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bedlam breakout

the death penalty

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Well no actually, most (please note most, not all) of prisoners are ordinairy people who made a bad choice, who are mentally ill, who's lives have gone off the rails for one reason or another.

Look at the disproportianate number of ex-servicement in prison are they "####"?

As I previously stated most murderers are related to or in the peer group of their victims. Most murders are commited in highly emotional situations. I know a guy who served 15 years for murder, he lives out the murder and his remorse for it every day of his life, good you say, so he should, he punched a guy in a fight, the guy fell and hit his head on a kerb. It could have happened to any of us who have had fights at any time in our lives. He's an ordinairy guy who now suffers the remorse of his act every day.

Should he have been hung? I say no.

That's manslaughter though mate and unlikely to carry a death sentence even if one were possible.

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That's manslaughter though mate and unlikely to carry a death sentence even if one were possible.

 

 

he was charged with and convicted of murder, the gentleman in question is now 85 and still lives the incident every day

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he was charged with and convicted of murder, the gentleman in question is now 85 and still lives the incident every day

He still wouldn't have gone to the gallows though. Most cases, and especially in these circumstances, were not executed.

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I tried to keep out of yet another discussion on the death penalty on here, I really did, however lots of 'facts' about how someone was convicted of murder then later released would have meant 'they would have been hung if we still had the death penalty' in bunk.  Less than 10% of convicted murderers were hung, over 90 % of convicted murderers were imprisoned.

 

No, no one would, as murdering children in 1975 was not a capital offence.

 

Between 1900 and 1964 817 people were executed for numerous offences (797 for murder, 16 for espionage and 4 for treason)  To date I believe only three have had their convictions quashed.  Three out of 817 isn't bad odds (three too many though). 

 

When you were convicted of murder, everyone was given the death penalty, they had to, it was the only punishment, but the vast majority were reprieved.  The ones who were executed had their cases go through several processes of investigation by varied departments, after their conviction, to see if there was any chance of a reprieve.  The ones executed were the ones who, if you like, ticked all the guilty boxes.

Would Sutcliffe and Brady, as certified insane people, have been executed?

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He still wouldn't have gone to the gallows though. Most cases, and especially in these circumstances, were not executed.

 

 

true but i get the feeling our OP would like him to have been.

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who on earth would want to be a licensed executioner now?

Judging by some of the comments on this thread I don't think that'll be a problem.

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Judging by some of the comments on this thread I don't think that'll be a problem.

Anyone who wants the job should be disqualified from doing it (etc etc).

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Judging by some of the comments on this thread I don't think that'll be a problem.

 

Even Albert Pierrepoint (a Bradford man btw) the last public executioner turned against the practise.

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caught with a smoking gun yes if there is 1% of doubt send them here with a tent, bottle of warm water and toffee hammer.

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Even Albert Pierrepoint (a Bradford man btw) the last public executioner turned against the practise.

 

 

He moved to Lancashire though and died in Southport. I presume there were more work opportunities on the other side of the Pennines.

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Forget the cost implications and the supposed deterrent, these factors are something you either work the numbers to support or refute.

 

My view is that I don't see why revenge cannot play a part in deciding the future of people with no moral compass. For the victims family this may offer some sense of justice.

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My view is that I don't see why revenge cannot play a part in deciding the future of people with no moral compass. For the victims family this may offer some sense of justice.

And killing the wrong person wouldn't give the victims families any problems whatsoever.

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And killing the wrong person wouldn't give the victims families any problems whatsoever.

Although I didn't express it, I believe that in the case of Cregan and similar, there has to be no doubt of the persons guilt. 

 

I believe this is possible to achieve.

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Although I didn't express it, I believe that in the case of Cregan and similar, there has to be no doubt of the persons guilt. 

 

I believe this is possible to achieve.

So are you saying you'd jail people where there is doubt over their guilt?

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So are you saying you'd jail people where there is doubt over their guilt?

"Beyond reasonable doubt" is obviously different from "beyond any doubt". 

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Would Sutcliffe and Brady, as certified insane people, have been executed?

 

Anyone?

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In Texas, they would.

 

That is true.

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Would Sutcliffe and Brady, as certified insane people, have been executed?

 

 

Anyone?

 

Brady is appearing in court today pleading that he now sane enough to be sent to an ordinary prison. He wants to do this so that he may successfully end his own life. He has been on hunger strike for years, but is being kept alive by the staff at Ashworth hospital by force feeding. Prolonging his misery is as good an argument against the death penalty as any.

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Would Sutcliffe and Brady, as certified insane people, have been executed?

I understand and empathise with your point to an extent, but that kind of implies that insanity is always an excuse. There are many 'insane' people who are extremely clever and highly capable of rational thought and logical reckoning. In some cases they just have different boundaries, morals, predelictions, call them what you will, but are perfectly aware of the consequences of their actions on themselves and on others - so should 'insanity' always be a cast-iron mitigation in those cases ?

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Prolonging someones misery against their will sounds suspiciously like revenge to me?

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 I understand and empathise with your point to an extent, but that kind of implies that insanity is always an excuse. There are many 'insane' people who are extremely clever and highly capable of rational thought and logical reckoning. In some cases they just have different boundaries, morals, predelictions, call them what you will, but are perfectly aware of the consequences of their actions on themselves and on others - so should 'insanity' always be a cast-iron mitigation in those cases ?

 

It was a genuine question because I actually don't know.  Someone said "What about the Yorkshire Ripper's victims?" but I'm not 100% sure that under the laws we've had at any point in the last century and a half he would have been executed.

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Prolonging someones misery against their will sounds suspiciously like revenge to me?

 

But, as someone said, you can be against the death penalty but not give a tuppenny stuff if the person incarcerated for life has a miserable old time with the occasional kicking on the way.

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But, as someone said, you can be against the death penalty but not give a tuppenny stuff if the person incarcerated for life has a miserable old time with the occasional kicking on the way.

Sounds more vindictive than ending it all for someone.

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