17 play 1st team the rest literally have nowhere to play. Simply put, it was obvious from the outset that 5 players spending a whole season at a twin club couldn't work. What should be of real and pressing concern is the other apparently obvious and logical conclusion that it can only work for the SL club if they have some way of ensuring that all their players get game time. Of course no one is going to say it publicly but if the SL clubs don't believe they have some control over which of their players play and when then they are incredibly relaxed about the prospect of paying players who are at real risk of literally not playing a single game all season.

There are some clear risks to the integrity of the competition here that, in the absence of published rules, remain unanswered.

If the dual players are made available after the Widnes 18 is chosen what happens for Thursday/Friday games? As an example Workington play Keighley on Thurs 30 May but Widnes play Catalans on the following Sunday. Widnes won't even have named their 20 man squad when Workington play their game, presumably we just have to swallow weakened teams for tv fixtures?

Still no word on how the salary cap will work.

No indication of how the season end will work, any protection against artificially strong teams as a one off for important such games play off qualification or relegation avoidance? What will be the qualification criteria for playing in play off games? Too high a threshold and its likely that a team will loose all its duals for the play offs, too low and we run the risk artificially strong strong teams just for the play offs or GF.

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Spot on. It's making a farce of the independence of C teams. How could you sleep at night knowing you were only in the league or only the champions because of some other teams players.

Dunno, ask Widnes. They got into SuperLeague using other team's players.

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Spot on. It's making a farce of the independence of C teams. How could you sleep at night knowing you were only in the league or only the champions because of some other teams players. It's also a slap in the face of all the clubs ploughing their own furough. If Featherstone or Halifax fail to gain the grand final because they were beaten by Widnes first team players at Workington or any other team doing the same, say Hunslet playing half the SL champions squad on a vacant weekend for the Rhinos, this could deprive the losing team of the necessary criterium of winning a trophy to tick their SL application box.

This cannot be right. Justice must not only be done it must be seen to be done.

Finally! Someone that gets it!

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say Hunslet playing half the SL champions squad on a vacant weekend for the Rhinos.

Won't happen. They can only pick a maximum of 5 players.

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Surely this wasn't the intention?

They don't tell you the intention in press releases.

What is was referred to was a sort of two independent clubs helping each other out it's a win win thing.

But Hunslet have already broken ranks through Eaton seeing Leeds & Hunslet combining as some sort of joint player development system. No suprise there when Hull/HKR had a joint system on the table.

Bet Eaton got a shock when Brad Singleton went to Wakefield!!

This will become whatever the clubs want it to be.

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Its regrettable but entirely predictable, its the only way the twinning system can work for the SL club. Take Widnes as a convenient example but it could be most clubs, they have a 30 man 1st squad most of whom are too old to play u19s, 17 play 1st team the rest literally have nowhere to play. Simply put, it was obvious from the outset that 5 players spending a whole season at a twin club couldn't work. What should be of real and pressing concern is the other apparently obvious and logical conclusion that it can only work for the SL club if they have some way of ensuring that all their players get game time. Of course no one is going to say it publicly but if the SL clubs don't believe they have some control over which of their players play and when then they are incredibly relaxed about the prospect of paying players who are at real risk of literally not playing a single game all season.

There are some clear risks to the integrity of the competition here that, in the absence of published rules, remain unanswered.

If the dual players are made available after the Widnes 18 is chosen what happens for Thursday/Friday games? As an example Workington play Keighley on Thurs 30 May but Widnes play Catalans on the following Sunday. Widnes won't even have named their 20 man squad when Workington play their game, presumably we just have to swallow weakened teams for tv fixtures?

Still no word on how the salary cap will work.

No indication of how the season end will work, any protection against artificially strong teams as a one off for important such games play off qualification or relegation avoidance? What will be the qualification criteria for playing in play off games? Too high a threshold and its likely that a team will loose all its duals for the play offs, too low and we run the risk artificially strong strong teams just for the play offs or GF.

For me, the integrity of the CC comp is being undermined and its not too difficult to find reasons why as the above poster has illuminated us with.

Its time there was some direction, transparency and agreement on this.

There are enough holes being brought to light already.

I'm not going to have a 3 hour round trip to watch my team that is full of Widnes fringe players one week and then get tonked the next as they don't fancy the away trip, or Widnes pull them back.

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For me, the integrity of the CC comp is being undermined ..........

What do you mean integrity??

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If i was a Widnes player I`d seriously consider having a dip in form if it meant i didn`t have to travel to Wuckintown every other week.

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The integrity of the salary cap for one......

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Spot on. It's making a farce of the independence of C teams. How could you sleep at night knowing you were only in the league or only the champions because of some other teams players. It's also a slap in the face of all the clubs ploughing their own furough. If Featherstone or Halifax fail to gain the grand final because they were beaten by Widnes first team players at Workington or any other team doing the same, say Hunslet playing half the SL champions squad on a vacant weekend for the Rhinos, this could deprive the losing team of the necessary criterium of winning a trophy to tick their SL application box.

This cannot be right. Justice must not only be done it must be seen to be done.

I dont know if you have seen but Hunslet have only got 4 Leeds Rhinos on dual reg

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They don't tell you the intention in press releases.

What is was referred to was a sort of two independent clubs helping each other out it's a win win thing.

But Hunslet have already broken ranks through Eaton seeing Leeds & Hunslet combining as some sort of joint player development system. No suprise there when Hull/HKR had a joint system on the table.

Bet Eaton got a shock when Brad Singleton went to Wakefield!!

This will become whatever the clubs want it to be.

You reckon? Brad Singleton was never coming to Hunslet, hes on far too much money for him to be loaned out (dual reg) for FREE, he was always going to a Super League club who could cover his annual wage.

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Won't happen. They can only pick a maximum of 5 players.

At the moment. Thin edge, wedge etc.

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For me, the integrity of the CC comp is being undermined ..........

The integrity of the comp was undermined as soon as automatic promotion to Super league was taken away, that is what has caused the situation Championship clubs like Hunslet, York and Workington etc to take up these partnerships!1999 virtually killed our club and the snowball affect of the last 13 years has led us to this place in time. All we are doing is trying to survive and compete.

SO WE SHALL AGAIN

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I dont know if you have seen but Hunslet have only got 4 Leeds Rhinos on dual reg

Fair comment but I can see the numbers being changed and also the age groups of the on loan players being abandoned as well. I hope I am wrong

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Fair comment but I can see the numbers being changed and also the age groups of the on loan players being abandoned as well. I hope I am wrong

But that's all if and maybes, i dont agree with an entire squad been dual reg to another club, and our supporters would never accept it, we have had all on convincing them that 4 quality youngsters from Leeds will be beneficial.

But they are the rules set by the RFL, dont blame clubs for exploiting them, its the RFL who should be feeling the backlash not the clubs who are working within the rules set by the RFL to benefit their own clubs.

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But that's all if and maybes, i dont agree with an entire squad been dual reg to another club, and our supporters would never accept it, we have had all on convincing them that 4 quality youngsters from Leeds will be beneficial.

But they are the rules set by the RFL, dont blame clubs for exploiting them, its the RFL who should be feeling the backlash not the clubs who are working within the rules set by the RFL to benefit their own clubs.

"clubs who are working within the rules set by the RFL"

Can you please point me to a link or press release around the rules and guidelines for the coming season with respect to the Championship salary cap and Challenge Cup eligibility (as that issue is just around the corner).

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You reckon? Brad Singleton was never coming to Hunslet, hes on far too much money for him to be loaned out (dual reg) for FREE, he was always going to a Super League club who could cover his annual wage.

No your right. The sad thing is BH that a Leeds reserve the club doesn't need is eagerly snapped up by Wakefield who really should be producing their own players. Sadly for such a big city with such an RL heritage and no direct opposition from Soccer there's only a couple of Wakefield born lads in SL.

I've just seen the plans for the Hunslet/Leeds tie up and yes only four players are named as going to the 'uns this season. The extent of the development work between the clubs though doesn't stop at four season long loans.

"Between the Rhinos and Hunslet, there are currently 35 hours of coaching delivered each week in schools with the new structure hoped to raise that to 150 hours per week. The key targets are to have:

• 100 new schools offering Rugby League

• 100 new fully qualified level 2 coaches

• 1,000 new players in primary schools

• 2 new amateur clubs in the city

• 1,000 new fans

• A new heritage facility at Headingley Carnegie Stadium"

Whilst we may run with a squad of 20 "Hunslet lads" with "only four Leeds lads" the plans above (which are highly impressive indeed) you tell me that in 10 years time we won't be running with all Leeds lads.

I'm not trying to catch you out and I do continue to praise you to high heaven for your work at the club, but this is the end to independence. I don't mind that and I won't even mind when Hetherington opens up his Hunslet and Bramley sections in the City of Leeds RL heritage centre under the Carnegie stand. I may donate an item or two :D

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