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ckn

The Pope

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The Pope getting a bit close to some sacred beliefs now.  He's going to have to be careful if he's going to continue not using a bulletproof Popemobile.

Perhaps he should reflect upon the economic wonders of his own country, Argentina, before he opens his mouth on subjects that he does not understand.

 

Trickle down economics isn't everybody's cup of tea but nobody benefits from an economy which has been destroyed by populist BS like this.

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Perhaps he should reflect upon the economic wonders of his own country, Argentina, before he opens his mouth on subjects that he does not understand.

Trickle down economics isn't everybody's cup of tea but nobody benefits from an economy which has been destroyed by populist BS like this.

Or maybe he understands the social context and consequences of pursuing tried and failed economics more than you do? That's the problem with free market capitalism - makes no sense in theory and works perfectly in practice (to make the already rich, even richer).

Also, his pontificating, sounds remarkably like Christianity to me!

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Or maybe he understands the social context and consequences of pursuing tried and failed economics more than you do? That's the problem with free market capitalism - makes no sense in theory and works perfectly in practice (to make the already rich, even richer).

Also, his pontificating, sounds remarkably like Christianity to me!

It sounds like basic human decency to me

This transcends religion

But it's all a facade designed to protect the churche's wealth and power and to restore its more or less destroyed reputation

This guy is the ideal front man for the operation

The basic repressive structure of the church is still in place as firmly as it ever was and that isn't going to change

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I’m not religious one bit, but during a visit to Rome a few years ago we went on a tour of the Vatican and I was gobsmacked by the opulence of the place. Maybe a good start for the head god pilot would be to redistribute the wealth to the poor and needy. After all its part of their rule book:-

 

Jesus saw wealth as a gift from God to be used in His service (Matthew 25:14-30). Those who have been blessed with wealth must share generously with the poor (Matthew 25:31-46), and avoid the sins of arrogance (1 Timothy 6:17-19), dishonesty (Exodus 20:15Mark 10:19Luke 3:12-14) and greed (Luke 12:13-21).

Those of us who are blessed with wealth beyond our need have a responsibility to share generously with the less fortunate. We should view our wealth as a gift from God, entrusted to us, to carry out His work on earth.

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Or maybe he understands the social context and consequences of pursuing tried and failed economics more than you do? That's the problem with free market capitalism - makes no sense in theory and works perfectly in practice (to make the already rich, even richer).

Also, his pontificating, sounds remarkably like Christianity to me!

He certainly should understand the consequences of failed economic policies. He was brought up in Argentina. And yet he hasn't.

 

It's amazing how a system that only makes the rich, richer has managed to provide a much higher standard of living in the UK than in Argentina especially for those at the bottom.

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It sounds like basic human decency to me

Basic human decency applied to economics has killed tens of millions of people. Better to stick to exploitation.

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Perhaps he should reflect upon the economic wonders of his own country, Argentina, before he opens his mouth on subjects that he does not understand.

 

Trickle down economics isn't everybody's cup of tea but nobody benefits from an economy which has been destroyed by populist BS like this.

He's not representing Argentina, he's the Pope.

 

It's not exactly a heresy against first world economics to say that unfettered capitalism is about as disastrous as unfettered socialism.  We're extraordinarily lucky to live in the UK that has a strong sense of capitalism with a moderately robust socialist safety net.  Any attempts to erode that level of social safety net while enhancing capitalism should be opposed just as much as any attempts to erode the UK's current level of capitalism while enhancing socialism.  Many parts of the UK have suffered from rampant capitalism but at least the safety net has kicked in, the same rampant capitalism in the US has just resulted in tent cities, deserted towns and desperate poverty with a safety net that's seriously grudged at best.

 

The concern I have is that anyone who gets caught in the UK's safety net is stereotyped as a scrounger by the media and egged on by all three main parties, all chasing the elusive "focus group" approval of their policies and journalism.

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It is amusing to note that whenever the right-wing are alarmed at something the Pope says, the left are smug and remind them he the Pope!

 

Whenever the left-wing are alarmed at something the Pope says, the right are smug and remind them he the Pope!

 

Half the time he is our chosen moral voice of our world and half the time he is an anachronism, who does not know what he is talking about.

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He's not representing Argentina, he's the Pope.

 

It's not exactly a heresy against first world economics to say that unfettered capitalism is about as disastrous as unfettered socialism.  We're extraordinarily lucky to live in the UK that has a strong sense of capitalism with a moderately robust socialist safety net.  Any attempts to erode that level of social safety net while enhancing capitalism should be opposed just as much as any attempts to erode the UK's current level of capitalism while enhancing socialism.  Many parts of the UK have suffered from rampant capitalism but at least the safety net has kicked in, the same rampant capitalism in the US has just resulted in tent cities, deserted towns and desperate poverty with a safety net that's seriously grudged at best.

 

The concern I have is that anyone who gets caught in the UK's safety net is stereotyped as a scrounger by the media and egged on by all three main parties, all chasing the elusive "focus group" approval of their policies and journalism.

You seem to be arguing that the UK has found perfection between the two extremes and policy must never deviate from this happy medium. If only life were that easy. We live in a state of constant change and what is a happy medium now may well be "wrong" in the future. Avoiding dogmatism is the thing.

 

Whether he represents Argentina or not, he certainly lived there for most of his life. He's just echoing the knee-jerk populist cr4p that gets people elected in South America except he didn't start bashing the US or the IMF (who of course cause all the economic problems in South America not corrupt populist politicians).

 

The reson why certain towns e.g. Detroit are largely abandoned is because the mayors tried to squeeze the middle class to fund all kinds of stupid vanity projects. They promptly moved and left areas of the city unpopulated. They remain so because land isn't particularly valuable or expensive in the US. It's easier to build a new Detroit in the suburbs than to rebuild the old one. Over here we have scarce land and thus it is valuable. When we have derelict land, there is a lot of commercial pressure to redevelop it. You can't rebuild Liverpool on empty land in Cheshire because there are already towns there. It's nothing to do with a social safety net.

 

He has no more deep insight into how to run an economy than the average pop star.

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You seem to be arguing that the UK has found perfection between the two extremes and policy must never deviate from this happy medium. If only life were that easy. We live in a state of constant change and what is a happy medium now may well be "wrong" in the future. Avoiding dogmatism is the thing.

Whether he represents Argentina or not, he certainly lived there for most of his life. He's just echoing the knee-jerk populist cr4p that gets people elected in South America except he didn't start bashing the US or the IMF (who of course cause all the economic problems in South America not corrupt populist politicians).

The reson why certain towns e.g. Detroit are largely abandoned is because the mayors tried to squeeze the middle class to fund all kinds of stupid vanity projects. They promptly moved and left areas of the city unpopulated. They remain so because land isn't particularly valuable or expensive in the US. It's easier to build a new Detroit in the suburbs than to rebuild the old one. Over here we have scarce land and thus it is valuable. When we have derelict land, there is a lot of commercial pressure to redevelop it. You can't rebuild Liverpool on empty land in Cheshire because there are already towns there. It's nothing to do with a social safety net.

He has no more deep insight into how to run an economy than the average pop star.

Avoiding dogma? Like failed right wing economic orthodoxies like Thatcherism, monetarism more generally and trickle-down you mean?

The reason Detroit has collapsed is because people build cars in other parts of the world cheaper.

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Posted · Hidden by John Drake, December 5, 2013 - No reason given

Avoiding dogma? Like failed right wing economic orthodoxies like Thatcherism, monetarism more generally and trickle-down you mean?

The reason Detroit has collapsed is because people build cars in other parts of the world cheaper.

I guess the average Pope and pop star needs a degree in Economics "awarded by people with Masters" then they'd know it all with absolute certainty!

Hang on now your pretence not to be a previously banned member is slipping a little. That was a line from before you "joined" this forum used by "somebody else".

 

Calling an economic theory "failed" does not make it so especially since nobody has a better one.

 

It may surprise you to learn that cars are still made in Detroit. It's just that the management no longer lives there. And the fact that the city hasn't shifted to other industries is rather glaring. It's not like other industries haven't come along in the meantime.

 

Still I'm sure it's nothing to do with the loony left that run Detroit Council. In the UK, the chronic mismanagement of cities like Liverpool caused people to switch from voting Labour to voting Liberal in local elections. In the US, they just abandoned the city.

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It is amusing to note that whenever the right-wing are alarmed at something the Pope says, the left are smug and remind them he the Pope!

Whenever the left-wing are alarmed at something the Pope says, the right are smug and remind them he the Pope!

Half the time he is our chosen moral voice of our world and half the time he is an anachronism, who does not know what he is talking about.

It's almost like everyone is a massive hypocrite.

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It's almost like everyone is a massive hypocrite.

Or alternatively, there are certain things that people expect from a religious leader - like religion.

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Posted · Hidden by John Drake, December 5, 2013 - No reason given

Hang on now your pretence not to be a previously banned member is slipping a little. That was a line from before you "joined" this forum used by "somebody else".

Calling an economic theory "failed" does not make it so especially since nobody has a better one.

It may surprise you to learn that cars are still made in Detroit. It's just that the management no longer lives there. And the fact that the city hasn't shifted to other industries is rather glaring. It's not like other industries haven't come along in the meantime.

Still I'm sure it's nothing to do with the loony left that run Detroit Council. In the UK, the chronic mismanagement of cities like Liverpool caused people to switch from voting Labour to voting Liberal in local elections. In the US, they just abandoned the city.

It was your line not mine and any pretence lasted about 24 hours more than 4 years ago.

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Couple of posts removed from this thread.

 

I know religion is always a contentious subject on here, but there is no need to make it personal.

 

Thank you.

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