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Rugby league in London, what next?

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What are CC1 clubs?

 

A common reference to third tier clubs, where the game is "survival" rather than building, a role which the Broncos will be taking on after this year. 

 

To get a handle on what the future of the London Broncos will be like just look at the London Skolars, it's really rather easy to do.

 

The comparison may not be that fair, after all Skolars have a more settled home base.

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The punk metaphor is interesting  but although punk made a huge impact, it was never really a commercial success and it was pretty faddish. It's never going to die but it stopped being a "big deal" a long, long time ago. Peel may have helped its spread but he didn't stick with it and found something else.

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A common reference to third tier clubs, where the game is "survival" rather than building, a role which the Broncos will be taking on after this year. 

 

To get a handle on what the future of the London Broncos will be like just look at the London Skolars, it's really rather easy to do.

 

The comparison may not be that fair, after all Skolars have a more settled home base.

Perhaps "expansionists" would be kind enough to stop using Skolars / Hemel / Oxford / Glos etc as an insult then we might get some expansion. Why put down the efforts of others?

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Perhaps "expansionists" would be kind enough to stop using Skolars / Hemel / Oxford / Glos etc as an insult then we might get some expansion. Why put down the efforts of others?

 

Quite. I remember thinking, as I sat in the sunshine at Iffley Road yesterday afternoon, what a colossal waste of my time it all was.

 

And it's not a survival vs building dichotomy either. Before last season we didn't have a club, so we built one, and did alright over the season.

 

This season we've added an U19 side and are recruiting for a Ladies side. But of course, none of that counts as building does it? And people complain about there being no interest outside the M62 - then when someone does something about it we get sneered at because we didn't have the foresight to do it in 1895. This sport is really its own worst enemy.

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Quite. I remember thinking, as I sat in the sunshine at Iffley Road yesterday afternoon, what a colossal waste of my time it all was.

 

And it's not a survival vs building dichotomy either. Before last season we didn't have a club, so we built one, and did alright over the season.

 

This season we've added an U19 side and are recruiting for a Ladies side. But of course, none of that counts as building does it? And people complain about there being no interest outside the M62 - then when someone does something about it we get sneered at because we didn't have the foresight to do it in 1895. This sport is really its own worst enemy.

You see if you aren't a SL club then you don't matter in the world view of some.

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The punk metaphor is interesting but although punk made a huge impact, it was never really a commercial success and it was pretty faddish. It's never going to die but it stopped being a "big deal" a long, long time ago. Peel may have helped its spread but he didn't stick with it and found something else.

?

Peel didn't 'find something else'. He always played a really wide selection of music on his show and that never changed. Certainly in the early 80's he was the only dj who would play the more extreme hardcore stuff. And then Hank Williams or something. So its totally innacurate to say he moved on to other things.

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Quite. I remember thinking, as I sat in the sunshine at Iffley Road yesterday afternoon, what a colossal waste of my time it all was.

 

And it's not a survival vs building dichotomy either. Before last season we didn't have a club, so we built one, and did alright over the season.

 

This season we've added an U19 side and are recruiting for a Ladies side. But of course, none of that counts as building does it? And people complain about there being no interest outside the M62 - then when someone does something about it we get sneered at because we didn't have the foresight to do it in 1895. This sport is really its own worst enemy.

 

I'm quite sure you did not feel that your time was wasted going along to support your club, and I am quite sure that you feel proud of what your club has built and continues to build into the structure and fabric of the Rugby League game. I am quite sure that like the fans of all amateur RL clubs and RL clubs that can play low level semi professional, including myself, whether it's a club that has a history reaching back to Victorian times or whether you and your colleagues started building it last season, you will enjoy your journey as you strive to build things up or alternatively survive the various crises that can befall all such sports clubs. 

 

The con trick is to get you thinking people are saying your efforts are a waste of time and that they are not appreciated. They are of course nothing of the sort on either count. The question here is about what next in London given the Broncos demise as a professional outfit (which your club is not).

 

All the "solutions" I see on the thread are with respect whistling in the wind when it comes to resurrecting Rugby League in London. Those who are quite happy to see the back of the Broncos as a professional entity will pat you on the head and make nice noises about what your club is doing to rise to the heights. However they know as well as I do it isn't going to happen, and they too know all the attempts to "organically grow" small RL clubs into professional RL clubs outside (and even along) the M62 which date back to the early 1900's haven't produced a single viable professional entity save for arguably Castleford.

 

So don't be duped. Every little achievement by every little club is fantastic and wholly appreciated by myself, but if we want a solution for the demise of RL in London the solution was/and remains for the powers in RL to back the Pro club, especially on the back of the massive £200m TV contract that could have been bigger had the clubs not just jumped in for their cut without a thought for anyone else.

 

The rise of pro-clubs in Gateshead, South Wales and London saw real growth, the demise eagerly welcomed privately by many ironically does not help your cause. Don't you think that if the RFL/SLE could engineer a successful pro club outside the heartlands that would not actually be extremely good for clubs like yours? What does it do for your club when the RFL/SLE retreat back to the M62???    

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The only "duping" is by those who know full well that top-down development has produced nothing but failed clubs and know that organic growth has only been possible since the end of rugby apartheid in 1995.

 

Supposed expansionists push a method that has had over a hundred years to work and has failed every time with little to show for it and rubbish the one that's only been possible for less than 20 years but has delivered several semi-pro clubs.

 

The fallback argument is always to refer to the "bank of the RFL" who are presumed to be sitting on millions of pounds but just don't know what to do with it. If only someone would just suggest to them that they could invest in London then all would be saved.

 

Except the money doesn't really exist. It's been spent on other things.

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Lamb knows there's a London club to pick up he also know there's a bill of several £Million a year to pay for over a decade to make the club competitive at Superleague level, and heavy bills to use a suitable ground. He also knows SLE/RFL will provide no real help at all, and that the club will be good for 500 fans a game whilst the young players will have to aim north or concentrate on Union for a pro career whilst he's footing all these bills.

 

Love all the positiveness of the posts, it's just what RFL/SLE need to get them off the hook of abandoning the game in a retreat to the north

 

Hopefully, he's a cockeyed optimist of the most extreme kind. :sleep:

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Lamb knows there's a London club to pick up he also know there's a bill of several £Million a year to pay for over a decade to make the club competitive at Superleague level, and heavy bills to use a suitable ground. He also knows SLE/RFL will provide no real help at all, and that the club will be good for 500 fans a game whilst the young players will have to aim north or concentrate on Union for a pro career whilst he's footing all these bills.

 

Love all the positiveness of the posts, it's just what RFL/SLE need to get them off the hook of abandoning the game in a retreat to the north

 

That's the thing though, a well run and organised London club has enormous potential. It's the biggest commercial department in the UK and one of the biggest in the world. He must have mates in the corporate sector to get sponsoring/hospitality to the club and as I said, if you have a stronger London club, RL will benefit throughout the country. Mark Evans, who turned Harlequins from relegation fodder to having 80k crowds at Twickenham, is now CEO at Melbourne Storm, another big player the club massively missed out on, we can't afford to let another opportunity slip. 

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Mark Evans saw how the Bronco's were run first hand, and saw what a huge job it would be to get them to a decent level. Thats why he probably never even entertained the idea of getting involved.

Sadly im of the opinion that the Bronco's in their current format will have to die before anyone comes in to attempt to build the club up to where it could be. If Hughes offered to sell the club for a £1 you'd want to haggle.. It really would have to be a case of starting from scratch.

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I believe it was because he didn't like David Hughes, which is why he never got involved. 

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If I was an investor looking to bankroll a club in London, I thinlk Skolars would look like a better bet than the Broncos. They have junior teams, a large home base with bags of potential close to an Underground, with a newly laid all purpose pitch and I think no debt.

 

The Broncos have a very unstable ground situation where most gate receipt etc go to a soccer club and no history whatsoever in that area.

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If I was an investor looking to bankroll a club in London, I thinlk Skolars would look like a better bet than the Broncos. They have junior teams, a large home base with bags of potential close to an Underground, with a newly laid all purpose pitch and I think no debt.

 

The Broncos have a very unstable ground situation where most gate receipt etc go to a soccer club and no history whatsoever in that area.

I have to agree.

 

Where previously the debate was characterised by the pin-in-the-map-brigade as expansionists versus flatcap ferret botherers with a hatred for all things south of Sheffield, they've now chosen to shift to "organic growth is all very well but it won't deliver a SL club".

 

I think we're all aware that Skolars / Hemel / Oxford etc won't be going near SL without substantial external investment. It's just that some people refuse to see a connection between developing the club and attracting major sponsorship. You see you are supposed to do nothing at all until a major investor comes along and decides that Watford is the perfect location for a professional rugby league team.

 

The fact that this has rarely happened in the past and when it has happened then it has always ended badly just doesn't sink in. In reality we need more clubs like Skolars and then we need the outside investor to take them to the next level.

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I have to agree.

 

Where previously the debate was characterised by the pin-in-the-map-brigade as expansionists versus flatcap ferret botherers with a hatred for all things south of Sheffield, they've now chosen to shift to "organic growth is all very well but it won't deliver a SL club".

 

I think we're all aware that Skolars / Hemel / Oxford etc won't be going near SL without substantial external investment. It's just that some people refuse to see a connection between developing the club and attracting major sponsorship. You see you are supposed to do nothing at all until a major investor comes along and decides that Watford is the perfect location for a professional rugby league team.

 

The fact that this has rarely happened in the past and when it has happened then it has always ended badly just doesn't sink in. In reality we need more clubs like Skolars and then we need the outside investor to take them to the next level.

 

I agree 100%. Broncos bring absolutely nothing to the party. Even Hemel with their new stand, new car park, school teams in the town and a long standing (30yrs) presence in the area have more to offer than the Broncos.

 

Crusaders with their slow build to success, incorporating amateur and schoolboy/girl developments and strong promotions within the Wrexham area are a better bet than the " Here we are, watch us in SL, oops we have no money, see you later top down Crusaders that preceded them. If the current Crusaders slowly progress, they will be  a suitable candidate, with a suitable base in the area for an investor to move them to the top than the linkless transplant that was the first edition.

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Unless you have a substantial amount of money it would be pointless for London to continue. One thing about Sports is that to be successful you need not just to have the right people on the field but the right people off it as well.and its bnot just a team that would need funding but an infrastructure to be built  London will lose all players of note from their squad unless for promotion to be realistic Championship clubs operate to the same salary cap as their Super League opponents.This will not happen, though having Bradford as the fallen giant and "elephant in the room" may cause some revision upwards.

 

The fact is the 8/8/8 will permanently fix the composition of the upper levels of the league unless a Super League club falls into financial trouble but will allow traditional clubs with average attendances last year of 2,403,1,707, 1,556 and 803 can achive their dream which despite the pounding of keyboards, really is to be able to play a series of hastily arranged local derbies at the back end of the season for the gate money. Reality and economics dictate that going any further is a bridge too far, as the former Halifax Chief Executive now titular head of the RLIF knows

 

Organic growth below this will be the organic stagnation a club like London Skolars epitomises, Ironically one sport that is a good example of Top down expansion is the NFL Wembley series which will probably result in a London franchise by the end of the decade, as Steve Mascord has pointed out no watering of the grass roots here but there is an increase in participation in another alien sport in the south directly attributable to the success of the series. The series is not without opposition stateside but the commitment of the League and its consitituent clubs to spread the brand and develop new markets has paid off to the extent as one RL fans poster put it that the NFL is already bigger than Rugby League in the south and likely to remain so.

 

I am afraid the game is up south of Wakefield and will result in a future of clubs with average attendance of around 342 watched by bitter Northern exiles ranting at the world around them. Truly "pins on the map" that fool no-one. Many on this board will be secretly jubilant at this however as league's new dark age takes hold and economic reality bites into a game puffing itself up on the "success" of reasonable attendances fuelled by cheap and discounted tickets and Pay TV viewing figures without actually understanding what drives commercial Pay TV networks. Sooner or later the number of casualties amongst "traditional" clubs, in particular those relegated to Championship 1 that the RFL simply cannot bail out will cause a re-think

 

The enlightened ones will face a problem, by 2016 "Rugby" will be Rugby Union outside the M62 corridor and perhaps encroaching inside, Other sports will also not have gone away but be stronger and down here much stronger. In addition the Pay TV Broadcaster who will cough up no more cash for a filler sport having bounced the sport into a long term deal. They may wish to expand the game of Rugby League but there will be neither room nor demand elsewhere as the "alternative" sport market will have been claimed by other less parochial sports. One thing we all agree on is that the field of dreams approach does not work for any sport.

 

London's problems are basically their own making but there never has been an ideological commitment save lip service towards expansion of the sport from the governing body post-Lewis and from a substantial section of Players, Coaches, Chairmen and RL Journalists all of who in their own small way support the game they profess to love in the same way a rope supports a hanging man.

 

 The legacy of the Nigel Wood era to the game of Rugby League is best summed up by this extract from Robert Browning's 1845 poem The Lost Leader

 

We shall march prospering,—not thro’ his presence;

  Songs may inspirit us,—not from his lyre;
Deeds will be done,—while he boasts his quiescence,
  Still bidding crouch whom the rest bade aspire:
Blot out his name, then, record one lost soul more,
  One task more declined, one more footpath untrod,
One more devils’-triumph[ and sorrow for angels,
  One wrong more to man, one more insult to God!
Life’s night begins: let him never come back to us!
  There would be doubt, hesitation, and pain,
Forced praise on our part—the glimmer of twilight,
  Never glad confident morning again!

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Anyone who thinks that rugby does not already equal rugby union in the South really needs to get out more.

 

As for the NFL, bear in mind that a new franchise costs around $800 million and wages are higher than in the EPL. Naturally they will get a lot of publicity and cause top-down growth but we've been here before. I don't want to diss American football as I quite like it but you are unlikely to ever get anything other than kickers from the UK.

 

The fact is when the Monarchs were around, there was a big "Operation Discovery" project to try to find talent in Europe capable of playing at a level below the NFL. There were awards handed out and the top two winners were kickers, the third was a man called Victor Ebubike. He was a running back and had carried the ball a total of three times during the season.

 

To get any kind of team together costs huge amounts of cash (think of all the equipment) and it's impossible to compete with the Americans as they take this sport very, very seriously in High Schools and Colleges. Hard to replicate that with a few kicks around in the park.

 

In contrast rugby league is much, much more accessible. I suspect that if this NFL venture ever gets off the ground it will be a 2-3 season wonder.

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Unless you have a substantial amount of money it would be pointless for London to continue. One thing about Sports is that to be successful you need not just to have the right people on the field but the right people off it as well.and its bnot just a team that would need funding but an infrastructure to be built  London will lose all players of note from their squad unless for promotion to be realistic Championship clubs operate to the same salary cap as their Super League opponents.This will not happen, though having Bradford as the fallen giant and "elephant in the room" may cause some revision upwards.

 

The fact is the 8/8/8 will permanently fix the composition of the upper levels of the league unless a Super League club falls into financial trouble but will allow traditional clubs with average attendances last year of 2,403,1,707, 1,556 and 803 can achive their dream which despite the pounding of keyboards, really is to be able to play a series of hastily arranged local derbies at the back end of the season for the gate money. Reality and economics dictate that going any further is a bridge too far, as the former Halifax Chief Executive now titular head of the RLIF knows

 

Organic growth below this will be the organic stagnation a club like London Skolars epitomises, Ironically one sport that is a good example of Top down expansion is the NFL Wembley series which will probably result in a London franchise by the end of the decade, as Steve Mascord has pointed out no watering of the grass roots here but there is an increase in participation in another alien sport in the south directly attributable to the success of the series. The series is not without opposition stateside but the commitment of the League and its consitituent clubs to spread the brand and develop new markets has paid off to the extent as one RL fans poster put it that the NFL is already bigger than Rugby League in the south and likely to remain so.

 

I am afraid the game is up south of Wakefield and will result in a future of clubs with average attendance of around 342 watched by bitter Northern exiles ranting at the world around them. Truly "pins on the map" that fool no-one. Many on this board will be secretly jubilant at this however as league's new dark age takes hold and economic reality bites into a game puffing itself up on the "success" of reasonable attendances fuelled by cheap and discounted tickets and Pay TV viewing figures without actually understanding what drives commercial Pay TV networks. Sooner or later the number of casualties amongst "traditional" clubs, in particular those relegated to Championship 1 that the RFL simply cannot bail out will cause a re-think

 

The enlightened ones will face a problem, by 2016 "Rugby" will be Rugby Union outside the M62 corridor and perhaps encroaching inside, Other sports will also not have gone away but be stronger and down here much stronger. In addition the Pay TV Broadcaster who will cough up no more cash for a filler sport having bounced the sport into a long term deal. They may wish to expand the game of Rugby League but there will be neither room nor demand elsewhere as the "alternative" sport market will have been claimed by other less parochial sports. One thing we all agree on is that the field of dreams approach does not work for any sport.

 

London's problems are basically their own making but there never has been an ideological commitment save lip service towards expansion of the sport from the governing body post-Lewis and from a substantial section of Players, Coaches, Chairmen and RL Journalists all of who in their own small way support the game they profess to love in the same way a rope supports a hanging man.

 

 The legacy of the Nigel Wood era to the game of Rugby League is best summed up by this extract from Robert Browning's 1845 poem The Lost Leader

 

We shall march prospering,—not thro’ his presence;

  Songs may inspirit us,—not from his lyre;

Deeds will be done,—while he boasts his quiescence,

  Still bidding crouch whom the rest bade aspire:

Blot out his name, then, record one lost soul more,

  One task more declined, one more footpath untrod,

One more devils’-triumph[ and sorrow for angels,

  One wrong more to man, one more insult to God!

Life’s night begins: let him never come back to us!

  There would be doubt, hesitation, and pain,

Forced praise on our part—the glimmer of twilight,

  Never glad confident morning again!

 

What a pessimistic view, truly a glass half empty view.

 

The length and breadth of RL in London and indeed, all points south of Sheffield and north of Keighley is huge compared to what was in place when the original Fulham club was launched from the banks of the Thames. I think the roots are sufficiently deep to survive the possible loss of the Broncos.

 

The sources of funding from rich individuals in the last several years from Salford to Perpignan via Featherstone, Widnes and Hull and, indeed, London is amazing. I would not write off the possibility of a deus ex machine lurking in the wings to ride to the rescue from a totally unexpected location.

 

The threat from the NFL has been dealt with by another poster and they will also face a severe players shortage in the coming years.

 

RU is a danger but it may have crossed a bridge or two too far in it's professional expansion and has huge financial black holes which may slow it's progress.

 

The huge amount of people buying World Cup tickets from the London and the South suggests there may be a latent fan base for our game. We must harness and energise this support.

 

Finally if you want a poem I prefer Chumbawamba's

 

I get knocked down but I get up again, you're never going to keep me down ( and repeat)

 

Or maybe a bit of Kipling

 

If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster

And treat those two imposters just the same.

 

If you can hear the truth you've spoken

twisted  y kanes to make a trap for fools

 

Or watch the thing you gave your life to, broken,

And stop and build em up with worn out tools

 

...... yours is the earth and everything that's in it.

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I cannot believe people think Rugby League is as big as Rugby Union outside of the heartlands, you only have to look at Sports England participation figures to see how many people are playing each sport. Nearly every RL team outside of the heartlands are propped up by RU players playing off season and Playing out of RU clubs

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It takes a long time to establish a SL club capable of standing on its own two feet in terms of finances, attendances and player development.  London have been fighting this cause for many years now, but the issues of change of ownership, finances, location and name have set back the timetable.  The London Catalan game from the Magic weekend was for me a very interesting one, and it was great to see so many youngsters from the south playing well at SL level.  It's just such a shame that the game has turned its back on expansionism through reverting to P&R.  I might be wrong, but London only just recently seem to be reaping the rewards of all that junior development in the capital and SE by them and all the other clubs down there over the last 20yrs.  And that's the thing, it takes an awfully long time to get to this position.

 

For those taking the line that London don't offer the competition anything then think again.  For a player of any sport to reach the top there has to be a structure, a ladder to climb, and there has to be a local vision of what the top looks like.  If London are not in SL then the top of that ladder is removed and will have a very negative effect on player development, and with a population of nigh on 5m that's a lot of lost opportunity.  I'm personally involved in another sport spanning abilities top to bottom and know this to be absolutely true.

 

This is that sort of damage that a return to P&R is going to have.  We could effectively be trading 10/20yrs of development London and the SE so that Fev or Leigh can play in SL for a season (please - no offence).  I cannot believe that the powers that be think that allowing London, and possibly Catalan in a season or two's time maybe, to be relegated is good for the game.

 

(No Bradford comments required this is about London)

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It takes a long time to establish a SL club capable of standing on its own two feet in terms of finances, attendances and player development.  London have been fighting this cause for many years now, but the issues of change of ownership, finances, location and name have set back the timetable.  The London Catalan game from the Magic weekend was for me a very interesting one, and it was great to see so many youngsters from the south playing well at SL level.  It's just such a shame that the game has turned its back on expansionism through reverting to P&R.  I might be wrong, but London only just recently seem to be reaping the rewards of all that junior development in the capital and SE by them and all the other clubs down there over the last 20yrs.  And that's the thing, it takes an awfully long time to get to this position.

 

For those taking the line that London don't offer the competition anything then think again.  For a player of any sport to reach the top there has to be a structure, a ladder to climb, and there has to be a local vision of what the top looks like.  If London are not in SL then the top of that ladder is removed and will have a very negative effect on player development, and with a population of nigh on 5m that's a lot of lost opportunity.  I'm personally involved in another sport spanning abilities top to bottom and know this to be absolutely true.

 

This is that sort of damage that a return to P&R is going to have.  We could effectively be trading 10/20yrs of development London and the SE so that Fev or Leigh can play in SL for a season (please - no offence).  I cannot believe that the powers that be think that allowing London, and possibly Catalan in a season or two's time maybe, to be relegated is good for the game.

 

(No Bradford comments required this is about London)

The thing is that London are dying as a team without P&R. Yet another season of getting stuffed every week is just going to make the crowds go down even further. There is no point keeping licensing for Broncos' benefit because relegation is probably the best thing that could happen to them right now.

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It takes a long time to establish a SL club capable of standing on its own two feet in terms of finances, attendances and player development.  London have been fighting this cause for many years now, but the issues of change of ownership, finances, location and name have set back the timetable.  The London Catalan game from the Magic weekend was for me a very interesting one, and it was great to see so many youngsters from the south playing well at SL level.  It's just such a shame that the game has turned its back on expansionism through reverting to P&R.  I might be wrong, but London only just recently seem to be reaping the rewards of all that junior development in the capital and SE by them and all the other clubs down there over the last 20yrs.  And that's the thing, it takes an awfully long time to get to this position.

 

For those taking the line that London don't offer the competition anything then think again.  For a player of any sport to reach the top there has to be a structure, a ladder to climb, and there has to be a local vision of what the top looks like.  If London are not in SL then the top of that ladder is removed and will have a very negative effect on player development, and with a population of nigh on 5m that's a lot of lost opportunity.  I'm personally involved in another sport spanning abilities top to bottom and know this to be absolutely true.

 

This is that sort of damage that a return to P&R is going to have.  We could effectively be trading 10/20yrs of development London and the SE so that Fev or Leigh can play in SL for a season (please - no offence).  I cannot believe that the powers that be think that allowing London, and possibly Catalan in a season or two's time maybe, to be relegated is good for the game.

 

 

 

That is an excellent post very well reasoned out and very well written.

 

When Les Catalans were losing weekly along with London we had the nightmare scenario of these clubs being replaced by a small club in the same place as two other SL clubs, and another small club on the doorstep of Europe's biggest name RL club.

 

Stunning observation on all those decent young players at MM in BOTH the London and Catalans teams playing some good stuff yet both the clubs possibly facing the serious damage at best, or the oblivion at worst of relegation.

 

We've already dispelled the silly myth that a relegation battle can revitalise the comp, and it will be the same again next year when we have the highly loaded middle eight so called "competition".

 

What would revitalise the game as indicated is if we had decent professional teams competing out of new areas finding new players and audiences, yet that is what is most likely to be thrown away. Come on Lenegan let's have your vision?

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I cannot believe people think Rugby League is as big as Rugby Union outside of the heartlands, you only have to look at Sports England participation figures to see how many people are playing each sport. Nearly every RL team outside of the heartlands are propped up by RU players playing off season and Playing out of RU clubs

 

They think a lot of things.....

 

Clubs can grow and grow and grow without investment

Amateur RL clubs are springing up all over the country

There's  no limit to quality juniors players out there

A rich owner who can meet the salary cap means success 

Relegation is good for clubs because they can "rebuild"

Second tier promotion battles draw big crowds

It doesn't matter if the game is concentrated in the north

 

It's all wishful thinking, and fair enough no harm in dreaming, but if the game's policies were based on these fallacies then we'd be stuffed. The sad thing is the policies for me ARE based on these things......

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It's all wishful thinking, and fair enough no harm in dreaming, but if the game's policies were based on these fallacies then we'd be stuffed. The sad thing is the policies for me ARE based on these things......

And the ironic thing is that you spent years arguing that they weren't and that the RFL knew what they were doing and so we should follow them blindly.

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Unless you have a substantial amount of money it would be pointless for London to continue. One thing about Sports is that to be successful you need not just to have the right people on the field but the right people off it as well.and its bnot just a team that would need funding but an infrastructure to be built  London will lose all players of note from their squad unless for promotion to be realistic Championship clubs operate to the same salary cap as their Super League opponents.This will not happen.

 

The fact is the 8/8/8 will permanently fix the composition of the upper levels of the league unless a Super League club falls into financial trouble but will allow traditional clubs with average attendances last year of 2,403,1,707, 1,556 and 803 can achive their dream which despite the pounding of keyboards, really is to be able to play a series of hastily arranged local derbies at the back end of the season for the gate money. Reality and economics dictate that going any further is a bridge too far, as the former Halifax Chief Executive now titular head of the RLIF knows

 

Organic growth below this will be the organic stagnation a club like London Skolars epitomises.

 

 

More realism, more pragmatism.

 

Something about the sport made it appeal to people. I too liked it being "Northern" "Local" "Affordable" "Different" use whatever words you like to describe why northerners kept it alive for so long after Union fought back.

 

Maybe in the offices of the RFL, the Boardrooms of the clubs, and out on the terraces there is no stomach to lose these things as much as those who understand the dynamics warn that we can't stand still, we either go forwards or backwards.

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