Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

goldcoaster

More English players off to NRL

51 posts in this topic

Jacksy, the downside is that our game, the ESL is being asset stripped. Your assertion would be true if the juniors coming through are already as good as the players going to the NRL. Since the juniors coming through will require at least a few seasons to be as good (if they can be), there will be a drop in quality for the whole league. If (looking like when) Tomkins goes he is a player who is irreplaceable in our league. His standard of player comes through every 20 years or so. If you take out the highest quality players, the average must drop.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think they got a lot more attention post RUWC 2003

yes, and they milked it better than we could have done in a similar situation. Still, the biggest sport in the country doesn't have a successful national team. For me that speaks volumes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So why are they taking more of our players than ever before?

By the way, your assertion that Australia's 5th team could beat England is ridiculous.

Probably for the same reason they sign kiwis, also I didn't say Australia's 5th team could beat England but "give us a run for our money."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jacksy, the downside is that our game, the ESL is being asset stripped. Your assertion would be true if the juniors coming through are already as good as the players going to the NRL. Since the juniors coming through will require at least a few seasons to be as good (if they can be), there will be a drop in quality for the whole league. If (looking like when) Tomkins goes he is a player who is irreplaceable in our league. His standard of player comes through every 20 years or so. If you take out the highest quality players, the average must drop.

The aussies were assett stripped by all and sundry for donkeys years. There game did not suffer and the quality did not go down. How did they manage that? quality coaching, quality tactics, good management and being media savvy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The aussies were assett stripped by all and sundry for donkeys years. There game did not suffer and the quality did not go down. How did they manage that? quality coaching, quality tactics, good management and being media savvy

They managed that for several reasons:

1) They have a larger pool of talent to select from (lets be honest its a bigger game out there)

2) The players who came over were largely past their prime. There are a few exceptions to this, but not many.

3) The Aussies have a far better youth structure in general and are more patient in bringing the youth through. But when the chance does arise they are more likely to trust the youngsters (in the modern era Leeds and more recently Wigan seem to be getting the hang of this point with Warrington and Saints also seeming to start catching on). How many aussie clubs would go out and panic but an average journeyman?

For me those are the three main reasons, although there are others.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry to nit pick on that but if you're having an Aus 5th team you have to have 10 players in the wing, centre, and half back position not 1. At that level... we'd probably compete.

I didn't have time to think of ten of each. You'd find 10 centres and half backs. You'd find five hookers. Probably struggle on wingers though and maybe ten props. Second Rowers they're very strong in aswell.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let's not get too carried away, it's not as if Tansey, Mathers, Thorman and Worrincy came back any better. One trip down under a world beater does not make.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They managed that for several reasons:

1) They have a larger pool of talent to select from (lets be honest its a bigger game out there)

     no arguments there, except that we have the whole of Great Britain

2) The players who came over were largely past their prime. There are a few exceptions to this, but not many.

     I do not agree with that, i am sure every team within SL had many Oz/Kiwi players in their prime within their team. That is not including those that went to Union or AFL. 

3) The Aussies have a far better youth structure in general and are more patient in bringing the youth through. But when the chance does arise they are more likely to trust the youngsters (in the modern era Leeds and more recently Wigan seem to be getting the hang of this point with Warrington and Saints also seeming to start catching on). How many aussie clubs would go out and panic but an average journeyman?

Our youth structure has been there for (David Waite era) years but clubs like mine, chose not to give kids a chance at all. Now look at FC and the lads that have played this year, not one of them has looked out of place. In fact some look bloody marvellous

For me those are the three main reasons, although there are others.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What era are you referring to when you say  Aussiesa   ewhere past their prime?It was stated that we assett stripped them for donkeys years not the 80s or 90s.

They managed that for several reasons:
1) They have a larger pool of talent to select from (lets be honest its a bigger game out there)
2) The players who came over were largely past their prime. There are a few exceptions to this, but not many.
3) The Aussies have a far better youth structure in general and are more patient in bringing the youth through. But when the chance does arise they are more likely to trust the youngsters (in the modern era Leeds and more recently Wigan seem to be getting the hang of this point with Warrington and Saints also seeming to start catching on). How many aussie clubs would go out and panic but an average journeyman?

For me those are the three main reasons, although there are others.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jacksy,

so basically we agree on 2 out of 3 point (you say the whole of Great Britain, but being a minor sport thats a tad naive).

I still think very few of the real aussie stars came over in their prime. Johns and Langer did spells when they were past it, Miles at Wigan in the twilight of his career. Kenny and Sterlo from the generation before I'll grant you but they played in the UK in the Aussie off season.

Wouldn't do if we agreed on everything though would it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What era are you referring to when you say  Aussiesa   ewhere past their prime?It was stated that we assett stripped them for donkeys years not the 80s or 90s.

I thought we were talking about whilst the standards of the sport were massively different. For that those era's are the main ones. (some argument for the 70's but less so)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

pre war and post war up to the early early 60s we took lots of the top players from the financially weaker Aussie leagues.That is why they imposed a transfer ban on us taking their players

I thought we were talking about whilst the standards of the sport were massively different. For that those era's are the main ones. (some argument for the 70's but less so)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

pre war and post war up to the early early 60s we took lots of the top players from the financially weaker Aussie leagues.That is why they imposed a transfer ban on us taking their players

and in essence stopped the asset stripping I was talking about!

That option isn't open to us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jacksy,

so basically we agree on 2 out of 3 point (you say the whole of Great Britain, but being a minor sport thats a tad naive).

I still think very few of the real aussie stars came over in their prime. Johns and Langer did spells when they were past it, Miles at Wigan in the twilight of his career. Kenny and Sterlo from the generation before I'll grant you but they played in the UK in the Aussie off season.

Wouldn't do if we agreed on everything though would it?

No it would  not :)  I was not just talking about SL stripping them of players though..Lyon/Barrett/Gidley etc... i was also talking about AFL and Union taking there players too..Folau,Hunt,SBW etc. If we sat down and made a list. I am pretty sure the vast majority of overseas SL signings would not have been has beens.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No it would  not :)  I was not just talking about SL stripping them of players though..Lyon/Barrett/Gidley etc... i was also talking about AFL and Union taking there players too..Folau,Hunt,SBW etc. If we sat down and made a list. I am pretty sure the vast majority of overseas SL signings would not have been has beens.

I'm also quite sure that the SL signings that weren't by and large were not the best (Lyon I'll grant you but he had well documented problems and was a deemed a big risk, Barrett and Gidley to a slightly lesser extent) players in their generation. Had Warrington for example signed Alfi in his prime, that would have been different.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wigan's Dom Crosby, Sheffield's Colton Roche and Dewsbury's Tom Lillycrop all reported to be off to NRL clubs in 2014 according to the Aussie press. I've seen Crosby play, but are the other 2 good players?

lillycrop has the potential to be a great prop not very tall but short and stocky with a good engine and hits the line hard. Roche has done ok when I've seen him in his first real season of first team rugby with Sheffield couldnt see him getting sl first team never mind nrl for a couple of years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I expect more and more to be off (Top players) i also suspect that unless there is a 10 team SL that is able to attract some of the best talent SKY will pull the plug next time round (Not taking the WC is an obvious sign that interest in RL in the UK is waning) I also expect FOX (Australia) to lower their coverage of RU over the next few years.

CM

Well, in my experience, you're never far out CM. My money's on you

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why are NRL clubs pillaging England for players? Because they are quality talents who can help NRL clubs get that vital edge. If NRL clubs are recruiting Fijians and South Africans who have never seen a game of RL (purely on potential), then a RL-trained English player is a great recruitment prospect.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe NRL clubs rate the quality of talent in SL a little higher than the NRL centric fans and zealots that are constantly putting the British game down.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In terms of Crosby specifically, I'd be surprised if he's going to the NRL - Wigan itself is a distant land to most Leythers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no it is not

and in essence stopped the asset stripping I was talking about!

That option isn't open to us.

 

 

Maybe NRL clubs rate the quality of talent in SL a little higher than the NRL centric fans and zealots that are constantly putting the British game down.

this one

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So why are they taking more of our players than ever before?

By the way, your assertion that Australia's 5th team could beat England is ridiculous.

 

Why not? Your line of reasoning doesn't make any sense. Just because the NRL can afford to sign English players, English players good enough for the NRL, doesn't mean that the NRL isn't a superior competition which produces superior players.

 

America produces the best American football players, but they're not averse to picking up non-Americans.

 

I'm sure there's a couple of Nigerians playing in the English Premier League, but is there any doubts that the English Premier League is head and shoulders above whatever top level football competition they have in Nigeria?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If this exodus grows it could be the end of dual registration.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So how many English players will be playing in the NRL next season so far then?

Souths: Burgess x 4

St George: Widdop

Parramatta: Hock & Mossop

Brisbane: Reid

Canterbury: Graham

Cowboys: Moore

How many have I missed?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Russell at Gold Coast Titans. Heighington technically.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



Rugby League World - June 2017

League Express - Mon 17th July 2017