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12/04/13 - St Helens v Catalan Dragons - KO 8pm (Sky Sports)

Who will win?   12 members have voted

  1. 1. Who will win?

    • St Helens
      5
    • Catalan Dragons
      5
    • Draw
      2

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77 posts in this topic

Exactly how many players have saints got out injured, are they counting long Scunthorpe and Kevin iro as injured I was sick of hearing about it! Catalans have injury problems too and it was a good game.

Walmsley looks immense and remi casty is unbelievable

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Think I'd take Casty over both of them on that performance!

 

Casty is a beast to be fair

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Anyone else think Nathan Brown should be planning a trip to Red hall next week after he referred to Phil Bentham as 'the dumbo in the middle' in his post match interview on Sky?

 

There was also a nice example of pot calling the kettle black when he criticised the Cats of being coached to slow the game down.  :O  This from the bloke who had is players at the Giants 'lying on' so long they deserved tucking up with a pillow and a blanket to make them feel right at home.  :dry:

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Especially as Saints were and are past masters of slowing the game.

But yes he should be carpeted for it

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Very different catalans team in terms of attitude last night fro the hull game, good game enjoyed it

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Gerri Monside, on 12 Apr 2013 - 22:10, said:

Agreed. My enjoyment of the game improved out of all proportion when I disconnected the sound from the live stream.....

it wasn't just me then, I thought my Wigan bias against Saints had got the better of me.

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Anyone else think Nathan Brown should be planning a trip to Red hall next week after he referred to Phil Bentham as 'the dumbo in the middle' in his post match interview on Sky?

 

There was also a nice example of pot calling the kettle black when he criticised the Cats of being coached to slow the game down.  :O  This from the bloke who had is players at the Giants 'lying on' so long they deserved tucking up with a pillow and a blanket to make them feel right at home.  :dry:

Personally I hope he does.  I hate it when coaches blame the ref for their poor coaching/poor team performance (and in this instance I think it was a mixture of both).  It looks weak and pathetic.  I've yet to be convinced by Brown.  He hasn't zapped up our team with the same backs against the wall attitude we showed in 2011 when we had a worse injury crisis.

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Caught the last 20 minutes of the Sky coverage, I really do wish Clarke would give it a rest at times. Someone needs to tell him that sometimes less is definitely more.

 

Other than the BBC SL show highlights, this is the first time I have seen Saints this season. Of course the injuries to the likes of Roby and Lomax will have an impact and the imbalanced squad doesn't help (neither LMS or Laffranchi are props for me, the half back mess continues). Overall I thought they (Saints) were poor and devoid of any real attacking nouse, and seemed to have continued the one out rugby from last season. Only Sia and the Bulldog showed any kind of spirit and go forward.

 

Comparing Saints to Wigan, Wire and Leeds one thing stands out for me and that is how much better conditioned those three teams seem to be compared to Saints. I know that Bath were very critical of the medical/ conditioning treatment that Eastmond had at Saints and I think this is something the club needs to look at.

 

As for Brown, well he seems to have had an up and down record at Huddersfield and I suspect it will be the same at Saints. It is however interesting to read some of the comments coming out of Huddersfield this season about how different and better the team is being run in 2013 and how much this is a reflection on how Brown was doing things there.

 

Oh, and what has happened to the Saints pitch. I know they had many years to get the pitch at the old girl (Knowsley Rd) just right but Langtree looks a mess. 

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Caught the last 20 minutes of the Sky coverage, I really do wish Clarke would give it a rest at times. Someone needs to tell him that sometimes less is definitely more.

Other than the BBC SL show highlights, this is the first time I have seen Saints this season. Of course the injuries to the likes of Roby and Lomax will have an impact and the imbalanced squad doesn't help (neither LMS or Laffranchi are props for me, the half back mess continues). Overall I thought they (Saints) were poor and devoid of any real attacking nouse, and seemed to have continued the one out rugby from last season. Only Sia and the Bulldog showed any kind of spirit and go forward.

Comparing Saints to Wigan, Wire and Leeds one thing stands out for me and that is how much better conditioned those three teams seem to be compared to Saints. I know that Bath were very critical of the medical/ conditioning treatment that Eastmond had at Saints and I think this is something the club needs to look at.

As for Brown, well he seems to have had an up and down record at Huddersfield and I suspect it will be the same at Saints. It is however interesting to read some of the comments coming out of Huddersfield this season about how different and better the team is being run in 2013 and how much this is a reflection on how Brown was doing things there.

Oh, and what has happened to the Saints pitch. I know they had many years to get the pitch at the old girl (Knowsley Rd) just right but Langtree looks a mess.

Agree with most of that. As for the pitch they had KR pretty much to themselves apart from a few St Helen's town games. LP has been well used recently. In the last few weeks they had Liverpool under 18s who use it regularly a woman's FA cup semi final and the recent Blackbrook CC game. They are just the games I know about there could be others.

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Agree with most of that. As for the pitch they had KR pretty much to themselves apart from a few St Helen's town games. LP has been well used recently. In the last few weeks they had Liverpool under 18s who use it regularly a woman's FA cup semi final and the recent Blackbrook CC game. They are just the games I know about there could be others.

 

So it is the football making a mess of the rugby pitch? Makes a nice change for it to be that way round!

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So it is the football making a mess of the rugby pitch? Makes a nice change for it to be that way round!

The excuse/reason I was given was the weather.

 

I think the last soccer match to be played on the pitch was during the first week of the rugby season.  It was an under 21s match.  Other than that there have been under 19s played.  But personally it wouldn't surprise me if it simply hasn't been maintained correctly.  It is a complex and expensive pitch and I remember reading at the time of its construction on the website of the company which constructed it that it required detailed and quite expensive maintenance to keep it in fine fettle.  It looks like a vegetable patch.

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What is interesting is the comments of ex-giants players who left after last season, saying they had stopped enjoying the game under Brown

End of last season our poor showing could be very much put down to having a team held together with strapping - too many players busted all season actually

This season as a Giants fan, yes there is an element of waiting to see if it goes belly up again, after losing to Salford and Wire I though it might have, but they bounced back quickly, and have shown they can close out tight games and there seems to be a better sense of determination from them too

Still, lets see at the end if May lol

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Caught the last 20 minutes of the Sky coverage, I really do wish Clarke would give it a rest at times. Someone needs to tell him that sometimes less is definitely more.

 

Clarke is the least of my worries when it come to Sky's coverage.

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For me, the Saints are playing predictable rugby league and lacking imagination. Injuries have to be accepted as part and parcel of the sport and not made an excuse. Great sides overcome injuries. Twice in the second-half a Saints player got tackled on the sixth tackle count whilst near to the sticks. A grubber kick should have been executed to keep the pressure on. Cats played well and good luck to them. 

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The excuse/reason I was given was the weather.

 

I think the last soccer match to be played on the pitch was during the first week of the rugby season.  It was an under 21s match.  Other than that there have been under 19s played.  But personally it wouldn't surprise me if it simply hasn't been maintained correctly.  It is a complex and expensive pitch and I remember reading at the time of its construction on the website of the company which constructed it that it required detailed and quite expensive maintenance to keep it in fine fettle.  It looks like a vegetable patch.

 

This is a pretty good article about the Langtree Park pitch and the fact that it is a hi-spec pitch requiring completely different maintenance to the old Knowsley Rd pitch and raises issues as to whether or not the club will know how to look after the fibresand construction. It specifically makes reference of the significant maintenance costs, and it would not surprise if as you say the club have not been looking after it for whatever reason.

 

http://www.pitchcare.com/magazine/new-stadium-for-st-helens-rugby-league-club.html

 

I know the weather has been dire, but as you say it does look a vegetable patch and very poor for something so new. 

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It looks to me as if Saints could struggle for a while before things get much better. I can't see any improvement in them from Brown's coaching - if anything their old problems have remained and new ones have been introduced. Their backs are nothing special, they have some average forwards and they seem to have no clue as to who to play where in their spine.

I think that you could put together a very good pack from Roby - TP - Meli - Walmsley - Clough (or alternative hard worker) - and another prop, with one of Wilkin or Flannagan interchanging, but I cannot see how you turn that back line into one to match the top 4 (plus any injuries to those forwards leaves mediocre players in their place).

In retrospect Rush and KC did a terrific job to get them as far as he did.

How things change - didn't someone predict Saints for top and Wigan to miss out on the 8?

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It looks to me as if Saints could struggle for a while before things get much better. I can't see any improvement in them from Brown's coaching - if anything their old problems have remained and new ones have been introduced. Their backs are nothing special, they have some average forwards and they seem to have no clue as to who to play where in their spine.

I think that you could put together a very good pack from Roby - TP - Meli - Walmsley - Clough (or alternative hard worker) - and another prop, with one of Wilkin or Flannagan interchanging, but I cannot see how you turn that back line into one to match the top 4 (plus any injuries to those forwards leaves mediocre players in their place).

In retrospect Rush and KC did a terrific job to get them as far as he did.

How things change - didn't someone predict Saints for top and Wigan to miss out on the 8?

 

I would say that the backline is the least of our problems at present.  It seems very harsh to class young talents such as Percival and Swift as 'nothing special' when they've both had limited game time in which they've shown promising signs.  Makinson is also still raw and you could possibly say the same about Turner (who's actually proved to be a decent acquisition).  If these players can kick on (and I know it's always a big if) then the future of our backline may well be rosy.  For now Meli remains one of the best finishers in the league and Gardner brings experience and a steadying influence, so while we don't have the best backline in the league it's not in too bad a place at the moment and has plenty of future potential.

 

The halves are by far the main issue but the pack also needs a fair amount of work, and with the players likely to leave come the season's end we should have the cap space to do it.  Time will tell.

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This is a pretty good article about the Langtree Park pitch and the fact that it is a hi-spec pitch requiring completely different maintenance to the old Knowsley Rd pitch and raises issues as to whether or not the club will know how to look after the fibresand construction. It specifically makes reference of the significant maintenance costs, and it would not surprise if as you say the club have not been looking after it for whatever reason.

 

http://www.pitchcare.com/magazine/new-stadium-for-st-helens-rugby-league-club.html

 

I know the weather has been dire, but as you say it does look a vegetable patch and very poor for something so new. 

That was the article I remembered reading last year.

 

Seems that the club were not prepared to pay the £25,000 in fungicides, etc to maintain it properly!

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It looks to me as if Saints could struggle for a while before things get much better. I can't see any improvement in them from Brown's coaching - if anything their old problems have remained and new ones have been introduced. Their backs are nothing special, they have some average forwards and they seem to have no clue as to who to play where in their spine.

I think that you could put together a very good pack from Roby - TP - Meli - Walmsley - Clough (or alternative hard worker) - and another prop, with one of Wilkin or Flannagan interchanging, but I cannot see how you turn that back line into one to match the top 4 (plus any injuries to those forwards leaves mediocre players in their place).

In retrospect Rush and KC did a terrific job to get them as far as he did.

How things change - didn't someone predict Saints for top and Wigan to miss out on the 8?

Rush was as successful as he was last year in part because he got Saints playing the most boring brand of rugby I remember watching them play.  I gave up watching Saints when the Olympics and Paralympics were on because I was that bored at matches.  It was sleep inducing stuff. 

 

Saints have suffered in part from a lack of forward planning, letting all our halfbacks go (even to the point of packing the last one standing off to Salford) and not recruiting sufficient props, then trying to fit square pegs in round holes now that it has all gone pear shaped.

 

But aside from all that, what disappoints me most this year about Saints as a Saints fan is their lack of enthusiasm on the pitch.  I remember 2011 when we had a much worse injury crisis but back then we developed a real backs to the wall mentality that saw us fight back in every game and play until the last second but then in those days we still had James Graham in the team and he was our last leader.  Nobody is either willing or able to take on the mantle of leader now. 

 

In addition, I've yet to even starting being convinced about Brown's coaching ability.

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A lack of enthusiasm was evident against Catalan. 

 

Rush was as successful as he was last year in part because he got Saints playing the most boring brand of rugby I remember watching them play.  I gave up watching Saints when the Olympics and Paralympics were on because I was that bored at matches.  It was sleep inducing stuff. 

 

Saints have suffered in part from a lack of forward planning, letting all our halfbacks go (even to the point of packing the last one standing off to Salford) and not recruiting sufficient props, then trying to fit square pegs in round holes now that it has all gone pear shaped.

 

But aside from all that, what disappoints me most this year about Saints as a Saints fan is their lack of enthusiasm on the pitch.  I remember 2011 when we had a much worse injury crisis but back then we developed a real backs to the wall mentality that saw us fight back in every game and play until the last second but then in those days we still had James Graham in the team and he was our last leader.  Nobody is either willing or able to take on the mantle of leader now. 

 

In addition, I've yet to even starting being convinced about Brown's coaching ability.

 

A lack of enthusiasm was evident against Catalan, bordering on the boring at times. 

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A lack of enthusiasm was evident against Catalan, bordering on the boring at times. 

Totally agree.  We haven't been the most enthusiastic of sides all season but it has gotten worse lately and frankly I'm getting tired of it.  I don't mind us being a mid table team (which at present we are) but I want us to be a mid table team with enthusiasm and fire in the belly!  Not a bunch of limp wrists (bar the same old few who turn up each and every game).

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Anyone else think Nathan Brown should be planning a trip to Red hall next week after he referred to Phil Bentham as 'the dumbo in the middle' in his post match interview on Sky?

 

Seems to be the done thing this year; first Betts, then McDermott and now Brown.

 

(What I found interesting was Cummins said at the forum last night he hasn't even phoned the RFL regarding refs)

 

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Anyone else think Nathan Brown should be planning a trip to Red hall next week after he referred to Phil Bentham as 'the dumbo in the middle' in his post match interview on Sky?

Let's hope so.

 

If he really did say that then that's outrageous.

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Let's hope so.

 

If he really did say that then that's outrageous.

 

Believe me, he said it.

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