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boxhead

Where is the game heading?

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In answer to the original OP, RL in this country has no direction, no clear plan for growth, no strong leadership at RFL level and little media profile.  In the next 5 years I believe the best we can hope from the current regime is to stay still.  Now is the time to draw a line in the sand and appoint someone with the guts to stand up to the SL clubs who want the game run for their own benefit. 

 

Excellent post. I complete agree. I share the same thoughts as JD, Ckn et al about the game and the direction it is heading. Wood, Rimmer et al are not fit for purpose. The real issues in the game are staring the RFL and this current regime in the face and they are not doing anything about it other than coming up with cheap gimmicks which they hope will paper over the cracks developing for a short period. Barking mad.

 

On another note, Andy Capp, it is about time Australia's dropped their issue with the game in the UK over the SL war. It is 17/18 years ago now. If you have allowed your own clubs who moved across to Murdoch back into the fold, it is certainly time to let things go. We forgave the Germans faster about WWII... Get over it.

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The game will probably become a decent amateur sport played in many places it wasn't before. But it will never be as big as it could have been. The boat for that has sailed, especially given the throwing away of the paddle yesterday.

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It really isn't.

You cant watch many games then.

The quality on display week in week out in the NRL is far superior to super league, hence the Aussies could field 8 national teams, all of whom would beat England.

Thats the problem, too many imports and not enough quality UK players.

Not much of an RL journalist if you havent noticed that Gavin - you may get a job at the RFL one day though being so blinkered.

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You cant watch many games then.

The quality on display week in week out in the NRL is far superior to super league, hence the Aussies could field 8 national teams, all of whom would beat England.

Thats the problem, too many imports and not enough quality UK players.

Not much of an RL journalist if you havent noticed that Gavin - you may get a job at the RFL one day though being so blinkered.

 

I watch the NRL, its great. Its better than Superleague and so it should be, its Australia's number 1 sport.

 

Its completely irrelevant whether or not they can field 8 national teams that can beat us, because they can only field 1.

 

And with that 1 team, we can compete with them. We obviously don't always win, but we compete.

 

Which is about right for a sport of its stature in the UK.

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I watch the NRL, its great. Its better than Superleague and so it should be, its Australia's number 1 sport.

Its completely irrelevant whether or not they can field 8 national teams that can beat us, because they can only field 1.

And with that 1 team, we can compete with them. We obviously don't always win, but we compete.

Which is about right for a sport of its stature in the UK.

So basically you are saying the gap is as wide if not wider than its ever been then, which contradicts what you said earlier 'it really isnt'

Get your CV in to Red Hall, blinkered and contradicting yourself - 2 of the essential qualities.

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So basically you are saying the gap is as wide if not wider than its ever been then, which contradicts what you said earlier 'it really isnt'

 

The gap isn't wider, because we still compete with them. Just like we did in the 80's, 90's and 00's.

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FFS if 500,000 turn up to watch the World Cup over 5 weeks where will this put International RL?

 

One of my greatest moments as a kid was getting up early to see GB play Australia down under in 1988. Looking back on this now my conclusion is we competed well in test 1 and won test 3 - but also there was nobody in the SFS to watch them! In 1984 the crowds are worse. Rose tinted and all that.

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The gap isn't wider, because we still compete with them. Just like we did in the 80's, 90's and 00's.

You really are a poor journalist, the whole point of this thread is about where the game is headed and why we cant beat the Aussies at international level - this goes far beyond results on the field.

The quality of the NRL is a lot better than in the UK.

They have far more resources than us.

They have a bigger player pool.

They are now even taking our best players to play over there .

The game in OZ is thriving.

The game in the UK is dying on its backside.

We are no closer to beating them now than weve ever been.

They have a bigger cap and a governing body who stick with what has always worked for them. We have Wood and Rimmer.

Id say in the big picture, the gap is growing every year - they prosper while we stagnate.

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You really are a poor journalist, the whole point of this thread is about where the game is headed and why we cant beat the Aussies at international level - this goes far beyond results on the field.

The quality of the NRL is a lot better than in the UK.

They have far more resources than us.

They have a bigger player pool.

They are now even taking our best players to play over there .

The game in OZ is thriving.

The game in the UK is dying on its backside.

We are no closer to beating them now than weve ever been.

They have a bigger cap and a governing body who stick with what has always worked for them. We have Wood and Rimmer.

Id say in the big picture, the gap is growing every year - they prosper while we stagnate.

 

Cool meltdown Bro. We still compete though.

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I suggest that people listen carefully to Nigel  Wood's  interview on SLTV  

 

.He seems to be trying to extract money from SL to filter down the game. , especially to a hopeful newly  invigorated and thereafter almost full time pro Championship.  Championship One is likely to be regionalized - north and south. , so the player pathway remains protected.....

 

At the last full  Council meeting of the RFL papers were received suggesting that an Under 23's be re-introduced  and that as a direct  consequence the hideous dual reg would be abandoned , that the Academies be limited to  max 10 outlets only ( based on results confirming pro contracts at that level and not SL clout ) and that the highly damaging Scholarship programmes be re-visited urgently.

 

I remain hopeful that a truly game wide review is in progress

 

 It's the grassroots that count , after all  This game has to produce it's own players  - we are  totally unsustainable otherwise - where else do the players come from ?

 

For me . take 20% of the Sky monies and put it into  properly KPI  acceptable Community clubs with junior sections ( Club mark ) The results will follow within 5 years.....

 

And that's where the real debate lies........

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I suggest that people listen carefully to Nigel  Wood's  interview on SLTV  

 

.He seems to be trying to extract money from SL to filter down the game. , especially to a hopeful newly  invigorated and thereafter almost full time pro Championship.  Championship One is likely to be regionalized - north and south. , so the player pathway remains protected.....

 

At the last full  Council meeting of the RFL papers were received suggesting that an Under 23's be re-introduced  and that as a direct  consequence the hideous dual reg would be abandoned , that the Academies be limited to  max 10 outlets only ( based on results confirming pro contracts at that level and not SL clout ) and that the highly damaging Scholarship programmes be re-visited urgently.

 

I remain hopeful that a truly game wide review is in progress

 

 It's the grassroots that count , after all  This game has to produce it's own players  - we are  totally unsustainable otherwise - where else do the players come from ?

 

For me . take 20% of the Sky monies and put it into  properly KPI  acceptable Community clubs with junior sections ( Club mark ) The results will follow within 5 years.....

 

And that's where the real debate lies........

Every penny we have should be targeted on two areas - creating an elite, competitive, professional SL, and funding the community game.

 

Wasting money on Championship clubs paying part-timers does nothing for our sport. Nothing.

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Cool meltdown Bro. We still compete though.

Hardly a meltdown 'bro' just cold hard facts.

if you're happy to be 'competing' while the game crumbles around you then im made up for you.

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Every penny we have should be targeted on two areas - creating an elite, competitive, professional SL, and funding the community game.

 

Wasting money on Championship clubs paying part-timers does nothing for our sport. Nothing.

 

I'll take as much investment for the Community game as I can..

 

But  Chris Hill and Alex Walmesley could do a job for us in the World Cup  , so I'm not prepared to leave Championship graduates out of the mix Nadera - this is a whole game approach after all......

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I'll take as much investment for the Community game as I can..

 

But  Chris Hill and Alex Walmesley could do a job for us in the World Cup  , so I'm not prepared to leave Championship graduates out of the mix Nadera - this is a whole game approach after all......

 

I am quite happy there is a whole game approach but if they get the structures wrong with the review, it's going to do a lot of damage. However, thanks for putting a bit of meat on the bones ref the wider game. We've heard very little about this and is the area I think most urgently needs addressing. Can you clarify what you mean by 10 outlets?

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Most of the moaning posters are the main reason for any decline. Regardless of what you think about England playing exiles or France there isn't another pro sport that would see such a farcical turnout. Maybe it is down to the lack of wealth of rugby fans but I think it is just that they like to moan. Rl fans will be what kills the sport

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I'll take as much investment for the Community game as I can..

 

But  Chris Hill and Alex Walmesley could do a job for us in the World Cup  , so I'm not prepared to leave Championship graduates out of the mix Nadera - this is a whole game approach after all......

Just watched the Nigel Wood interview you mentioned earlier.

 

I find it astonishing that anyone, least of all an experienced sports administrator, can argue that the way to create an England team capable of beating Australia is to fund the Championship clubs so that they can bridge the gap to SL. You do it by having a top-notch development programme at community level and then having an elite competition for the talented players to play in as adults.

 

Hill and Walmsley are good players, but you could argue that the fact they've come into SL via the Championship shows the current system is working.

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Rugby League is a great entertaining sport to watch and play.

 

If we spent more time projecting that message and less time navel gazing and picking fault in it, who knows how many new fans and sponsors we might attract.

 

The negativity surrounding the sport is suffocating.

but john don't you think that the heirarchy of the game in this country lend themselves to negativity? this season has been the most competetive super league since the switch to summer rugby, this in my opinion is due to licensing and the narrowing of the gap between the haves and have nots. so what do the gruesome twosome do? wnat to revert back to the bad old days on boom and bust club management, this has failed in the past and will fail again in the future, the development of the academy structures will be throw out of the window if a club has a bad season and looks like finishing bottom and be relegated. back will come the clamour to sign third rate antipodean journeymen just to hop to secure super league status, and the youngsters will end up either at championship clubs or worse.........

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On the few Aussie forums I'm on the league fans down there seem to whinge no more or less about the state of the game and their administration as we do here, particularly throughout the Gallop era. A fair share of people don't have much good to say about the new guy Smith, either.

 

If whinging fans truly decided the success of a sport then the SL and NRL should be in the same boat, shouldn't they? Instead the Aussies are doing really well for all their whinging and negativity. Could it be because they run their sport properly?

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The really sad thing is that there are some people who want exactly that - a small time operation, involving small clubs, playing semi-pro rugby league. Just so long as they can get the bus to the away game against their fierce rival in the next village.

you are not wrong.

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Because we spend so much time focusing on what's wrong with it instead of what's right with it. We're always sending out negative messages, why would anyone new want to associate themselves with that?

 

For whatever reason, the RFL have embarked on a league restructure debate in the run up to a major World Cup tournament. Why now, in World Cup year? It's madness! The end result of it is that the game and everyone associated with it is looking inwards endlessly discussing its limitations, running down its existing competitions and clubs and making declarations of doom depending on which side of the restructured fence they sit. It is a totally corrosive atmosphere, pure poison to anyone outside the sport who will not give a toss how we organise the domestic league.

 

Instead of repeatedly pulling our own sport to bits like this, we should be projecting the enormous virtues of Rugby League to the outside world right now if we want anyone outside our enclosed environment to pay attention to it, which we desperately need them to in order to increase crowds and sponsorship revenues.

[/

Restructuring must be sorted before new TV deals are signed, surely you know this.

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If our Admin is so bad ( and I'm not saying it isn't) and the Aussie Admin is so good we could always ask them to run our game too.

If we did you could guarantee that they would do exactly as Ant suggests above.

Ant is right we are too parochial.

A great quote or truism from the US goes along the lines of " All politics is local". The strength of the clubs directly mirrors the strength of the game as a whole.

If Wigan or anyone else don 't take care of their local and parochial affairs, the whole game will suffer.

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It was based on League position and the introduction of a French team.

How did London end up as a SL team then?

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My negativity at the moment is a direct result of the hurt and pain of watching the game I love, consistently shooting itself in the foot with weak decisions from the governing body.

 

This frustration is heightened when I see the massive publicity, sponsorship and general fawning currently being given to an inferior code of rugby.  

 

We need strong leadership from the top (with new people in charge who have a track record of successful administration of a major sport).  Would another sport react to a request to scrap it's under 20's competition to save £100k a year?  No chance!  What the RFL needed to do was stay strong insist all clubs ran all junior age groups or they wouldn't receive their full Sky funding as they were damaging the future growth of the game.  The bottom line is if Fev and Sheffiled can run teams at all levels, without the benefit of central funding, then there is no excuse for SL clubs.

 

I'm sick of hearing that our game needs to shrink as the "player pool isn't large enough".  Rubbish!  The pool is only shrinking because insufficient time, funding and coaching are being applied to junior development in this country.  If we continue to pull in tighter to save money the game will eventually die at a professional level. So we may have a few years where the standard goes down if a lot of young kids are introduced, but this will soon improve whilst strenghening the national team for the future.

 

Why have the RFL taken the positive steps of introducing 3 new teams to Championship 1, only 6 months later to look to move the goalposts by aiming to restructure the league system?  There are countless other examples of short-termism and papering over the cracks.  RL fans are passionate about their sport by nature.  Why do we have to keep putting up with this ineptitude?

 

In answer to the original OP, RL in this country has no direction, no clear plan for growth, no strong leadership at RFL level and little media profile.  In the next 5 years I believe the best we can hope from the current regime is to stay still.  Now is the time to draw a line in the sand and appoint someone with the guts to stand up to the SL clubs who want the game run for their own benefit.  An ideal candidate IMO would have been Jim Doyle, the Scotsman who turned NZRL around.  He has now joined the NRL but could he be tempted over?

Well said.

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A great quote or truism from the US goes along the lines of " All politics is local". The strength of the clubs directly mirrors the strength of the game as a whole.

If Wigan or anyone else don 't take care of their local and parochial affairs, the whole game will suffer.

If RL is reliant on Wigan, or any other side come to mention it, looking after their local affairs else it will collapse, then it is pathetically weak.

The problem is that there are not enough Wigans spread about the country in the first place. It shouldn't be dependent on a handful of big clubs watering the roots, it should have people with watering cans everywhere. ..which it hasn't.

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I find it astonishing that anyone, least of all an experienced sports administrator, can argue that the way to create an England team capable of beating Australia is to fund the Championship clubs so that they can bridge the gap to SL. .

If that's all that a matters we should stop all funding to ALL clubs and pick 20 elite players and give them all the money the RFL receive. Obviously they wouldn't receive much money as the game wouldn't have any. But who cares?

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