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Johnoco

RL - Competitivity between Leagues

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We've seen a few upsets in soccer matches lately, not least Bradford City making it to Wembley in the League Cup. They beat 3 PL sides on the way there, no mean feat. Luton (non league) beat PL side Norwich yesterday..incredible really. The Bradford City squad cost approx £7500 to assemble against the multi millions spent on Villa etc.

Its unlikely that we will ever see such upsets in RL, but in my view this is down to the nature of the game rather than any gap emerging as some critics claim. You can't get a much bigger gap than the one described between Villa and Bradford City...yet they still beat them. It would probably be the equivalent of a BARLA team beating a SL side...and we know that won't happen.

So, my question is can RL ever be as unpredictable? Are you bothered? What would it take to achieve that? An unrecognisable game to the one we know? I aren't talking about the odd cup upset like Fev over Hull or Wigan v Eagles as the gap there was nowhere near as big.

Thoughts?

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We've seen a few upsets in soccer matches lately, not least Bradford City making it to Wembley in the League Cup. They beat 3 PL sides on the way there, no mean feat. Luton (non league) beat PL side Norwich yesterday..incredible really. The Bradford City squad cost approx £7500 to assemble against the multi millions spent on Villa etc.

Its unlikely that we will ever see such upsets in RL, but in my view this is down to the nature of the game rather than any gap emerging as some critics claim. You can't get a much bigger gap than the one described between Villa and Bradford City...yet they still beat them. It would probably be the equivalent of a BARLA team beating a SL side...and we know that won't happen.

So, my question is can RL ever be as unpredictable? Are you bothered? What would it take to achieve that? An unrecognisable game to the one we know? I aren't talking about the odd cup upset like Fev over Hull or Wigan v Eagles as the gap there was nowhere near as big.

Thoughts?

You're right it's the nature of the game, the try line is bigger and a lot easier to cross than getting the ball into the back off the net.

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Yep - it's just got too easy to score or too hard to defend, whichever way you want to look at it.

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In soccer it is easy to set your stall out to defend and stop the opposition scoring and easier to get a lucky goal.

In our game you cannot set out with the sole intention of defending and hoping for a lucky try to win you the game.

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Yep - it's just got too easy to score or too hard to defend, whichever way you want to look at it.

In football, desire and passion can take you far against better teams, even to victory but in RL that will only take you so far. An amateur team could play a SL or CC side and be as determined as they like but they won't beat them.

I suppose one way of looking at it is that in RL, 99.99% of the time the best team will always win. But it doesn't help comps like the CC.

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So, my question is can RL ever be as unpredictable?

Thoughts?

The wide try line against the narrow goal line counts.

I'd suggest the depth of talent counts too, Soccer players at lower levels are more able to live with those at higher levels for the odd game or two.

I'm bothered because when Bradford City see off Villa it says to Bradford people "we can rise to the premiership" (yes they did do that), so it helps attract and keep fans. Our game is not as fluid and doesn't give the same hope to fans.

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Bradford might not be international stars but they are, at least, full-time professionals.

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The wide try line against the narrow goal line counts.

I'd suggest the depth of talent counts too, Soccer players at lower levels are more able to live with those at higher levels for the odd game or two.

I'm bothered because when Bradford City see off Villa it says to Bradford people "we can rise to the premiership" (yes they did do that), so it helps attract and keep fans. Our game is not as fluid and doesn't give the same hope to fans.

I am well aware of the goal v tryline aspect. I am referring to the fact that a team 3 or 4 divisions below a top ranked RL side will never beat them and if its an issue that bothers RL fans in general.

As for Bradford City, this cup run is bigger news than when they made the PL, certainly in Bradford.

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As has already been stated the nature of both games suits an upset in football far more than in RL. Having a level playing field, as alluded to by Northern Sol, also helps. An equal number of quota players in teams from different divisions might also help to bridge the gap a little.

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As has already been stated the nature of both games suits an upset in football far more than in RL. Having a level playing field, as alluded to by Northern Sol, also helps. An equal number of quota players in teams from different divisions might also help to bridge the gap a little.

I suppose that's true. But don't forget, the difference in player quality, training, income, facilities etc between a PL side and a 4th division one (in reality) is also massive.

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I suppose that's true. But don't forget, the difference in player quality, training, income, facilities etc between a PL side and a 4th division one (in reality) is also massive.

I agree John but they don't allow PL sides to have five foreign players whilst limiting teams outside the PL to one foreign player.

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I agree John but they don't allow PL sides to have five foreign players whilst limiting teams outside the PL to one foreign player.

True but it was always the case, even in the past.

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How far back is "the past"?

When overseas players were the exception.

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Serious question. How long has there been a disparity between the quota allownaces of teams in the top flight and those not in the top flight?

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I am referring to the fact that a team 3 or 4 divisions below a top ranked RL side will never beat them and if its an issue that bothers RL fans in general.

A little bit, yeah. While the game's going to be good to watch, you've generally seen it before. The third Leeds-Melbourne WCC's coming up FFS.

Some underdog stories would definitely add to it for me. Fev-Cas last year was superb. Toulouse-Widnes in 2005 was positively exotic.

And well done Oldham! And well done Cape Verde!

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In league usually the best team wins.

The physical nature of the game means that if there are differences in the strength and physical ability of the two teams, then as the weaker team tires, they make more mistakes, which shift the advantage even more to the physically stronger team.

That will always make it hard for a non SL team to beat a SL team and a community team to beat a championship one. The narrower the gap in physical strength, the more chance of an upset.

In SL, we've seen this happen. Wigan still usually beat Wakey, but that's not now because Wakey run out of steam half way through the second half like they used to, it's usually because of differences in skill level and mental toughness.

The "shocks" in RL are Widnes beating Wigan last year and those type of results.

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I think you have answered your own question John.

Sometimes the better team loses in RL, but when this happens the teams are nearly always in the same division and it is a matter of dropped passes, finger tip misses, lapses of discipline etc.

As you know, the territorial emphasis in rugby, rather than the possession imperative in soccer, makes it harder for the lower division sides to win in cup games etc.

Also, we don't have nearly five leagues of professional players in rugby..............................................

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Featherstone cas last year, great game !

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Featherstone cas last year, great game !

Yes and it does occasionally happen but there's not as much of a gulf between them, as between Bradford and Villa or Luton & Norwich. (Or Oldham & Liverpool)

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Yes and it does occasionally happen but there's not as much of a gulf between them, as between Bradford and Villa or Luton & Norwich. (Or Oldham & Liverpool)

Fev went into that game as favourites. As everyone in Wakefield knows Cas = #weakestofthethree

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