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Comparision between our youngsters and southern hemispheres.

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Fair enough! I've always said to mum, with Tomkins at full back, in an average match he'll cost you 1 try, but be involved in at least 3.

 

I've been impressed with Watkins though.

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Stats taken in isolation are fairly meaningless and usually dont prove one thing or the other as there are so many variables involved. The ones on the Super League web site are certainly not ones to go by and are certainly not the same as coaches use. Players play in different teams with different attacking and defensive structures and have to play with either better or worse inside or outside defenders. With stats players also often get blamed for things that arent their fault as coaches will point out in video sessions etc. Also there are times when players dont even play in their position, for instance Goulding had several games last season where he played the majority of the match on the wing and had to swap and change positions due to injuries. You cant just ignore peoples judgment and say that a players is better or not based on stats.

 

Watkins has a lot of potential and is a damn fine player as a strike centre, in some ways a much better and more rounded Ryan Atkins, but he is far from good in all areas and I think that his defensive positioning, handling and decision making all need work. Whether he is good enough for international level yet I dont know but there is no English centre with the complete all round game. Watkins is a young player whose raw ability and talent is clear though and he could be the best English centre for some time if he can progress and develop an all round game. Goulding for me is technically the best English centre and has a very good all round game. He has great hands, good defence, hardly makes any mistakes and his decision making is nearly always spot on. The downside is that he lacks the strike and athleticism of a Watkins or Atkins.

 

As an England fan I think that it is great that we finally have a range of centres to choose from as opposed to just 2 or 3 that we had far over a decade.

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Watkins is a talent and I wouldn't worry about having him in the england team at all. Its havin the likes of ablett, jjb, and chase in the england team tht would worry me. Below average players gettin picked is the worry not young talents who have flair.

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My move? Do you consider your point proven now by the inclusion of some isolated stats?

Watkins = luxury player.

By the way, I am not a Wigan fan.

Who do you follow Franksy, Warrington?

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Who do you follow Franksy, Warrington?

That would be a pretty hilarious conversion.

Welcome aboard, Hannibal.

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the biggests diffence between our youngster and theirs is....its very rare for their kids to hit the NRL before the age of21..they have the holden cup & NSW/QLD cup's as "finishing schools" before hitting the NRL......

where as we don't think twice about sticking a 18,19 year old into super league.....if you look at the england team from

the 2009 4nations..our halfbacks for the NZ game where 20 year old sam tomkins & 19 year old kyle eastmond :lol:

i bet we could name a england under 21's with 3-400 super league appearances between them..yet really struggle to name a

australian under 21's with 100 NRL between them..

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the biggests diffence between our youngster and theirs is....its very rare for their kids to hit the NRL before the age of21..they have the holden cup & NSW/QLD cup's as "finishing schools" before hitting the NRL......

where as we don't think twice about sticking a 18,19 year old into super league.....if you look at the england team from

the 2009 4nations..our halfbacks for the NZ game where 20 year old sam tomkins & 19 year old kyle eastmond :lol:

i bet we could name a england under 21's with 3-400 super league appearances between them..yet really struggle to name a

australian under 21's with 100 NRL between them..

TBF, the games are harder to come by over there. The 100 game mark normally comes in your mid 20s!

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i mean 100 games for the whole of the aussie under 21s..as a team....not 100 games per player

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The cream of the crop come into the NRL at a young age just like any sport

The team from the 2012 Trans Tasman Test below

Age into the NRL

Slater 19 (Capped at 24)

Boyd 18 (Capped at 20)

Inglis 18 (Capped at 19)

J Morris 20 (Capped at 22)

B Morris 19 (Capped at 22)

Thurston 18 (Capped at 22)

Cronk 20 (Capped at 23)

Scott 18 (Capped at 24)

Smith 18 (Capped at 22)

Tamou 20 (Capped at 23)

Bird 17 (Capped at 22)

Gallen 18 (Capped at 26)

Myles 19 (Capped at 24)

Reserves

Farrah 19 (Capped at 25)

Hoffman 19 (Capped at 23)

Shillington 22(Capped at 25) Edited

Williams 19 (Capped at 19)

Then you have had players like..

Lockyer (Capped at 20 )

Fittler (Capped at 20)

Lyon (Capped at 19)

There are many more, the best players shine through at a young age, not many break into the big time past their

mid twenties.

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yeah that the bloody test team mate.....the majority of the NRL players don't get regular NRL games till they are 21/22

look at jacob miller at wests...made his debut aged 18 a couple of seasons ago,was selected as a starting halfback this season aged 20....but was sent back to the NSW cup this week with west assistant coach saying..

he hoped Miller would come back stronger for the experience in the feeder system.

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yeah that the bloody test team mate.....the majority of the NRL players don't get regular NRL games till they are 21/22

look at jacob miller at wests...made his debut aged 18 a couple of seasons ago,was selected as a starting halfback this season aged 20....but was sent back to the NSW cup this week with west assistant coach saying..

If they are good enough they will get a run in the NRL.

Its not likely that a younger player will take a better NRL players spot is it.

You have to earn your place in any Sport.

Plenty of players get dropped to the lower comps (even top end players) if they are not performing at the top Grade, that's just natural.

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Is that right about Shillo's debut, Andy?

Shillo himself has come out this week saying he made his debut at 22, as teammate Jarrod Croker plays his 100th game in a few mins at the same age.

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Is that right about Shillo's debut, Andy?

Shillo himself has come out this week saying he made his debut at 22, as teammate Jarrod Croker plays his 100th game in a few mins at the same age.

I only broke it down by whole years CGD. (too lazy to do it by months)

Shillingtons first game was Aug 7th 2005 for the Roosters and he was born 24 June 1983 so you are correct 22 years of age.

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I was just being pedantic so I could mention Croker's milestone at such a young age.

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Another try for George Burgess today - I don't think the Kiwis or Aussies have a young forward as good as him.

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Another try for George Burgess today - I don't think the Kiwis or Aussies have a young forward as good as him.

Pretty hard to be the best around after 3 or 4 games though Big Gun.

You need a bit more under your belt first I believe.

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