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Did you buy falafel, hummus, and haloumi?

Is that Wilson, Kepple and Betty in Welsh ? I was in Abergvenny.

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If you want to fall in love with a Blairite austerity party go ahead ...

Hardly given what I posted about unnecessary austerity.  We could have had a sensible retrenchment if Clegg hadn't reneged on his manifesto and got into bed with Dave.  After 6 years of pain Osborne has finally given it best, so it's all been for nothing anyway.

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Today i took my first faltering steps on the road to LibDemmery. I did some shopping at Waitrose...and it was OK!

:ohmy:  We've had one here for a few years but I've never ventured in.  I've always imagined a larger version of Marks & Spencer so have steered clear

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:ohmy:  We've had one here for a few years but I've never ventured in.  I've always imagined a larger version of Marks & Spencer so have steered clear

They're ok for some stuff. And they do sell Fullers 1845 Ale and Young's London Special Ale, both beers of which I'm particularly fond and can't find elsewhere.  The problem is the only one anywhere near here is at Meanwood.  They also do a cracking Stilton.

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For those class warriors staunchly and proudly steering clear of Waitrose, it is part of the John Lewis workers' collective, which makes it a lot more right-on than Asda, Tesco, Sainsbury's and the like.

 

Their bread's a bit ordinary, mind.

Edited by Futtocks

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For those class warriors staunchly and proudly steering clear of Waitrose, it is part of the John Lewis workers' collective, which makes it a lot more right-on than Asda, Tesco, Sainsbury's and the like.

 

Their bread's a bit ordinary, mind.

They do some cracking deals on their meat.  You can get nice bits of steak for 3 for £10 at times.  If you're careful and steer away from the dodgy Duchy stuff then you can often get cheaper shops done than equivalents at Tesco/Sainsburys.

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They do some cracking deals on their meat.  You can get nice bits of steak for 3 for £10 at times.  If you're careful and steer away from the dodgy Duchy stuff then you can often get cheaper shops done than equivalents at Tesco/Sainsburys.

For fresh meat and veg (choice and quality), Waitrose is a good place to go. The booze section is pretty good, too.

 

I tend to do a special shop there for bits'n'pieces you can't get elsewhere, while doing my main shop at the Sainsbury's that is two minutes' walk from where I live.

Edited by Futtocks

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I have found myself going to Marks and Sparks more and more... just better quality and tasty stuff.

 

I might as well sign up to the Lib Dems now.

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I shop and Whole Foods and the Co-op.

 

Please, advise.

 

 

If you add Trader Joes and the odd weekend farmers market to that list, you would be a full on sandal wearing Lib Dem.

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If you add Trader Joes and the odd weekend farmers market to that list, you would be a full on sandal wearing Lib Dem.

You have described Davis, CA perfectly, but fortunately I do not go to those two.  Because of that, I should presumably join Britain First?

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You have described Davis, CA perfectly, but fortunately I do not go to those two.  Because of that, I should presumably join Britain First?

 

 

Whoa whoa woh there.  Lets not go too far.  Maybe UKIP.

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They do some cracking deals on their meat.  You can get nice bits of steak for 3 for £10 at times.  If you're careful and steer away from the dodgy Duchy stuff then you can often get cheaper shops done than equivalents at Tesco/Sainsburys.

I wouldn't touch the Duchy stuff with a ten foot pole (or Russian)

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Given their strength in south Cumbria, north Leeds and Southport, I'd imagine a lot of Lib Dems shop at Booths, and not Waitrose.

 

As an active LD and a council candidate earlier this year, I suppose it leaves it up to me to attempt to persuade you. You're right about localism, and a lot of the resurgence since 2015 has been reflected in council results, the party making comparatively strong gains this year in the local elections and in by-elections - not just in their traditional heartlands, but also in some of the Mets.

 

Nationally, it's worth having a look at this: http://www.markpack.org.uk/libdem-beliefs/ or looking at the discussions on the Lib Dem Voice website, the leading blog for the party. You don't need to be a member to do either of these.

 

For me, without getting into the social v economic/classical liberal debate, the key things are voting reform, devolution, decision making (I've found it surprisingly easy to get involved in shaping policy as a member based in a traditionally weak area for the party), internationalism and an ambition for individuals to reach their full potential.

 

Oh, and Glee Club.

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Given their strength in south Cumbria, north Leeds and Southport, I'd imagine a lot of Lib Dems shop at Booths, and not Waitrose.

 

As an active LD and a council candidate earlier this year, I suppose it leaves it up to me to attempt to persuade you. You're right about localism, and a lot of the resurgence since 2015 has been reflected in council results, the party making comparatively strong gains this year in the local elections and in by-elections - not just in their traditional heartlands, but also in some of the Mets.

 

Nationally, it's worth having a look at this: http://www.markpack.org.uk/libdem-beliefs/ or looking at the discussions on the Lib Dem Voice website, the leading blog for the party. You don't need to be a member to do either of these.

 

For me, without getting into the social v economic/classical liberal debate, the key things are voting reform, devolution, decision making (I've found it surprisingly easy to get involved in shaping policy as a member based in a traditionally weak area for the party), internationalism and an ambition for individuals to reach their full potential.

 

Oh, and Glee Club.

But I'm a middle of the road, soft left, Guardian reading social democrat.  The Liberals to me seem to be all things to all men.  I can never get over how they reneged on their Manifesto in 2010, some of which was well to the left of Labour, and got into bed with the Tories and helped them to introduce some of the most socially divisive policies ever.  All on the pretext that the country was going the way of Greece.  Well the necessity of those policies is now called into question and seem (to me) to have been merely a cover for shrinking the state, which is what most people with my views thought they were all along.  Six years of misery for the worst off in society, which  has resulted in those who were the victims blaming the EU and voting us out.  All ushered in by the Lib/Dems.  Tell me where I'm wrong?

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But I'm a middle of the road, soft left, Guardian reading social democrat.  The Liberals to me seem to be all things to all men.  I can never get over how they reneged on their Manifesto in 2010, some of which was well to the left of Labour, and got into bed with the Tories and helped them to introduce some of the most socially divisive policies ever.  All on the pretext that the country was going the way of Greece.  Well the necessity of those policies is now called into question and seem (to me) to have been merely a cover for shrinking the state, which is what most people with my views thought they were all along.  Six years of misery for the worst off in society, which  has resulted in those who were the victims blaming the EU and voting us out.  All ushered in by the Lib/Dems.  Tell me where I'm wrong?

 

You could argue that your third sentence should read:

 

It's disappointing that they were never in a position to enact their Manifesto in 2010, some of which was well to the left of Labour, but at least they put the country before party and compromised with the Tories and prevented them from introducing some of the most socially divisive policies ever.

 

 

When you look at the more progressive elements of the last government; pupil premium, same sex marriage, raising of the tax threshold for lower incomes, green investment banks etc. you could argue that the Lib Dems punched above their weight and were punished for it. by the electorate.

 

I'll acknowledge that reneging on the tuition fees pledge was a big misjudgement and apologise for it, but I'd never apologise for going into coalition.

Edited by Jonty

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You could argue that your third sentence should read:

 

 

When you look at the more progressive elements of the last government; pupil premium, same sex marriage, raising of the tax threshold for lower incomes, green investment banks etc. you could argue that the Lib Dems punched above their weight and were punished for it. by the electorate.

 

I'll acknowledge that reneging on the tuition fees pledge was a big misjudgement and apologise for it, but I'd never apologise for going into coalition.

They were punished by the electorate for ratting on their manifesto.  Gordon offered them a better deal on most of their long cherished desires, and according to Andrew Adonis could have delivered a workable coalition with the Ulster Unionists, but Clegg preferred to get into bed with Dave who was much more to his liking personally.  All the above may have been Lib/Dem policies. but they did nothing to stop the swingeing cuts brought in by Osborne. Plus they nodded through the disastrous NHS "reforms" of Lansley, which effectively wrecked the NHS. What signalled to me that Nick was basically a coward was shortly after the coalition took office they cancelled the Forgemasters loan and instead of facing angry Sheffielders, in after all what was his home city, he sent his official car to the front of Sheffield City Hall and sneaked in and out by the back door. Pathetic.

Edited by Trojan

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They were punished by the electorate for ratting on their manifesto.  Gordon offered them a better deal on most of their long cherished desires, and according to Andrew Adonis could have delivered a workable coalition with the Ulster Unionists, but Clegg preferred to get into bed with Dave who was much more to his liking personally.  All the above may have been Lib/Dem policies. but they did nothing to stop the swinging cuts brought in by Osborne. Plus they nodded through the disastrous NHS "reforms" of Lansley, which effectively wrecked the NHS. What signalled to me that Nick was basically a coward was shortly after the coalition took office they cancelled the Forgemasters loan and instead of facing angry Sheffielders, in after all what was his home city, he sent his official car to the front of Sheffield City Hall and sneaked in and out by the back door. Pathetic.

It is apparent that Brown may not have been feasible to work with and that the Tories had a bigger electoral mandate.

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You could argue that your third sentence should read:

 

 

When you look at the more progressive elements of the last government; pupil premium, same sex marriage, raising of the tax threshold for lower incomes, green investment banks etc. you could argue that the Lib Dems punched above their weight and were punished for it. by the electorate.

 

I'll acknowledge that reneging on the tuition fees pledge was a big misjudgement and apologise for it, but I'd never apologise for going into coalition.

As an alternative, if Clegg had agreed a supply and confidence pact with the Tories in return for a couple of key manifesto items then this would have forced the Tories to try to get their "austerity" through as a minority government.  It would have forced the Tories to negotiate, compromise and actually talk to the opposition rather than use the Lib Dems as their battering ram to get through some seriously distasteful changes to society.  But then Clegg and others wouldn't have had the ego boost of ministerial jobs and pay.

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It is apparent that Brown may not have been feasible to work with and that the Tories had a bigger electoral mandate.

Brown offered to go as soon as his party elected a new leader, if Clegg felt he couldn't work with him.  He should have had the nous to see that long term it would be bad for his party, and establish the Tories in power where they could manipulate the economy in order to stay there.

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I agree with Bob. The tories had a bigger electoral mandate, they were right to go in to coalition with them. Supply and confidence would not have had delivered a stable govt. Just look at this conservative majority govt. Do you think it would be so unstable if they were in coalition. Definitely not!

 

At the end of the day they made mistakes and got an electoral kicking for them, but many of the good things they achieved get overlooked.

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I agree with Bob. The tories had a bigger electoral mandate, they were right to go in to coalition with them. Supply and confidence would not have had delivered a stable govt. Just look at this conservative majority govt. Do you think it would be so unstable if they were in coalition. Definitely not!

 

At the end of the day they made mistakes and got an electoral kicking for them, but many of the good things they achieved get overlooked.

But they went along with perpetuating the myth that the country was about to go down the tubes like Greece. It wasn't.  And as has currently been proved, all the pain inflicted by Osborne assisted by Alexander seems to have  been totally unnecessary, and in fact made matters worse not better.  Whatever the ins and outs of electoral arithmetic, parties shouldn't somersault like the Lib./Dens did and expect to go unpunished.  And of course, we probably wouldn't be in the mess Brexit has left had Clegg made  a different decision 6 years ago.

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But they went along with perpetuating the myth that the country was about to go down the tubes like Greece. It wasn't.  And as has currently been proved, all the pain inflicted by Osborne assisted by Alexander seems to have  been totally unnecessary, and in fact made matters worse not better.  Whatever the ins and outs of electoral arithmetic, parties shouldn't somersault like the Lib./Dens did and expect to go unpunished.  And of course, we probably wouldn't be in the mess Brexit has left had Clegg made  a different decision 6 years ago.

 

OK I don't remember the lib dems making the Greece claim, the conservatives HAD been elected on a platform of austerity, and were the senior party in the coalition. They had to negotiate for what they got. They got some things right and some things wrong. They got some pretty significant wins but people forget about them. It was the first time they were in that position though so it was a learning experience. 

 

Also blaming Clegg for Brexit is a bit rich. The referendum was offered by Cameron to "shoot the UKIP fox", nothing to do with the Lib Dems.

 

Answer me this question though. If you were given just these two options for the current government which would you prefer for being in power :

A conservative majority

A coalition with the conservatives being the major party

 

just those two option

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