Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

bedlam breakout

double standards in the education system

46 posts in this topic

a friend of mine took his kids away in school time for 4 days which resulted in snoopers going through his bins and issuing him with a fine, all seems a bit pointless when teachers go on strike willy nilly depriving kids of a days school and inconveniencing parents, do the teachers get fined in this case? think not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hardly double standards,parents know when school holidays are.That's the point of them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

a friend of mine took his kids away in school time for 4 days which resulted in snoopers going through his bins and issuing him with a fine, all seems a bit pointless when teachers go on strike willy nilly depriving kids of a days school and inconveniencing parents, do the teachers get fined in this case? think not.

 

You should be red top journo with simplistic one dimensional comments like that!

 

It is a parent's legal obligation to ensure their children attend school. It is a teacher's right to strike if they feel that they have a grievance, as has been the case, and indeed is, for many other sectors of society.

 

Your comment would have had much more validity if it had questioned the effectiveness of striking.

 

If you want to discuss double standards in the education system, why not discuss the governments different approach to free and academy schools as compared to LA schools.

 

And just for the record, teachers give up a full days pay when they strike.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It is a parent's legal obligation to ensure their children attend school.

How can they fulfill their legal obligation if the doors are locked?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What do 'teachers' have to do with fining children for going on holiday? It doesn't bother me one jot if a child goes on holiday in school time.

 

Surely this is far more to do with the government, especially as they recently changed the law so that holidays cannot be authorised any more. Also, when Ofsted come in schools are assessed on the attendance of their children. If the headteachers do not tackle attendance then the school's rating can be affected. My own school was criticised by Ofsted for not doing enough to guarantee that some children attend and a big part of this is children being taken out for holidays. What are schools to do? Let everybody be off when they like and just take the hit in the Ofsted report?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How can they fulfill their legal obligation if the doors are locked?

If the school is closed for whatever reason then there is no legal obligation for parents to ensure their children attend school. I am not sure what your point is here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two different issues. Two wrongs don't make a right. Not all teachers were on strike and not all schools were closed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If the school is closed for whatever reason then there is no legal obligation for parents to ensure their children attend school. I am not sure what your point is here.

Ah, so they're only legally obliged when the teachers can be arsed and haven't spat their dummy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, so they're only legally obliged when the teachers can be arsed and haven't spat their dummy.

Why don't you give them yours

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fining parents who take their kids on holiday in term time is a tax on the middle classes. Kids from sink estate, gypsy and ethnic communities regularly disappear for weeks and the schools don't do anything about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, so they're only legally obliged when the teachers can be arsed and haven't spat their dummy.

 

Yes!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fining parents who take their kids on holiday in term time is a tax on the middle classes. Kids from sink estate, gypsy and ethnic communities regularly disappear for weeks and the schools don't do anything about it.

 

I don't suppose that you can link to any stats on this can you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It always puzzles me why when workers go on strike they are automatically assumed to be in the wrong. But they are selling their labour and the employer is the buyer of that labour. If you try and buy a product and don't offer enough money for it the supplier will not sell it to you, that's simple commerce. Where's the difference?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fining parents who take their kids on holiday in term time is a tax on the middle classes. Kids from sink estate, gypsy and ethnic communities regularly disappear for weeks and the schools don't do anything about it.

In my experience this is pretty true. A few years back I saw a cheap holiday in October and enquired about the possibility of my (at the time) 15 year old lad be excused from 2 days at school. I was flatly refused and warned that should he be absent on those dates, there would be consequences. Like a dipstick I followed the advice.

I discovered that one of his schoolmates was constantly missing school for various reasons (non serious) and asked him what had happened to his parents, he laughed about it.

When I enquired why this person was apparently allowed to have time off, I was told it was because he had 'ongoing issues'. I asked if they were being fined the amount I had been threatened with and was told 'there's no point as they couldn't afford to pay'. Which was nice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I enquired why this person was apparently allowed to have time off, I was told it was because he had 'ongoing issues'. I asked if they were being fined the amount I had been threatened with and was told 'there's no point as they couldn't afford to pay'. Which was nice.

 

The correct answer would of course have been "mind your own business".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The correct answer would of course have been "mind your own business".

How so? Surely it's one rule for all? Besides, I was making the point and didn't really want to know what they get up to.

Either have a rule saying 'nobody is allowed out of school during term time' or don't.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have yet to actually meet anyone who has received a fine for taking one day off. The system is that families who have a pattern of absence go onto a period, usually a month, of monitoring. If they fail this period, the LA then take over the process of monitoring and make the ultimate decision on whether to fine.

 

Schools have no legal right to impose punative fines for absence, unless the process is part of any home/school agreement to which the parents have signed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How so? Surely it's one rule for all? Besides, I was making the point and didn't really want to know what they get up to.

Either have a rule saying 'nobody is allowed out of school during term time' or don't.

 

I wouldn't expect any details of my children's lives in or our of school discussed with other parents.  It's not a difficult concept, much like I wouldn't expect your doctor to tell me about anything about you if I were to ask him/her.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wouldn't expect any details of my children's lives in or our of school discussed with other parents. It's not a difficult concept, much like I wouldn't expect your doctor to tell me about anything about you if I were to ask him/her.

Hardly the same thing. For a start I know the person in question and I didn't ask them to give me information as such, I told them what I knew.

I imagine if you were told there is no way you can get an operation for disease X due to budget, only to discover that your neighbour was going in for the same op next week then you might begin to ask questions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hardly the same thing. For a start I know the person in question and I didn't ask them to give me information as such, I told them what I knew.

I imagine if you were told there is no way you can get an operation for disease X due to budget, only to discover that your neighbour was going in for the same op next week then you might begin to ask questions.

 

So what if you knew them.  The straight answer from the school should be/have been "we're not going to discuss with you anything related to children who you are not responsible for".  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some people seem to think that schools (which is of course not the same as teachers) fine parents for the fun of it, ignoring the obvious problem that they are only fining them because they are under a great deal of pressure from government to improve attendance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some parents think its ok to take a holiday in term time because its cheaper; but if ALL parents did that then the consequences are obvious - there would be nobody there to teach. Why should one or two families save a few bob by holidaying in term time? What about the rest who pay full whack and abide by the rules?

 

The solution is possibly to offer schools a chance to set their own holidays, which has already been proposed, but that creates its own logistical difficulties.

 

Its a difficult subject but try to see it from a head teacher's point of view. They are under immense pressure to produce "results" because politicians live for headline data (too stupid to see otherwise?), therefore the ethics and morals go out of the window in order to attain the statistical outcomes, which in turn masks the real issues.

 

Yes, there is a problem with some families who take their kids out of school for months at a time for various reasons (how can you justify a three month trip to a foreign county to catch up with the relatives? What about your kids' education?), but you have to see it from the teachers' point of view. They can't bloody win, to be honest.

 

And no, I'm not a teacher, but in reference to the original post, its not worthy of a dignified reply.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

a friend of mine took his kids away in school time for 4 days which resulted in snoopers going through his bins and issuing him with a fine, all seems a bit pointless when teachers go on strike willy nilly depriving kids of a days school and inconveniencing parents, do the teachers get fined in this case? think not.

A friend of mine refused to pay his taxes. HMRC investigated him, forcing him to account for his actions. Tax inspectors then went on strike so no taxes were collected. Then they went back to work. My friend went to prison. Quite rightly.

D'you see?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.