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joe elliot

Six Nations Envy

104 posts in this topic

indeed. there were 50k empty seats at Wembley for the double header. Fill these and you could be talking another £1-3m for them to be spending on internationals.

An extra £1-3m would simply be split between the RFL, ARL and the NZRL.

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Until the scores are in doubt the international game will suffer.

Bingo.

Doesn't matter about the attendances, the stadia, the players. International rugby league's problem is IT LACKS COMPETITION.

Moan at the Six Nations all you like, and yes Ireland v England was far from a classic, but many people would rather watch that then England putting 74 points past Wales.

The Six Nations has two smaller tiers: England, France, Ireland and Wales in one, Italy and Scotland in another, but even then the tiers have a smaller gulf then RL ones (hence Italy beating France).

Rugby League has a team for each tier!! Well apart from England v New Zealand which is one of the few truly competitive matches in International RL.

I say change the rules a bit: yes it might "lose credibility", it might confuse players a bit but heck at least it might give out reasonably competitive scores.

It will of course happen: eventually Wales and France should reach the England/NZ level and then International RL will really be able to compete on a "valid" stage, but Union just seem to be doing it faster with Italy and Argentina being 'elevated' in. And the more teams there are to start off with the easier it gets. I would say that Union now has around 10-14 "valid" teams (perhaps over two tiers but still). League still has 3.

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And how many pro leagues does RU have compared to RL's two and a couple of semi pro leagues?

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Oh well we may as well accept a second rate international scene, as it doesn't look like its going to get any better.

I think I'm just getting tired of the view that clubs over internationals. Too many games in super league= watered down competition, not enough internationals.

you're not alone in that joe but getting from here from there is more than just getting the perfect strategy, its a much broader question and will require a significant period of time. Agree with the need for consistency but fans need to vote with their feet, that's the basis of everything

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And how many pro leagues does RU have compared to RL's two and a couple of semi pro leagues?

Do we have two semi-pro leagues?

France for sure but NZ is just a mess. They don't even have a national league. Does PNG have a semi-pro league?

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It will of course happen: eventually Wales and France should reach the England/NZ level and then International RL will really be able to compete on a "valid" stage, but Union just seem to be doing it faster with Italy and Argentina being 'elevated' in. And the more teams there are to start off with the easier it gets. I would say that Union now has around 10-14 "valid" teams (perhaps over two tiers but still). League still has 3.

If the likes of Georgia and Romania count as "valid" then France, Fiji, Tonga, Samoa and PNG also are.

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Sadly, I think we've missed the boat. Ask anybody about international rugby and they'll think about union. We'll never compete with them on that stage so why worry?

Our product at club level is far superior and they know it. Let's just concentrate on pointing this out to the masses, continually win the TV ratings war and rub the unionites noses in it.

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An extra £1-3m would simply be split between the RFL, ARL and the NZRL.

really? And not a penny would be spent on the internatiinal game?

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Where does the money come from?

Let me guess the Bank of RFL but surely that's already buying Broncos a new home in London, funding a Welsh super league team, building a national headquarters and stadium in London and fixing up Odsal.

And your proof for all that I have highlighted ?

No point having a faster game if the scores are predictable - and sadly they are at international level. We should have built on the 2000 world cup and played a six nations the year after. Ireland were a decent team and Wales had reached the SF.

Until the scores are in doubt the international game will suffer. We stupidly sped our game upwith the 10m rule and this widens the gap between teams

I do not normally agree with you on much but here you are spot on.

Bingo.

Doesn't matter about the attendances, the stadia, the players. International rugby league's problem is IT LACKS COMPETITION.

Moan at the Six Nations all you like, and yes Ireland v England was far from a classic, but many people would rather watch that then England putting 74 points past Wales.

The Six Nations has two smaller tiers: England, France, Ireland and Wales in one, Italy and Scotland in another, but even then the tiers have a smaller gulf then RL ones (hence Italy beating France).

Rugby League has a team for each tier!! Well apart from England v New Zealand which is one of the few truly competitive matches in International RL.

I say change the rules a bit: yes it might "lose credibility", it might confuse players a bit but heck at least it might give out reasonably competitive scores.

It will of course happen: eventually Wales and France should reach the England/NZ level and then International RL will really be able to compete on a "valid" stage, but Union just seem to be doing it faster with Italy and Argentina being 'elevated' in. And the more teams there are to start off with the easier it gets. I would say that Union now has around 10-14 "valid" teams (perhaps over two tiers but still). League still has 3.

A very sensible post but I have serious doubts that a game in full retreat to its heartlands is ever going to have a competive Welsh or French team Certainly if last years tri-nations tournament was anything to go by.

Like it or not Rugby League in the northern hemisphere is in crisis with the game already serving as a feeder league for the NRL or RFU. As I have posted before, within 5 years thev England RL coach will fly out to Australia where the majority of the squad will be. A bunch of NRL players will raise the standard of the England team no doubt but it will be because players reach their potential in the NRL not Super League.

Some posters on here need to wake up and smell the coffee, and I certainly don't know what the gamechanger will be to turn League's fortunes around but then a lot of posters and voices within the game are quite happy with the prospect of an M62 Small Town game even if it is a feeder league. As ye sow so shall ye reap

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We should have built exactly what after the 2000WC? It was a financial disaster and almost sent the RFL to the wall. There were virtually no genuine Welsh or Irish players to play for these countries...what were we meant to do? Pretend?

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I'm pretty envious of the reach of the Six Nations, of the fact that the games don't need to be classics (or good) to get national press attention and large crowds.

But I'm also aware that the championship has been going since 1883 with the full support of exactly the right type of people for all that time - that shamateurism kept all the component parts of the competition at broadly the same level for most of that time (although Scotland have won at Twickenham a whole five times). Also the nature of a 4/5 game league is such that you will always have something to play for.

But, really, there is nothing for rugby league to learn from it.

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I have an American wife. She has say through a few games of rugby league and saw her first game of rugby union today.

Some bits were OK, but she had the following thoughts;

- The bit where they all push each other (ruck and scrum) look a bit silly

- It was a bit boring

- They kick all the time and she prefers the running and passing

Considering she could not have told me whether it was league or union, I suggest we reassure ourselves a little. If a game of rugby league had been that dull, we would be declaring our game ruined. Instead, it was another sport and we are declaring our game ruined.

Also, we RL had a game like that, Lobby would suggest it was proof that rugby union was better.

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Comment on the BBC website:

'ray207

4 Minutes ago

Rugby league faster and more exciting than Union? Get a grip, you stop the game every 10 seconds and then even hand the ball meekly over to the opposition after six tackles. you tell me when you have seen a rugby league game where you can have ten minutes of non stop action with all the ferocity and commitment or rucks and mauls.'

:lol:

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Comment on the BBC website:

'ray207

4 Minutes ago

Rugby league faster and more exciting than Union? Get a grip, you stop the game every 10 seconds and then even hand the ball meekly over to the opposition after six tackles. you tell me when you have seen a rugby league game where you can have ten minutes of non stop action with all the ferocity and commitment or rucks and mauls.'

:lol:

the problem being that so so many people actually believe that

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Comment on the BBC website:

'ray207

4 Minutes ago

Rugby league faster and more exciting than Union? Get a grip, you stop the game every 10 seconds and then even hand the ball meekly over to the opposition after six tackles. you tell me when you have seen a rugby league game where you can have ten minutes of non stop action with all the ferocity and commitment or rucks and mauls.'

:lol:

Yesterday . The time before that was Friday night.

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Comment on the BBC website:

'ray207

4 Minutes ago

Rugby league faster and more exciting than Union? Get a grip, you stop the game every 10 seconds and then even hand the ball meekly over to the opposition after six tackles. you tell me when you have seen a rugby league game where you can have ten minutes of non stop action with all the ferocity and commitment or rucks and mauls.'

:lol:

i love me a bit of union, don't even mind a dour game, but this nonsense of a ptb being a stop in play always baffles me. Anyone who knows union knows damn well that only a few rucks are genuinely contested, most are just a slow version of the ptb, even the new 5 second rule only starts after the ball is made available. Excitement is in the eye of the beholder but faster is a FACT! And I speak as someone who would prefer it to slow down and be reduced to five metres.

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Comment on the BBC website:

'ray207

4 Minutes ago

Rugby league faster and more exciting than Union? Get a grip, you stop the game every 10 seconds and then even hand the ball meekly over to the opposition after six tackles. you tell me when you have seen a rugby league game where you can have ten minutes of non stop action with all the ferocity and commitment or rucks and mauls.'

:lol:

I can remember playing in Swindon St George's first game and our stop/start game went from kick off to the first try of the game (scored on about 20mins) without a penalty. The union players playing first game of league were complaining that there were no breaks in play like in free-flowing union.

About 6Nations envy, supporting our World Cup and cheering England to become World Champions would be a great start!

Come on England!

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indeed. there were 50k empty seats at Wembley for the double header. Fill these and you could be talking another £1-3m for them to be spending on internationals.

That is the reason RU can stage these games and take long term decisions.

why do you think there was 50k empty seats at wembley? maybe because it was played in london where the local team can only manage to get 2-3k averages of there own, why are we playing these games at wembley/millennium, when it would make more sense to play these games at old trafford/elland road, closer to where all the supporters are, What is wrong with this idea??????

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why do you think there was 50k empty seats at wembley? maybe because it was played in london where the local team can only manage to get 2-3k averages of there own, why are we playing these games at wembley/millennium, when it would make more sense to play these games at old trafford/elland road, closer to where all the supporters are, What is wrong with this idea??????

Why do lots of northern football fans travel to Wembley on a Wednesday night for a friendly but northern RL fans won't for a 4N/WC double header on a weekend?

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why do you think there was 50k empty seats at wembley? maybe because it was played in london where the local team can only manage to get 2-3k averages of there own, why are we playing these games at wembley/millennium, when it would make more sense to play these games at old trafford/elland road, closer to where all the supporters are, What is wrong with this idea??????

I do wonder if just Eng V Aus would have got more than a tacky/cheapened double header. Anyway International crowds up north have also been ####

We have never filled Old Trafford for an international since 1986 when it only held 50k. In fact Wembley crowds have generally been higher

I can recall at recent 4N Eng V Aus game at Wigan which only got about 20k, and various other poorly supported tests at Blackburn and Bolton - nearby where all the fans live

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really? And not a penny would be spent on the internatiinal game?

I reckon a small percentage would find it's way back into the international game via the RFL but I wouldn't hold my breath on the ARL or the NZRL using any extra profit from the 4N for anything other than their own domestic games.

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Comment on the BBC website:

'ray207

4 Minutes ago

Rugby league faster and more exciting than Union? Get a grip, you stop the game every 10 seconds and then even hand the ball meekly over to the opposition after six tackles. you tell me when you have seen a rugby league game where you can have ten minutes of non stop action with all the ferocity and commitment or rucks and mauls.'

:lol:

To be fair, 7-8 years ago Sev was coming out with stuff like that.

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why do you think there was 50k empty seats at wembley? maybe because it was played in london where the local team can only manage to get 2-3k averages of there own, why are we playing these games at wembley/millennium, when it would make more sense to play these games at old trafford/elland road, closer to where all the supporters are, What is wrong with this idea??????

I've seen Great Britain play at Old Trafford.

It was brilliant. I had practically the whole row to myself.

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I've seen Great Britain play at Old Trafford.

It was brilliant. I had practically the whole row to myself.

And I'be seen GB at Twickenham and I had a whole block to myself!

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