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gingerjon

Farage poles the electorate

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Well, it's start. Scottish ethnicity? In 2013?

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In the shire county results in so far Ukip have as many councillors as Labour.

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The "problem" of EU bureaucracy is not the number of people working in Brussels. It's the requirement to comply with EU law. I am personally very familiar with EU law on public sector procurement - the famous "OJEU" regulations.

And the problem there is not actually the regulations - it's the way people apply them. Like H&S, the issue is over-officious idiots wilfully misinterpreting the rules to make themselves feel important. The actual rules are pretty sensible and helpful.

If you took the rules away, you'd still be left with the idiots.

yes.

 

I believe its called " gold plating" where perfectly sensible and proportionate EU directives, regs etc are implemented in the UK with an added layer of complexity, strictness and " stupidity."  In the days before the Official Journal, the CCTA used to procure IT systems on behalf of govt departments. Trust me, the OJ rules as it were , are infinitely preferable!

 

It seems, though, that UK govts of any leaning are ineffective in getting the machinery of govt to stop gold plating.

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yes.

 

I believe its called " gold plating" where perfectly sensible and proportionate EU directives, regs etc are implemented in the UK with an added layer of complexity, strictness and " stupidity."

 

It seems, though, that UK govts of any leaning are ineffective in getting the machinery of govt to stop gold plating.

 

 

That is (or more fairly was)  the Environment Agency writ large.

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It is quite interesting to note that, on the morning news reports that I saw, not one big-hitter from the Tory, Labour or LibDems had been delegated to comment on the results, or more specifically the UKIP performance.

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The Raving Looney Party have done well in these elections...

 

 

 

 

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...not so good for the Monster Raving Looney Party, though.  ;)

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I wonder....does the team think that some of the more right wing Little Englander MPs will be persuaded to join UKIP.  I do hope so.  I would hate to see the Tories  surrender the centre just to placate its right wing. 

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I wonder....does the team think that some of the more right wing Little Englander MPs will be persuaded to join UKIP.  I do hope so.  I would hate to see the Tories  surrender the centre just to placate its right wing. 

 

 

I think Cameron and co are doubly worried about losing MP's and sponsors to UKIP.

 

It doesn't help that the great majority of his his cabinet and entourage can be conveniently characterised as public school/Oxbridge/Millionaire/trust fund/male/arrogant tw@s who would have no idea what the price of a bottle of milk is.

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none better, eh? He's certainly  sussed Ed Balls!   

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I do indeed.  Bucks County Council is up every four years.

 

The ward has changed slightly since 2009 but broadly back then the Tories got 57%, Lib Dems got 20%, Ukip 15%, Labour & independents the rest.  Turnout was 44%.  We have candidates from the Tories, Lib Dems, Ukip and Labour this time round.  It would take a massive stay-at-home or swing from the Tories to Ukip to make much of a difference here.

 

Across Bucks as a whole last time the Tories won 46 seats, Lib Dems 11, everyone else 0.  The Tories got just shy of 50% of the vote, Lib Dems 29%, Ukip 14% (40% turnout).  County-wide there could be places where a Tory 'protest' vote to Ukip might have an impact but only if the Lib Dem vote turns out (which I suspect it won't) or in the odd places where Labour has an outside chance.

 

Turnout across the county now down to 30%.  Tories 36 (41%), UKIP 6 (27%), Lib Dems 5 (14%), Labour 1 (12%), Independent 1.

 

In my ward, turnout at 29%.  Tories 46%, UKIP 37%, Labour 9%, Lib Dems 8%.

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The Lib/Dems have taken Malton from the Conservatives. 39% against 32% on a turnout of 31%. Not often that I back a winner. :lol:

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about the only MP with any decency left in the commons is Dennis Skinner (I am not a socialist) however at least he is one who sticks up for his principals

.

CM

Like trying to sabotage a funeral recently? Not my sort of role model

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WELL DONE UKIP a vote for common sense and the working man:))))

A vote for the party that dares talk about some of the awkward subjects the others skirt around

At least this may open up a few debates about subjects that dare not speak their name, but which 25% of normal people are concerned about

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That's the problem with giving people the vote. They can't be trusted to vote the way they should. Its good to see Farage making everyone squirm: his comments about the elite, the professional politicians and the Westminster village have a resonance with many.   Labour have signally failed to win back the number of seats they lost during Blairs regime, the Conservatives have lost loads, the Lib Dems are still bigger than UKIP, the Greens have a few seats I think and UKIP have loads of seats, so it seems everyone has won lost won lost won lost

 

In our nearest town Boston, UKIP have won 5 out of the 7 county council seats.  Boston has a high number of East European immigrants - something like 15% or more of the population. The locals don't like them, this and the previous govt has not allocated any more resource to Boston  to cope with the influx, there is alleged to be a significant problem with drinking etc and so on and so on.

 

BUT: Boston has a low educational attainment and it is this ignorance that has created the opportunity for UKIP to thrive, winning vote from Labour as well as Tory. It is said that there is nothing so reactionary as the Labour working man..  The key issues seem to be East European immigration, the perceived  damage that the CAP has done to agriculture and the issue of gay marriage.   

 

Of course, Boston already had problems - its slated as lazytown,  incomes are low,  the locals don't like outsiders of any sort,  there was a BBC TV prog that tried to persuade the locals that a 15 minute walk to school was better than a 30 mins car dive from the same point to point..and failed!!  They'd rather it in their cars in a traffic jam than walk!!

 

The fact is that the Poles, Lithuanians etc who have come here have got proper jobs, pay tax and council tax, and spend their money in the shops here. It is a fact though that the govt has not increased the support grant to match the population rise so schools are under pressure.

 

The fact that voting UKIP will not change anything in Lincs County Council seems to have slipped by the locals.

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WELL DONE UKIP a vote for common sense and the working man:))))

I am far from being a socialist but I have to draw the line at this. What do UKIP promise "the working man"?

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I am far from being a socialist but I have to draw the line at this. What do UKIP promise "the working man"?

A pint for those in the south. And, in the north, the grand total of 2 councillors.

The results, away from the media glare:

By %: Labour 29; Conservative 25; Ukip 23; Lib Dem 14

By seats: Conservative 1136; Labour 538; Lib Dem 353; Independents 165; Ukip 147

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WELL DONE UKIP a vote for common sense and the working man:))))

Let the French be french

Krauts be krauts

And stuff the champagne socialists of Brussels

We will still buy french wine and take our holidays there, and buy nazi cars so don,t worry be happy:))))

CM

Krauts, Nazis. You're stuck in the wrong century mate.

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  Agreed...but that won't persuade UKIP voters of the error of their ways.  Telling UKIP voters that they are just plain wrong about immigration, the EU, gay marriage and the political establishment  will not win them over. More likely it will just harden their attitudes.

 

One thing I missed off my previous post. I think round here at least, the govts inability to  deport Abu  Qaatada is also an issue, and indeed There is considerable intolerance of the freedom that seems to be given to extreme Islam. It doesn't matter if it is true or not. Its the perception that counts.

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  Agreed...but that won't persuade UKIP voters of the error of their ways.  Telling UKIP voters that they are just plain wrong about immigration, the EU, gay marriage and the political establishment  will not win them over. More likely it will just harden their attitudes.

 

One thing I missed off my previous post. I think round here at least, the govts inability to  deport Abu  Qaatada is also an issue, and indeed There is considerable intolerance of the freedom that seems to be given to extreme Islam. It doesn't matter if it is true or not. Its the perception that counts.

How is that the fault of the EU which is the target of the Kippers?

 

That is the fault of Winston Churchill's ECHR. nothing to do with the EU.

 

That is beyond the average Sun reader, however.I hope you understand that. 

  Agreed...but that won't persuade UKIP voters of the error of their ways.  Telling UKIP voters that they are just plain wrong about immigration, the EU, gay marriage and the political establishment  will not win them over. More likely it will just harden their attitudes.

 

One thing I missed off my previous post. I think round here at least, the govts inability to  deport Abu  Qaatada is also an issue, and indeed There is considerable intolerance of the freedom that seems to be given to extreme Islam. It doesn't matter if it is true or not. Its the perception that counts.

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Telling UKIP voters that they are just plain wrong about immigration, the EU, gay marriage and the political establishment  will not win them over. More likely it will just harden their attitudes.

They don't need to be won over. They just came third in the shires.

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How is that the fault of the EU which is the target of the Kippers?

 

That is the fault of Winston Churchill's ECHR. nothing to do with the EU.

 

That is beyond the average Sun reader, however.I hope you understand that. 

 

You might be missing my point, though.  Clearly we are bound by agreements, treaties, etc.  and the rule of law...and we are ALL law abiding in everything we do, are we not?

 

The whole thing is about perceptions, not reality, and that is the problem  Trying to explain the ECRH and the HRA etc to many UKIP voters  and others  will be pointless if those voters have decided in their own minds that we should deport Aba Qatada  regardless. 

 

Perception is also the issue in Ginge's argument, too. The percentages are irrelevant, the share is irrelevant. If you live in Boston in Lincolnshire you will be under the impression that UKIP is the dominant party. The media coverage that Farrage has had will  reinforce that opinion. Clearly Ginge is right with his percentages and no doubt that at election time  snafu will apply.

 

However. the daily circulation of the Sun and the Mail combined is around 5  or 6 million and the readership is almost double that.  It may not suit everyone, but the value of a Sun readers vote or a Mail readers vote is exactly the same as your vote, no matter how intellectually superior you regard yourself.

 

Thus the challenge for the established political elite of the Westminster village is to get their point across effectively. They won't do that just by calling the voters names or merely telling them they are plain wrong.

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Thus the challenge for the established political elite of the Westminster village is to get their point across effectively. They won't do that just by calling the voters names or merely telling them they are plain wrong.

Two little facts doing the rounds: Ukip didn't take a single seat from Labour & Labour now has control of more councils than at any point since 2002.

Oh, and Labour already have a consistent polling % that would give them a majority in the next general election.

I've no love for Labour but it seems the 'Westminster elite' that they represent can just let Ukip get on with it.

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