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ELBOWSEYE

IS RUGBY LEAGUE TOO HONEST

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Denmark have some heritage players playing for them (that helped set the sport up there), but always make sure there's a blonde haired, blue eyed young Dane involved with interviews etc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VassxJ-JSHY

What handsome and capable chaps they are!

 

Shame about the over-dressed ex-pat :(

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we are way too honest as a sport, and have been for as long as i can remember.. You rarely read a report about the sport without a reference to attempts to expand to non traditional areas and failures of the past. I can't think of any other sport that so frequently refers to its failures, which are then rehashed at every opportunity by people who don't really want the sport to be seen in a favourable light.

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It certainly was the case at Bradford during the cheap ticket years. I don't know for sure but if you see a crowd enough times someone can take an educated guess at the attendance (or at least tell the difference between a low "10,000" and a high "10,000").

 

As for the second line, you could say you were called Peter (name chosen at random!). No-one would really doubt that, unless you happened to conflict that. There's evidence and taking information in good faith.

 

Hang on we have someone coming out with a statement is if its fact that many (most is his word) SL clubs have posted attendances below their season ticket figures.

 

If you see league games some clubs have bigger season ticket sales than crowd figures

recorded and they include walk ups, this happens at most superleague clubs. the NZ Samoa showed less than the sales, 

 

 

Asking to have that backed up by some actual figures isn't asking much. He must have got this notion from some figures somewhere, so lets have them and then we can discuss why? Does he mean some Challenge Cup games have attendances less than the number of ST holders, are we talking play-off games. If the poster provides the figures than it can be discussed, otherwise I may as well claim to be Peter.

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thats cos someone as counted the opening game has having two 45,000 attandances 

 

I know why, but it's dishonest.

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I know why, but it's dishonest.

 

Why ?  They were there.  They paid a price that covered two games.  If I buy a season ticket for - say - Fev next year, should I only be counted for one game ? After all, I only have one ticket ................

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Why ?  They were there.  They paid a price that covered two games.  If I buy a season ticket for - say - Fev next year, should I only be counted for one game ? After all, I only have one ticket ................

 

Cobblers mate. You can't count 90k for that. They 45,000 people bought one ticket for two matches.

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Cobblers mate. You can't count 90k for that. They 45,000 people bought one ticket for two matches.

 

A season ticket is one ticket for 13 matches.

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A season ticket is one ticket for 13 matches.

 

And?

 

Were there 90,000 people in the Millenium on saturday or not?

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Wikipedia says RLWC 2013 has attracted 120,000 fans to the first 5 games. That's dishonest IMO.

I doubt it does. 120,000 is the official attendance (or thereabouts). Even if there were no double headers and no counting of tickets sold but bodies not turning up, it is clear that some of those 120,000 will have gone to more than one match.

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And?

 

Were there 90,000 people in the Millenium on saturday or not?

 

Not all at the same time.  But you fall into the trap ...

 

If 1000 Fev supporters buy a season ticket and come to 13 games, at which game would there be 13000 people in the ground ?

 

The point I'm making, really, is that attendance figures are interesting but they mean nothing unless you look behind them and there's never enough information to do that.

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A season ticket is one ticket for 13 matches.

Not everywhere. At Warrington it is a book of 13 tickets,

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Not everywhere. At Warrington it is a book of 13 tickets,

 

Is it a season ticket ?

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I have noticed that the Australian commentators on Premier Sports have been very good at talking up the crowd numbers, the atmosphere, the culture and history of the game in the north of England, the quality of the games and international rugby league generally.  It doesn't sound contrived, either (I think because its true).  

I hope their style rubs off.  I also hope for much more international rugby league having loved the tournament so far.

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A season ticket is one ticket for 13 matches.

Each match being a seperate event on a seperate day. This instance was a single event there is one attendance for both matches.

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Why ?  They were there.  They paid a price that covered two games.  If I buy a season ticket for - say - Fev next year, should I only be counted for one game ? After all, I only have one ticket ................

If you do not attend any games should you be counted?

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If you do not attend any games should you be counted?

 

If you're counting attendance, no, imho.

 

On the other hand, if it was a shared gate, the away side should have half the money.

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Each match being a seperate event on a seperate day. This instance was a single event there is one attendance for both matches.

 

So you're saying that the difference is whether I go home between games ?

 

It's not about the numbers, it's about interpretation of the numbers.

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Cobblers mate. You can't count 90k for that. They 45,000 people bought one ticket for two matches.

There were 45, 000 there for the first game

At the end some people went, some people came and some stayed where they were.

There were 45,000 there for the second game.

90,000 there in total for two games.

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And?

 

Were there 90,000 people in the Millenium on saturday or not?

 

Nobody is claiming there were 90,000 in the Millenium Stadium - it's a cumulative figure.  Total attendance for the world cup will be cumulative, there's no other way of doing it - meaning the same people will often be counted more than once, if they attend more than one game.  Whether they bought a ticket for an individual game, or a 'bundle' ticket that granted them access to two seperate games (Cardiff, Wembley), they should still be counted in the cumulative attendance figures.        

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There were 45, 000 there for the first game

At the end some people went, some people came and some stayed where they were.

There were 45,000 there for the second game.

90,000 there in total for two games.

You are stating an opinion as fact. Clearly there were less people there for the second game. The 90k figure is a way of falsely manipulating figures.

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You are stating an opinion as fact. Clearly there were less people there for the second game. The 90k figure is a way of falsely manipulating figures.

 

That's certainly true - some people didn't use the ticket they'd bought to watch the Wales-Italy match.  So 90,000 does sound a bit of a stretch in terms of total attendance for Cardiff (although more people than I expected watched both games). 

 

But what's the alternative?  It just so happens that two games took place last Saturday, but in the same stadium.  That shouldn't somehow invalidate people's attendance for each game.  What if exactly the same people go to each of the games at Leeds - should they not be counted simply because they have two seperate ticket stubs? 

 

It's not a perfect system, but the final cumulative figure will be pretty close to the number of people who attended individual games at the end of the world cup.  The same people will no doubt be counted multiple times, but there's just no way round that.

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Bottom line is - we don't know how many were there for each match.

 

What about the folk who were waiting for eight minutes at the bar ?  Should they only count as 90% present ?

 

It's a never-ending treadmill.

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PADGE, SORRY FOR NOT ANSWERING YOUR QUESTION EARLIER OTHERWISE ENGAGED.

THE FIRST I HEARD ABOUT FIGURES WAS A COUPLE OF SEASONS BACK IN AN GENERAL CONVERSATION AT WARRINGTON,IT WAS MENTIONED THAT OVER THE SUMMER HOLS THAT UPTO 400 SEASON TICKETS HOLDERS WOULD NOT ATTEND A MATCH THROUGH (HOLIDAYS/SHIFTPATTERNS AND OTHER REAONS) THE PEOPLE WOULD IF POSSIBLE BE ABLE TO SELL THEIR SEATS TO REGAIN MONEY,BUT THE MATCH WOULD HAVE TO BE A DERBY TO FACILITATE THE MARKET, SO IF WHAT YOU STATE IS A FACT AND NOT MY VERSION THAT COULD POST A FIGURE ABOVE THE CAPACITY.

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PADGE, SORRY FOR NOT ANSWERING YOUR QUESTION EARLIER OTHERWISE ENGAGED.

THE FIRST I HEARD ABOUT FIGURES WAS A COUPLE OF SEASONS BACK IN AN GENERAL CONVERSATION AT WARRINGTON,IT WAS MENTIONED THAT OVER THE SUMMER HOLS THAT UPTO 400 SEASON TICKETS HOLDERS WOULD NOT ATTEND A MATCH THROUGH (HOLIDAYS/SHIFTPATTERNS AND OTHER REAONS) THE PEOPLE WOULD IF POSSIBLE BE ABLE TO SELL THEIR SEATS TO REGAIN MONEY,BUT THE MATCH WOULD HAVE TO BE A DERBY TO FACILITATE THE MARKET, SO IF WHAT YOU STATE IS A FACT AND NOT MY VERSION THAT COULD POST A FIGURE ABOVE THE CAPACITY.

 

 Why are you shouting.

 

You stated that it happens a lot at SL clubs, I just would like to see some real numbers, i.e. a clubs season ticket sales and then a list of the clubs games where they posted a figure bellow that figure.

 

So two years ago at some time in the middle of summer at Warrington they posted loads of games below season ticket sales. Shouldn't be to hard for you to find the figures. Look forward to seeing them to analyze.

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