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Dual Reg U-Turn

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There are plenty of Widnes players who now need game time who would be suitable for a loan deal?

Go on, dare you........ :P

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sounds like same ambitions of barrow soccer. lets go down a division, cut out all the long travelling for the fans and everything is hunky dory.sorry but i dont think so. every player who plays at present for the raiders wants to be playing at the highest level and winning games.alright at present it aint happening for us but the mere thought of relegation for the club will put us back 20 years at craven park. look at whats happened to oldham. not long ago a top division team playing a high standard . now a sh..t hole of a ground and playing in a league that they realy shouldnt be in. last 5 seasons a cp have been spot on . a few lows but plenty of highs.

I wasn't at the game as I am at work (abroad) but reading "Holt set to wield Barrow Raiders Axe" on the online Evening Mail site it would suggest differently.

I refer to the second para where he says there was a lack of fight, effort and application.

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At this moment in time DR isn't gonna happen at Barrow - end of. Obviously we can never say never to anything but the current system is too much of a joke to be honest.

Some clubs in Championship and Championship 1 are now trying to offload (on loan) some of their fringe players who are missing out on matches because DR players are ousting them. At least three clubs are doing this because of "unrest" among their own lads.

I am also getting whispers that one "partnership" is near to collapse this week because of the influence the SL club is trying to exert on the Championship club. For some reason it hasn't yet become public knowledge but trust me it has happened.

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Having thought about this for quite some time I can see no reason why myself and the club need to be anything other than open and transparent upon the Dual reg scenario with the supporters. I would be more than happy to have an open forum where all questions could be put forward and duly answered. For the sake of clarity, the club are not currently looking to go down this Dual reg route for any number of reasons but be clear that discussions have taken place with a number of SL clubs and all considerations taken into account before this decision has been reached.

From a personal view point, I see this new dual reg system as being flawed on nearly all levels except for the utilisation of young SL squad members to cover injuries during the season giving them some valuble game time whilst helping the championship club also, the very reason for which it was introduced. I continuously read and listen to peoples opinions regarding this subject claiming that Barrow are at some great disadvantage for not utilising it but on what are these opinihons based??? Mike Sunderland has posted on this thread giving his opinion that we have to go down the dual reg route, which is an opinion to which he and everyone else is entitled. To that , I would say where is the evidence of this great advantage clubs have??...............if you look at the current league table, all be it it is early days, teams such as Swinton, Keighley, York and others already utilise it but it seems that dual reg is not the miracle cure that Mike and others profess it to be. I watched the Featherstone/ Keighley game on Thursday where Keighley utilised 3-4 dual reg players, some SL regulars, and still lost comprehensively. We played against Doncaster earlier in the season who used 3-4 dual reg players but IMO we played well enough to win. Swinton, who in my opinion have utilised this option in the wrong way, currently have almost an entire squad of warrington youngsters supplemented with senior players intermittently(Chris Bridge, Paul Wood) but are struggling and have won only one game............is just doesn't stack up.

Having said that, we have still considered the option and having been told the expected arrangements and proposals that accompany it have been left with no option but to refrain from utilising it. However, other routes and options such as loan agreements and further signings are being explored in the aim of strengthening the squad as we are currently struggling in certain areas for consistency and performance. It is a long season and the coaching staff have a belief in our squad but if we can strengthen we certainly will as and where neceessary.

There is no such thing as a quick fix I am afraid, recent history has certainly taught us that, but Dual reg doesn't even qualify as that. I understand many people will not agree but this is the opinion of the club as a whole and we will continue to work hard and fight to get to where we want to be going forward. The real problem at the moment is closer to home and getting the best out of our current squad week in week out, and I'm confident we will get there. The influx of returning players and some further players will hopefully keep everyone on their toes and push us on to reach our full potential and get the season started. As supporters, you all have right to want the team to perform and do well and we will do everything in our power to ensure this happens going forward.

All the best.

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Well said Holty, talking sense as usual. I'm not a fan of the dual reg set up the way it's being used at the moment, getting players one week then not the next. Getting players on loan is different altogether when you can get them for a month to cover injuries etc....

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Well said and well done to barrow for this stance. Let the season recommense on sunday...

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Holty maybe I didn't express my opinion clear enough..so I will try again

I am not an advocate of the new system...

The new DR system may be our only option if you are wanting to bring in players on DR as it supersedes the old system. So if, as you have stated in the evening mail we are looking at all options and we are to bring in additional players it would have to be through this method would it not?

I'm no fan of the system and after reading your comments I get the impression the new system is something the majority of super league clubs are wanting. This is an assumption on my part but it has been a directive from the RFL.

As I stated in my last post I know whatever decision you and the board make it would be for the benefit of the club. I just feel that the statements and agreements announced in the press have limited our options should we need them.

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Barrowraiderskid... I understand what you are saying about being relegated but we would be in exactly the same situation the season after regarding not being good enough yet again for the Championship ? We will become the proverbial yo yo side which again is no good to us.

We really need to stay up no matter what !

Lee

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Holty maybe I didn't express my opinion clear enough..so I will try again

I am not an advocate of the new system...

The new DR system may be our only option if you are wanting to bring in players on DR as it supersedes the old system. So if, as you have stated in the evening mail we are looking at all options and we are to bring in additional players it would have to be through this method would it not?

I'm no fan of the system and after reading your comments I get the impression the new system is something the majority of super league clubs are wanting. This is an assumption on my part but it has been a directive from the RFL.

As I stated in my last post I know whatever decision you and the board make it would be for the benefit of the club. I just feel that the statements and agreements announced in the press have limited our options should we need them.

You can only use dual registration if your club is in a genuine partnership with a SL club. Clubs that are not in a partnership can still loan players from SL clubs for a minimum of 1 month.

I think the problem with loans could be that SL clubs in partnerships may not want to loan their players to another club other than their partnered club or else they could end up with their players playing against each other for different clubs.

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You can only use dual registration if your club is in a genuine partnership with a SL club. Clubs that are not in a partnership can still loan players from SL clubs for a minimum of 1 month.

I think the problem with loans could be that SL clubs in partnerships may not want to loan their players to another club other than their partnered club or else they could end up with their players playing against each other for different clubs.

My point exactly..with barrow refusing to join with a super league club our options are very limited IF we ever want to utilise a DR player.

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Going back to what keith said. The dual reg system wont work. From what he said, its a good job we didnt. As for players on loan, i dont know the ins and outs, but if we have a massive debt to deal with, i.e. the lights, maybe we cant even go down that route.

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I think the cleverer DR clubs have kept their squads small, and at the moment don't need their DR players but will use them if injuries warrent it, this enables them to spend a bit more on top class players.

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It would be interesting to know what the various squad sizes are if the DR players are not included.

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It would be interesting to know what the various squad sizes are if the DR players are not included.

At the start of the season the smallest squad was Swinton with 17 players but then before the 1st match they signed 6 from Warrington taking their squad to 23. The next smallest was Doncaster with 22, then Leigh and Town with 23 (but we've just signed another player). Most clubs had 25 - Batley, Dewsbury, Halifax, Haven. Barrow had 26 as did Fev, Sheffield and Hunslet had 29 and Keighley 33.

Those figures were those printed in the RL Express before the first league fixtures and do not include DR or loan players.

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Having thought about this for quite some time I can see no reason why myself and the club need to be anything other than open and transparent upon the Dual reg scenario with the supporters. I would be more than happy to have an open forum where all questions could be put forward and duly answered. For the sake of clarity, the club are not currently looking to go down this Dual reg route for any number of reasons but be clear that discussions have taken place with a number of SL clubs and all considerations taken into account before this decision has been reached.

From a personal view point, I see this new dual reg system as being flawed on nearly all levels except for the utilisation of young SL squad members to cover injuries during the season giving them some valuble game time whilst helping the championship club also, the very reason for which it was introduced. I continuously read and listen to peoples opinions regarding this subject claiming that Barrow are at some great disadvantage for not utilising it but on what are these opinihons based??? Mike Sunderland has posted on this thread giving his opinion that we have to go down the dual reg route, which is an opinion to which he and everyone else is entitled. To that , I would say where is the evidence of this great advantage clubs have??...............if you look at the current league table, all be it it is early days, teams such as Swinton, Keighley, York and others already utilise it but it seems that dual reg is not the miracle cure that Mike and others profess it to be. I watched the Featherstone/ Keighley game on Thursday where Keighley utilised 3-4 dual reg players, some SL regulars, and still lost comprehensively. We played against Doncaster earlier in the season who used 3-4 dual reg players but IMO we played well enough to win. Swinton, who in my opinion have utilised this option in the wrong way, currently have almost an entire squad of warrington youngsters supplemented with senior players intermittently(Chris Bridge, Paul Wood) but are struggling and have won only one game............is just doesn't stack up.

Having said that, we have still considered the option and having been told the expected arrangements and proposals that accompany it have been left with no option but to refrain from utilising it. However, other routes and options such as loan agreements and further signings are being explored in the aim of strengthening the squad as we are currently struggling in certain areas for consistency and performance. It is a long season and the coaching staff have a belief in our squad but if we can strengthen we certainly will as and where neceessary.

There is no such thing as a quick fix I am afraid, recent history has certainly taught us that, but Dual reg doesn't even qualify as that. I understand many people will not agree but this is the opinion of the club as a whole and we will continue to work hard and fight to get to where we want to be going forward. The real problem at the moment is closer to home and getting the best out of our current squad week in week out, and I'm confident we will get there. The influx of returning players and some further players will hopefully keep everyone on their toes and push us on to reach our full potential and get the season started. As supporters, you all have right to want the team to perform and do well and we will do everything in our power to ensure this happens going forward.

All the best.

I want to see barrow do well as much as anyone but I feel by not goin for dual reg we have made a huge cock up.

Imagine if we had Chris bridge playing for even just one game what excitement he would bring and also flush out some of the part time fans to show up at craven park.

I think if every barrow player played at 100% each week, we would still be struggling, we have not got enough go forward up front and some of the players are at a league above their standard.

Other than Harrison and kurt hag, I can't see a break from any other forward, maybe finchy but I think he should start at 6.

The influx of players you mention, the only player I'm looking forward to seeing is spencer, he has to be good, we have to have 1 decent prop in our squad who won't be bullied.

Butler and mcgoff don't give me much hope, I've always liked butler but last year I thought he was very poor. Mcgoff did ok but I think champ 1 is his level, like many of this years squad.

Perhaps there is a player ive forgot about?

Time is against us and wins need to come fast or we will go down and I think the vision barrowraidersskid has for next year is a vision I think nobody else will have.

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Barrowraiderskid... I understand what you are saying about being relegated but we would be in exactly the same situation the season after regarding not being good enough yet again for the Championship ? We will become the proverbial yo yo side which again is no good to us.

We really need to stay up no matter what !

Lee

Yes we obviously should do what we can to stay up, but at the expense of becoming a SL reserve side, No. Loan signings need to be made IMO or more permanent signings to be able to stay up.

My long winded post was to get the point across we won't go bust if we go down. Going down wouldn't be preferred obviously but it wouldn't be 'the end of professional RL in the town,' which has been stated. I didn't mean to imply we should go down and come back up which rereading it does seem to come across.

I do like Darrens stance on the situation, because at the end of the day people turn up to watch Barrow not Wigan A team. Hunslet and Swinton have to become A teams as they have SL clubs stealing their fans and players. We don't so are capable of surviving without being a reserve side.

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At the start of the season the smallest squad was Swinton with 17 players but then before the 1st match they signed 6 from Warrington taking their squad to 23. The next smallest was Doncaster with 22, then Leigh and Town with 23 (but we've just signed another player). Most clubs had 25 - Batley, Dewsbury, Halifax, Haven. Barrow had 26 as did Fev, Sheffield and Hunslet had 29 and Keighley 33.

Those figures were those printed in the RL Express before the first league fixtures and do not include DR or loan players.

Thanks Keith.

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'Having thought about this for quite some time I can see no reason why myself and the club need to be anything other than open and transparent upon the Dual reg scenario with the supporters. I would be more than happy to have an open forum where all questions could be put forward and duly answered.' For the sake of clarity, the club are not currently looking to go down this Dual reg route for any number of reasons but be clear that discussions have taken place with a number of SL clubs and all considerations taken into account before this decision has been reached.

From a personal view point, I see this new dual reg system as being flawed on nearly all levels except for the utilisation of young SL squad members to cover injuries during the season giving them some valuble game time whilst helping the championship club also, the very reason for which it was introduced. I continuously read and listen to peoples opinions regarding this subject claiming that Barrow are at some great disadvantage for not utilising it but on what are these opinihons based??? Mike Sunderland has posted on this thread giving his opinion that we have to go down the dual reg route, which is an opinion to which he and everyone else is entitled. To that , I would say where is the evidence of this great advantage clubs have??...............if you look at the current league table, all be it it is early days, teams such as Swinton, Keighley, York and others already utilise it but it seems that dual reg is not the miracle cure that Mike and others profess it to be. I watched the Featherstone/ Keighley game on Thursday where Keighley utilised 3-4 dual reg players, some SL regulars, and still lost comprehensively. We played against Doncaster earlier in the season who used 3-4 dual reg players but IMO we played well enough to win. Swinton, who in my opinion have utilised this option in the wrong way, currently have almost an entire squad of warrington youngsters supplemented with senior players intermittently(Chris Bridge, Paul Wood) but are struggling and have won only one game............is just doesn't stack up.

Having said that, we have still considered the option and having been told the expected arrangements and proposals that accompany it have been left with no option but to refrain from utilising it. However, other routes and options such as loan agreements and further signings are being explored in the aim of strengthening the squad as we are currently struggling in certain areas for consistency and performance. It is a long season and the coaching staff have a belief in our squad but if we can strengthen we certainly will as and where neceessary.

There is no such thing as a quick fix I am afraid, recent history has certainly taught us that, but Dual reg doesn't even qualify as that. I understand many people will not agree but this is the opinion of the club as a whole and we will continue to work hard and fight to get to where we want to be going forward. The real problem at the moment is closer to home and getting the best out of our current squad week in week out, and I'm confident we will get there. The influx of returning players and some further players will hopefully keep everyone on their toes and push us on to reach our full potential and get the season started. As supporters, you all have right to want the team to perform and do well and we will do everything in our power to ensure this happens going forward.

All the best.

It's a pity the club can't be quite so open and honest about some other matters.

ie why 4 members of the board of directors resigned!

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Come on guys..first win of the season..lets just sit back and say ahhhhhhhhhhhh......with this win I hope we can drive forward as from what I saw in the second half there are not many teams could touch us..

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Yes we obviously should do what we can to stay up, but at the expense of becoming a SL reserve side, No. Loan signings need to be made IMO or more permanent signings to be able to stay up.

My long winded post was to get the point across we won't go bust if we go down. Going down wouldn't be preferred obviously but it wouldn't be 'the end of professional RL in the town,' which has been stated. I didn't mean to imply we should go down and come back up which rereading it does seem to come across.

I do like Darrens stance on the situation, because at the end of the day people turn up to watch Barrow not Wigan A team. Hunslet and Swinton have to become A teams as they have SL clubs stealing their fans and players. We don't so are capable of surviving without being a reserve side.

its been metioned previous by someone else, but are you mental?

at least if we go down we dont have to waste money on floodlights!

to even think we could get promoted on just south cumbria players is plain stupid.

name me a side then barrowraider skid thats just made up of south cumbrians that would get promoted from CC1?

theres been enough locals used and abused by the raiders by getting signed and becomming bit part players (or not een that - brad marwood for one) who i'm pretty sure wouldnt re-sign.

we have always relied on the out of town players and occaisonal overseas players to boost the side.

just imagine last season if we had no warrington players and no out of towners such as ballard, do you think we would have got promoted? i dont.

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You clearly haven't seen the standard of the league have you. Its ameteur standard. At least do some research before you post. There's North Wales, London, Rochdale and Oldham. Every other game would be a 50 point hammering.

Last year there was Workington, Whitehaven and Doncaster in the league. This year their isn't. How many games did we lose last season to teams who are currently in that division. 1. Ballard was class I'll give you that. Bracek didn't look interested. Shaw was class but technically he is South Cumbria. Brennan did well and Duffy was average.

Haney

Backhouse

Lowe

Larkin

Nixon

Kaighan

Campbell

Butler

Mossop

Dawson

Harrison

Gordon

Toal

Mcgoff

Whitehead

Finch

Wiper

We've got options at ameteur level who would be able to compete also. Look at the squad lists and where the players have signed from. It is a much lower standard than last year.

Hey we shouldn't be talking about relegation. After yesterdays performance I'm confident which can avoid it with dual reg :)

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You clearly haven't seen the standard of the league have you. Its ameteur standard. At least do some research before you post. There's North Wales, London, Rochdale and Oldham. Every other game would be a 50 point hammering.

Last year there was Workington, Whitehaven and Doncaster in the league. This year their isn't. How many games did we lose last season to teams who are currently in that division. 1. Ballard was class I'll give you that. Bracek didn't look interested. Shaw was class but technically he is South Cumbria. Brennan did well and Duffy was average.

Haney

Backhouse

Lowe

Larkin

Nixon

Kaighan

Campbell

Butler

Mossop

Dawson

Harrison

Gordon

Toal

Mcgoff

Whitehead

Finch

Wiper

We've got options at ameteur level who would be able to compete also. Look at the squad lists and where the players have signed from. It is a much lower standard than last year.

Hey we shouldn't be talking about relegation. After yesterdays performance I'm confident which can avoid it with dual reg :)

i dont get your reply, i mean you have mentioned 2 players who have left the raiders and i cant see returning and forgotten about another local who is a current barrow first team squad member, Brad Marwood.

how can you forget about marwood? oh wait, Holty has so i can excuse you for that!

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i dont get your reply, i mean you have mentioned 2 players who have left the raiders and i cant see returning and forgotten about another local who is a current barrow first team squad member, Brad Marwood.

how can you forget about marwood? oh wait, Holty has so i can excuse you for that!

Marwood doesn't play on the wing or second row does he. He plays at hooker which we have a lot of choce at. He isn't big enough currently to play CC which has nothing to do with ability, he will be playing for Barrow in a few years hopefully but what harm is there having him around other quality players.

Nixon left due to work commitments, being in CC1 will mean he may be able to play due to a less intense training schedule. Gordon didn't think he was good enough for CC so stepped down to ameteur. He'd be easily good enough for the division, I thought he could be good enough at this level.

I've said enough IMO. The clubs stance is clear on DR and we showed on sunday we have enough to beat teams in the division. Let's show our support and help the lads stay up.

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League Express - Mon 10th April 2017

Rugby League World - April 2017