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The Daddy

Bringing back promotion and relegation will set the sport back in this country several years

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We seem to have a lot of people who spend too little time in the real world. The general public want p&r, it's part of the culture in the UK, in the same way it isn't in Australia or USA. That's the same GP you have to attract to the product to replace the ones walking away.

Global sport changed with the income from Tv, compArisons before and after are silly, what is relevant is how we have done against our primary competitors, soccer and RU in that time- anyone thinking well needs their head examined, we have gone backward at pace, yet both have retained p&r

It isn't a question of wanting it: although by saying that you touch an important element of this dreary debate. It is possible to want p and r but consider it inappropriate because of the circumstances the sport finds itself in. So many people, who by the way are members if the public like anyone else, say that it is not appropriate and invariably give detailed information why qv. even though they wish it were feasible. On the other hand you have people who want p and r because it suits them. It's what they want and nothing else will do no matter what. I find this attitude self serving and small minded.

Do you seriously believe that rugby league is or ever was a 'competitor' of soccer: the most widespread, popular and wealthiest sport in the world? For crying out loud.

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Where are we going to get all these new Fulltime players from for SL2 or will it be a mix of FT/PT players?

1/ Part timers stepping up to full time

2/ Young already-pro lads at existing SL clubs

3/ Young academy lads outside SL

4/ RU (my own club Leigh used to recruit many a good either well known or unknown RU player. I think this is now more attractive since RU went pro).

5/ Local amateur setups (ours is one of the best in the country)

6/ pro's already at clubs which have oversized squads ( i.e. those clubs hoarding players and gben shipping them out to the Championship

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It isn't a question of wanting it: although by saying that you touch an important element of this dreary debate. It is possible to want p and r but consider it inappropriate because of the circumstances the sport finds itself in. So many people, who by the way are members if the public like anyone else, say that it is not appropriate and invariably give detailed information why qv. even though they wish it were feasible. On the other hand you have people who want p and r because it suits them. It's what they want and nothing else will do no matter what. I find this attitude self serving and small minded.

Do you seriously believe that rugby league is or ever was a 'competitor' of soccer: the most widespread, popular and wealthiest sport in the world? For crying out loud.

I genuinely believe that the proposed triple 8 division could bring in many new rich backers at the clubs outside SL. I also feel it can speed up promotion to SL for our new clubs. I really hope we'll see Cru back in the top flight in 2-3 years

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Sponsors seem to fall over themselves to get involved in the Premier League. It can't be due to the competition element because only 2 or 3 teams stand a chance. The rest have to settle for the Eufa cup or not getting relegated.

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Who is this 'all' you speak of? Where do they get the information to make these 'accounts'?

I most certainly haven't 'fallen out' with featherstone rovers. I just haven't any connection wuth them for my own reasons.

I still enjoy the game.

What's you're reason for becoming disconnected with Fev? (If you don't want to say on here that's fine and I apologise for prying, just generally curios)

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I genuinely believe that the proposed triple 8 division could bring in many new rich backers at the clubs outside SL. I also feel it can speed up promotion to SL for our new clubs. I really hope we'll see Cru back in the top flight in 2-3 years

Lobby mate I couldn't care less. I've adopted the philosophy if the self serving reactionaries: and I'm now only bothered about what suits me . Therefore all I care about is whether there's a game to watch and enjoy. Everyone else with their little self serving agendas can kiss my ass. I think Toulouse wod bring far more to sl than any of the clubs in the championship though: but hey ho

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1/ Part timers stepping up to full time

2/ Young already-pro lads at existing SL clubs

3/ Young academy lads outside SL

4/ RU (my own club Leigh used to recruit many a good either well known or unknown RU player. I think this is now more attractive since RU went pro).

5/ Local amateur setups (ours is one of the best in the country)

6/ pro's already at clubs which have oversized squads ( i.e. those clubs hoarding players and gben shipping them out to the Championship

lobby the two leigh amateur clubs are struggling to field teams at under 15 and under 16 to 18, so the production line is drying up and you forgot to mention the obvious source for players..............the antipodes

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What's you're reason for becoming disconnected with Fev? (If you don't want to say on here that's fine and I apologise for prying, just generally curios)

Personal reasons to do with life outside rugby league: ie the fact that there is one

And other reasons none of which relate to the club and the people who run it or are employed by it.

That's all I want to say

And I thank you for your interest

Cw

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sl should be something to aim for for a club and its fans, something for the 10 year old supporters of halifax to go to bed dreaming about, NOT a given right because you have more shiney plastic seats than your local rival, sport is just that , its SPORT! about winning -losing- failing- bettering yourselves against others, dreaming, aiming, hoping, celebrating, joy, despair NOT how good the burger bar is!

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People who believe SL signalled the demise of the game over here in the mid 90's are barking up the wrong tree. The major factor attributed to RL's lessening impact on mainstream media was the professionalism of Union. That meant RL could no longer attract the best players from both codes.

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Personal reasons to do with life outside rugby league: ie the fact that there is one

And other reasons none of which relate to the club and the people who run it or are employed by it.

That's all I want to say

And I thank you for your interest

Cw

Fair enough and thanks for the response, it's just for me personally this is the most exciting time I've had as a Fev fan but each to their own I suppose

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We seem to have a lot of people who spend too little time in the real world. The general public want p&r, it's part of the culture in the UK, in the same way it isn't in Australia or USA. That's the same GP you have to attract to the product to replace the ones walking away.

Global sport changed with the income from Tv, compArisons before and after are silly, what is relevant is how we have done against our primary competitors, soccer and RU in that time- anyone thinking well needs their head examined, we have gone backward at pace, yet both have retained p&r

Why did the game have its highest crowds when it had no P&R?

 

That goes for the pre-SL and post SL eras, the game has still had more years without P&R than with, so how come it is the sporting culture of SL all of a sudden, the sporting culture of RL has mostly been no P&R and play-offs.

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Because facts and reality have no place in his world

not enough room due to those memories of sepia tinted players playing their trade in front of packed houses

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hows about- bottom sl play top of the lower division, as double header at the grand final? now is that just crazy? or what?

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People who believe SL signalled the demise of the game over here in the mid 90's are barking up the wrong tree. The major factor attributed to RL's lessening impact on mainstream media was the professionalism of Union. That meant RL could no longer attract the best players from both codes.

Bang on the money, and Union jumped in quick as panic stations kicked in in the southern hemisphere when there was a sudden cash rich RL to contend with, they couldn't pretend anymore, they had to come clean.

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hows about- bottom sl play top of the lower division, as double header at the grand final? now is that just crazy? or what?

The first one

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Just to be clear, the only thing that sets the sport back and will kill the sport are its fans and supporters.

There are those who make wildly exaggerated claims about how promotion and relegation will make every perfect and those who make wildly exaggerated claims about how franchising and mergers will make everything perfect, and the few in between who get drowned out. So no matter what option the RFL and clubs take there will be a large section of the fans who will make excuses about why they will not go to games because it is dying and the administrators are clueless and talk the sport down at every opportunity.

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Just to be clear, the only thing that sets the sport back and will kill the sport are its fans and supporters.

There are those who make wildly exaggerated claims about how promotion and relegation will make every perfect and those who make wildly exaggerated claims about how franchising and mergers will make everything perfect, and the few in between who get drowned out. So no matter what option the RFL and clubs take there will be a large section of the fans who will make excuses about why they will not go to games because it is dying and the administrators are clueless and talk the sport down at every opportunity.

What he said.

I just wish he was a bit clearer.

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The fuss last weekend in Yorkshire soccer. Hull City promoted - all over Sky on Saturday afternoon.  Huddersfield, Wednesday and Barnsley avoid relegation - all over Look North. Bradford City going to Wembley again - and one of their biggest crowds.  P&R is a big draw in soccer.  It could be again in RL. As has been said earlier, what we have at the moment, especially in the latter days of the season, for the bottom clubs in SL is a series of friendlies. Plus of course we have the practice of targetting certain games and not bothering about others - Hull KR are good enough to beat FC on Good Friday, but not good enough to put up a decent show against the Pies on Easter Monday - same goes for Widnes.  

 Yes it's difficult for a promoted club to come up to speed in SL. But then it's just as difficult for a championship club to maintain promotion form for 3- 4 seasons. Look at Fev. We've lost our coach.  We may start to struggle and all the success in 2010,2011 & 2012 will be meaningless from the point of view of licensing.

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The fuss last weekend in Yorkshire soccer. Hull City promoted - all over Sky on Saturday afternoon.  Huddersfield, Wednesday and Barnsley avoid relegation - all over Look North. Bradford City going to Wembley again - and one of their biggest crowds.  P&R is a big draw in soccer.  It could be again in RL. As has been said earlier, what we have at the moment, especially in the latter days of the season, for the bottom clubs in SL is a series of friendlies. Plus of course we have the practice of targetting certain games and not bothering about others - Hull KR are good enough to beat FC on Good Friday, but not good enough to put up a decent show against the Pies on Easter Monday - same goes for Widnes.  

 Yes it's difficult for a promoted club to come up to speed in SL. But then it's just as difficult for a championship club to maintain promotion form for 3- 4 seasons. Look at Fev. We've lost our coach.  We may start to struggle and all the success in 2010,2011 & 2012 will be meaningless from the point of view of licensing.

The fuss would be invented regardless, comparing us with football is just a nonsense.

 

With P&R clubs will spend more time targeting certain games, do you honestly believe this never went on in the past and if in the future a club under threat of relegation would treat a game against the top club which they are certain to lose different to a game against a bottom club they have a chance of beating. REAL WORLD BECKONING, WAKE UP

 

The great relegation clashes of season after season are a myth, you get the odd one every so often, bring me a list of 5 years on a trot of great relegation clashes that produced massively above average crowds. You'll struggle to find two back to back seasons.

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lobby the two leigh amateur clubs are struggling to field teams at under 15 and under 16 to 18, so the production line is drying up and you forgot to mention the obvious source for players..............the antipodes

Lobbys post is correct,What mustn't be allowed to happen is what you are suggesting will happen .

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The fuss would be invented regardless, comparing us with football is just a nonsense.

 

With P&R clubs will spend more time targeting certain games, do you honestly believe this never went on in the past and if in the future a club under threat of relegation would treat a game against the top club which they are certain to lose different to a game against a bottom club they have a chance of beating. REAL WORLD BECKONING, WAKE UP

 

The great relegation clashes of season after season are a myth, you get the odd one every so often, bring me a list of 5 years on a trot of great relegation clashes that produced massively above average crowds. You'll struggle to find two back to back seasons.

 

But Hull KR aren't a bottom club.  Hull City won the first division, do you seriously think there'd be the same amount of enthusiasm if they weren't going to be promoted.  "Comparing RL with football is a nonsense/"  I've got news for you Dave RL IS football.  We need the oxygen of publicity like any other sport.  When Fev won the championship in 2011 BBC Look North ignored them.  Their cameras were at North Marine Road, Scarborough, watching a rained off Yorkshire fixture, because Yorkshire were in a relegation battle.  Because of the rain they couldn't even show any cricket.  They didn't even have a reporter at Warrington.  That's what P&R does. It created interest.  What we've got may not be killing Wigan, Saints, Wire and Leeds, but it's killing the rest of us.

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But Hull KR aren't a bottom club.  Hull City won the first division, do you seriously think there'd be the same amount of enthusiasm if they weren't going to be promoted.  "Comparing RL with football is a nonsense/"  I've got news for you Dave RL IS football.  We need the oxygen of publicity like any other sport.  When Fev won the championship in 2011 BBC Look North ignored them.  Their cameras were at North Marine Road, Scarborough, watching a rained off Yorkshire fixture, because Yorkshire were in a relegation battle.  Because of the rain they couldn't even show any cricket.  They didn't even have a reporter at Warrington.  That's what P&R does. It created interest.  What we've got may not be killing Wigan, Saints, Wire and Leeds, but it's killing the rest of us.

In 1977 how much time did the BBC give to the winners of the second division in RL, how much was in the newspapers, you seem to think a minor club in a minor sport winning a minor trophy was backpage news. It wasn't.

 

Our game has always been starve of publicity, it seemed like we had a lot of 'national' news in the past because the papers had Northern editions, those articles didn't appear all over the country, there is another myth that we had national recognition because the Daily Mirror gave us a lot of space, it gave us a lot of space in the NOrther edition, the other editions had nothing.

 

The death knell for RL as a headline backpage sport wasn't SL it was the closure of the local press offices which happened 10 years or more before.

 

You can have the most exciting P&R competition you want, it won't make one jot of difference to the amount of coverage.

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In 1977 how much time did the BBC give to the winners of the second division in RL, how much was in the newspapers, you seem to think a minor club in a minor sport winning a minor trophy was backpage news. It wasn't.

 

Our game has always been starve of publicity, it seemed like we had a lot of 'national' news in the past because the papers had Northern editions, those articles didn't appear all over the country, there is another myth that we had national recognition because the Daily Mirror gave us a lot of space, it gave us a lot of space in the NOrther edition, the other editions had nothing.

 

The death knell for RL as a headline backpage sport wasn't SL it was the closure of the local press offices which happened 10 years or more before.

 

You can have the most exciting P&R competition you want, it won't make one jot of difference to the amount of coverage.

Cant argue with most of that but that being the case it seems an odd policy to attempt to kill off most of the clubs in the same areas that the media coverage has been cut back massively, at the same time

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