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Pottsy

Dr Koukash on FiveLive

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He recognised the need to invest smartly, which is of course what the previous administration at Salford did not do. But I think he is right about the exemption. We need competitive sides now and if Koukash has the ability and is willing to spend the cash to get Salford competitive quickly then I don't see what the problem is. Other exceptions have been made to the rules: the RFL buying out the lease at Odsal to keep the Bulls afloat, for example, was a case of the governing body doing something for one club that it didn't do for others who were struggling. So giving an exemption on the salary cap to Salford for say one year would not be anything outrageous.

What rule did the RFL break when they bought Odsal?

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He recognised the need to invest smartly, which is of course what the previous administration at Salford did not do. But I think he is right about the exemption. We need competitive sides now and if Koukash has the ability and is willing to spend the cash to get Salford competitive quickly then I don't see what the problem is. Other exceptions have been made to the rules: the RFL buying out the lease at Odsal to keep the Bulls afloat, for example, was a case of the governing body doing something for one club that it didn't do for others who were struggling. So giving an exemption on the salary cap to Salford for say one year would not be anything outrageous.

Right, so you give Salford a cap exemption. Problem solved. Except, where is he going to get these new players from ? You can't buy what isn't for sale.

So far as I am aware all of the game's top players are contracted to other clubs and if they don't want to sell them then his salary cap exemption is worth nothing, apart from perhaps unsettling players at other clubs and creating unrealistic wage demands at contract renegotiation time ("Salford have offered me much more, you need to increase your offer"). It'll be an agent's paradise and will lead to other clubs overpaying for players.

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Its an interesting thought isn't it! It would certainly benefit the competition to go from a big 4 (5?) to a big 6 in one year. That would certainly add value to the competition.

How would be judge who is eligible though is a different matter or should it just be a universal increase in the salary cap. After all a 1/3rd devaluation of the salary cap over 15 years hasn't seemed to help the lower clubs.

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That's easy, just raise the cap for everyone.

The cap is a sound idea, but at its current level, it puts SL at at unfair disadvantage.

Instead of messing around at the edges of it, giving exemptions for long serving players, etc, just raise the bloody thing.

That doesn't mean the RFL can't keep a close eye on spending, sources of finance, etc, but it will give SL a better chnace of competing with Union and the NRL.

What you actually mean is it will give a handful of SL clubs a better chance of competing with RU and NRL.

If you have a club, lets call them Wakefield, who can only afford to spend say £1.1m now when the cap is £1.65m, then how does raising the cap help them in any way at all ? Just because you raise the cap it doesn't mean the clubs can afford to spend any more than they do now, apart from the top 4 or 5. All you're going to end up with is the lower clubs still spending £1.1m and the bigger clubs spending £2m+ thus increasing the gap even further between top and bottom.

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That's easy, just raise the cap for everyone.

The cap is a sound idea, but at its current level, it puts SL at at unfair disadvantage.

Instead of messing around at the edges of it, giving exemptions for long serving players, etc, just raise the bloody thing.

That doesn't mean the RFL can't keep a close eye on spending, sources of finance, etc, but it will give SL a better chnace of competing with Union and the NRL.

There is that and I'm with you to a certain extent on it. But half the SL clubs are struggling financially as it is with the salary cap as it is now increasing it might make more clubs go bust or make a bigger gulf than already is in place between the top and bottom clubs in SL. If this did happen the top 6 clubs would be way ahead of the rest and I know they are ahead now but at least you get the odd competitive game when the bottom half plays the top half at the minute but doing this would IMO make too many one sides games in SL. We already have too many one sides games as it is this would just blow the bottom half of SL away.

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So if we give Salford a salary cap exemption, who's turn is it after that... then who's turn is it after that... and so on... ?

That question applies to all exceptions. The RFL bought the least of Odsal and thus intervened directly in trying to save a club. They didn't do that for the Crusaders or for Wakefield and at the time people said that each case is different. If they can do one thing for one club but not for another already then why can't they make exemptions to the salary cap for one club but not another? As many said on here and elsewhere at the time of the Odsal intervention, each case is different. Salford didn't go into administration, so they didn't get punished, but they were completely scalped of players. Koukash has a solution to that problem which would benefit not only Salford but the game as a whole, by making another team more competitive and avoiding the blow out scores and terrible matches (on the whole) that Salford is producing.

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What you actually mean is it will give a handful of SL clubs a better chance of competing with RU and NRL.

His point about competing with the RU and NRL was in relation to keeping our stars here in the English game so we get to enjoy the players we have produced and benefit from them being part of the game here. A change in salary cap wouldn't stop some from going to Australia or over to Union because people have different reasons for doing things but it might deter some.

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And then halved our sky money for two years.

This salary cap exemption wouldn't work, because if it's temporary it'll have to come down again, so those expensive players who came would leave or everyone takes a pay cut, which defeats the object.

What the RFL could do is allow the salaries of substandard signed on long deals by the old regime to be taken out of the cap.

We also need a marquee player rule as a matter of urgency.

Let's stop tying our hands behind our back as a sport.

If the likes of Koukash and McManus have the funds to bring back the likes of Tomkins, Eastmond and Sa from union and Burgessx4 , Graham and Widdop from the NRL then why not create a system that allows them to do so?

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Just seen on Sky sports that a Mr U Bolt has been asked to race dragging 2 tyres to allow others to win.

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His point about competing with the RU and NRL was in relation to keeping our stars here in the English game so we get to enjoy the players we have produced and benefit from them being part of the game here. A change in salary cap wouldn't stop some from going to Australia or over to Union because people have different reasons for doing things but it might deter some.

I'd rather the NRL paid our players what they are worth and got them tested in an altogether different environment, rather than artificially pay Brits more to stay at home.

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I'd rather the NRL paid our players what they are worth and got them tested in an altogether different environment, rather than artificially pay Brits more to stay at home.

There you are then. Sums up the mentality of rugby league supporters and probably one of the reasons why we are still such a small and inconsequential sport.

I'd much rather we pay our best players what they are worth and have them here, making our own competition that much better.

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What you actually mean is it will give a handful of SL clubs a better chance of competing with RU and NRL.

If you have a club, lets call them Wakefield, who can only afford to spend say £1.1m now when the cap is £1.65m, then how does raising the cap help them in any way at all ? Just because you raise the cap it doesn't mean the clubs can afford to spend any more than they do now, apart from the top 4 or 5. All you're going to end up with is the lower clubs still spending £1.1m and the bigger clubs spending £2m+ thus increasing the gap even further between top and bottom.

*Cough* Two division SL *Cough*

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*Cough* Two division SL *Cough*

To be fair if the Dr is wanting an open salary cap that's the way I see it going if he gets his wish. You then will have Leeds.saints.wigan.wire.hudds.salford and maybe bulls and the 2 hull teams. So that's 9 teams for SL1 in an open salary cap comp but who would be the other team to make it 10? Catalans maybe? Then you can have SL2 with the salary cap it is at now in SL and the team that wins SL2 as the option of going up or not. I think that would work personally and it would make 2 great comps IMO.

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There you are then. Sums up the mentality of rugby league supporters and probably one of the reasons why we are still such a small and inconsequential sport.

I'd much rather we pay our best players what they are worth and have them here, making our own competition that much better.

Spot on

IMHO the salary cap should be scrapped.

It holds out game back, it doesn't produce an even competition and it doesn't stop clubs going bust. I'm struggling to find a use for it.

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To be fair if the Dr is wanting an open salary cap that's the way I see it going if he gets his wish. You then will have Leeds.saints.wigan.wire.hudds.salford and maybe bulls and the 2 hull teams. So that's 9 teams for SL1 in an open salary cap comp but who would be the other team to make it 10? Then you can have SL2 with the salary cap it is at now in SL and the team that wins SL2 as the option of going up or not. I think that would work personally and it would make 2 great comps IMO.

Catalan, Toulouse?

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To be fair if the Dr is wanting an open salary cap that's the way I see it going if he gets his wish. You then will have Leeds.saints.wigan.wire.hudds.salford and maybe bulls and the 2 hull teams. So that's 9 teams for SL1 in an open salary cap comp but who would be the other team to make it 10? Catalans maybe? Then you can have SL2 with the salary cap it is at now in SL and the team that wins SL2 as the option of going up or not. I think that would work personally and it would make 2 great comps IMO.

I don't know what other fans think of this idea but I think it would improve our game no end.

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We also need a marquee player rule as a matter of urgency.

Would you make it the same or different to the one that was introduced a couple of years ago?

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I'd much rather we pay our best players what they are worth and have them here, making our own competition that much better.

But our competition won't be suddenly streets better because a dozen players spread around the league choose not to go union or NRL.

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So the game is losing a fortune as it is with tight financial limits and people want the cap scrapped.

Do people not see what is happening in Football and RU? The losses in those sports is scary - the difference is that they have rich people prepared to support them, when we have clubs going to the wall for a fraction of their debts.

We need to do the best for us, if we lose players elsewhere, fair enough, if we try and compete with the NRL and Union then we will get ourselves into serious trouble.

I'd rather have a club in 20 years when our rich backer may have moved on rather than a basket case of a club.

One thing to remember is that if the SL clubs wanted to scrap the salary cap they'd have done it by now - it looks to me like the rich backers don't want a free market.

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One thing to remember is that if the SL clubs wanted to scrap the salary cap they'd have done it by now - it looks to me like the rich backers don't want a free market.

Why would Leeds, Wigan, Saints, Warrington etc want an increase in the cap ? Its not in their interests - they're the top clubs now and would still be the top clubs under a raised cap. Only now its cheaper for them. There's nothing in it for them - be a top club spending more or a top club spending less, its a no-brainer really.

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So the game is losing a fortune as it is with tight financial limits and people want the cap scrapped.

Do people not see what is happening in Football and RU? The losses in those sports is scary

This.

And clubs have gone to the wall in union - and continue to do so. We may laugh at our friends Manchester but their plight was caused by overspend and then being unable to pay salaries at all.

Lower league soccer - the level we should compare ourselves to most - is awash with reformed clubs.

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Why would Leeds, Wigan, Saints, Warrington etc want an increase in the cap ? Its not in their interests - they're the top clubs now and would still be the top clubs under a raised cap. Only now its cheaper for them. There's nothing in it for them - be a top club spending more or a top club spending less, its a no-brainer really.

Take my club - Moran may have decided that he would have liked the ability to sign James Graham when he went to the NRL. Maybe pick up Eastmond too. Joel Tomkins would have been nice. The salary cap pretty much stops this happening. That's what's in it for them.

The top clubs could put some distance between them and the next group. We would see who is serious about investing in players - transfer fees would be the norm again.

I agree they don't want it, and I think it is because we have attracted a certain kind of investor, people who see the benefits of sensible sustained businesses in SL, that has to be a positive.

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regardless of the salary cap or signing the best players how will koukash get more bums on seats to actually make the club self sufficient?? a 1900 crowd for the visit of hull kr is hardly a crowd to make money for the club..........

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regardless of the salary cap or signing the best players how will koukash get more bums on seats to actually make the club self sufficient?? a 1900 crowd for the visit of hull kr is hardly a crowd to make money for the club..........

It is a worry - there were only 3.7k against Warrington, the crowds were rarely that low at the Willows even when Salford were pants there.

Let's see what happens over the coming months on this front though.

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To be fair if the Dr is wanting an open salary cap that's the way I see it going if he gets his wish. You then will have Leeds.saints.wigan.wire.hudds.salford and maybe bulls and the 2 hull teams. So that's 9 teams for SL1 in an open salary cap comp but who would be the other team to make it 10? Catalans maybe? Then you can have SL2 with the salary cap it is at now in SL and the team that wins SL2 as the option of going up or not. I think that would work personally and it would make 2 great comps IMO.

With most clubs losing money it's difficult to see how they would have the cash to increase their salary cap spend. For example I'm sure I've heard Neil Hudgell on the radio recentley saying that Hull KR would vote for a lower salary cap.

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