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del capo

Institutional Racism in RL

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Still watching the game at Warrington but well aware of the Met Police definition on this issue.

I am aware that for some years the French have felt hard done by.

Do they have a point ?

Please engage........

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There's probably a serious academic issue to be revisited here, focusing on empirical evidence.

A forum isn't the place for it though.

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What they are seeing is not so much refs against them, as for the "big" teams, because Les Cats can compete these decisions make more difference.

Wigan, Saints, Leeds and now Wire get the 50/50 calls going their way, its simple as that.

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Didn't think Catalans were that hard done by tbh. Too much indiscipline from them when they got a couple of tough calls.

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Top teams take advantage of the rules (cheat) better than lower teams, that's why they are the top teams (of course it is only one of many reasons but is a large factor).

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What they are seeing is not so much refs against them, as for the "big" teams, because Les Cats can compete these decisions make more difference.

Wigan, Saints, Leeds and now Wire get the 50/50 calls going their way, its simple as that.

And that's the point of the thread in the context of a non UK side.

But Pottsy is correct . It's an academic issue for proper investigation...

.

Meanwhile tell that to the Sang et D'or fans in the bars of the south of France.........

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Didn't think Catalans were that hard done by tbh. Too much indiscipline from them when they got a couple of tough calls.

I agree. I know I can be accused of bias - but I genuinely like Catalan - but they can be frustrating as hell.

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Cats didn't get the 50/50 calls lastnight but if you've been to Catalan like I have a few times you know its a total reversal when they are at home. I remember Kirk Yeaman getting penalized once for getting punched and carried off with concussion.

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Perhaps one of the more eloquent posters could pose the question to Radio 4's "More or Less" they did a recent piece on "Fergie Time" so do cover sports issues from time to time.

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Catalans let themselves down last night and only had themselves to blame. Too bothered about niggling a the time, Elima just got himself wound up and lost focus, sane as Webb. I think they should have a look at themselves before complaining about any bias.

They actually have potential tho. Despite spending 80 mins moaning and trying to fight, then being down to 12 for 20 mins, making some basic errors, and being outplayed for large parts of game they only lost by a couple of tries. Imagine what they could if they really applied themselves!

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Is Catalan a race?

No, but they are Catalan in only name. They are no more more Catalan then Perpignan football and rugby union clubs.

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Webb is a disastrous signing for them. The biggest liability in the game, despite the occasional flashes of brilliance he's capable of showing.

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Ignoring the 'racial' element of this thread for a moment, there is some basis to the idea that Catalans and London get unfairly treated by match officials. Phil Clarke did a piece on this a couple of years back and the difference between the number of decisions those two clubs get and the rest of the SL clubs was stark. Also, London took this issue to the RFL at around the same time and the response from Stuart Cummings was interesting. Shown the evidence that had been collected over a period of years, not just one game mind, he admitted there was a problem and then shrugged his shoulders and said he wouldn't be looking at it again.

Both expansion clubs get a raw deal in this regard. It's been well documented.

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If you look at the penalty stats for Catalans, Broncos and Skolars they do get more penalised when playing away. Why this is is open to debate. My view is that subjectively the refs do not like the long distances travelled to these teams and unconsciously penalise these teams. Also the home 'M62' teams have large crowds who influence officials and no away following.

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French isn't a race, it's a nationality.

Racism is the discrimination of a person or persons who are different from the perpetrator. Therefore French is a race, and any kind of bias or discrimination against them could be construed as RACISM

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If you look at the penalty stats for Catalans, Broncos and Skolars they do get more penalised when playing away. Why this is is open to debate. My view is that subjectively the refs do not like the long distances travelled to these teams and unconsciously penalise these teams. Also the home 'M62' teams have large crowds who influence officials and no away following.

Well, don't let's stop there. The Cumbrian clubs have had this for years longer than any of those clubs!!!!!

Catalans lost the plot a bit last night and I'm sure when they review the match they will see this. Mind you Ben Westwood is no angel either!!

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i think last night had more to do with catalans being a disgrace than racism, the discipline was appalling and elima and webb should have been red carded for their constant niggling and foul play.

as for catalonia it is a region spanning the border between france and spain with barcelona as it's capital, much the same as the basques........

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Looking at the French forum on here, it does seem that that there is a difference in outlook between French and British approaches to the game. The French forum tends to focus on a much narrower range of topics, with less creativity in their titles and a more deferential approach when one of the game's leaders give a statement. As soon as the RFL make an announcement to the English speaking world, there is a default assumption by some posting on here that the idea will automatically have no merit and is designed to disadvantage their club in some way.

I do think there is something in the national psyche of both nationalities that does mean there is mistrust of the other. The French revel in paranoia over Anglo-Saxon conspiracies, the English take a sly delight in French misfortune. At London 2012 I was watching the fencing, and sat behind a group of noisy French supporters, it therefore appeared natural to cheer whenever the Americans registered a hit. As most of the Superleague refs are English speaking, it is quite likely they will subconsciously bring this attitude into the game. Coupled with the pressure brought by the home crowd, it is possible that this does have an influence on decision making. However if a side plays the game in a way that makes the referee's life more difficult, then they should not be surprised when the decisions start to go against them.

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cant see a race problem as the ref penalised the australian players in the team as well not just the french players

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Don't limit it to those already mentioned, Leyth have been slaughtered in big games all my life - never has a 50/50 gone our way and imo that will be the case as long as Cummins is involved. He hates us and encourages those refs wanting to progress to hate us too - that must be racist in todays society especially with Leyth being far more important than London, French and Cumbria combined.

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leeds never get the rub of the green from robert hicks or tim roby because of course in leeds we area different race to them .

time for the tin hat i fear :dry:

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Don't limit it to those already mentioned, Leyth have been slaughtered in big games all my life - never has a 50/50 gone our way and imo that will be the case as long as Cummins is involved. He hates us and encourages those refs wanting to progress to hate us too - that must be racist in todays society especially with Leyth being far more important than London, French and Cumbria combined.

Leyth=Leigh?

Not heard them called that before.

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