Sign in to follow this  
graveyard johnny

how things have changed for fans since the 70s

Recommended Posts

I think mid 90s to early 00s were the best times on reflection.

A more expansive game on the field and facilities starting to get better off it for fans.

The atmosphere was great, it was affordable for all and rugby league had genuine stars in the sporting landscape.

Fast forward to 2018 and the game hasn’t really kicked on in the way I thought it would.

 

Edited by Gerrumonside ref
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

I think mid 90s to early 00s were the best times on reflection.

A more expansive game on the field and facilities starting to get better off it for fans.

The atmosphere was great, it was affordable for all and rugby league had genuine stars in the sporting landscape.

Fast forward to 2018 and the game hasn’t really kicked on in the way I thought it would.

 

Yes.

That is when I was young too :P

  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

10m rule is really biting with lack of variety of play is also an issue for me.

Edited by RS

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have been watching footage on YouTube of old finals and how people look back and there is no  comparison, the games in the 70,80,90 were slow, with no organisation, often thuggish and if we brought back the 5m rule the game would be one dimensional at best. We need to take off the rose coloured glasses. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

I have been watching footage on YouTube of old finals and how people look back and there is no  comparison, the games in the 70,80,90 were slow, with no organisation, often thuggish and if we brought back the 5m rule the game would be one dimensional at best. We need to take off the rose coloured glasses. 

Not really a good comparrison picking finals from yesteryear to form an opinion, by the sheer nature that finals are a cautionary affair by the teams playing in them we rarely have great spectacles, of course there are exceptions to the rule, take '85 Wgan v Hull still classed as the best CC final ever.

Now back to the 5 mtr rule and being one diementional as you put it, we now have anthing over 15mtrs between the offensive and defensive lines at the play the ball and yet 4 drives in most sets of 6 is a very prevalent play.

5 Meters or 10 between the lines can work and will speed the game up immeasurably if we adopted another rule change, that being, reduce the number of interchanges, which has the adverse effect, swopping forwards continually actually slows the game down.

If we had say 2 interchanges, the game would change completely, those fresh players would not be there controlling the ruck, they would be conserving energy, they would not be targetting the half's the same for the very same reason, allowing those play makers to be more expansive. In turn there would be no place for 15 minute behemoths, coaches would want players with a bigger aerobic capacity to perform longer.

Tactics would change also, take players like your own Ben Curry a forward who spends most of the game in the centre's, that luxury would not be affordable, if we had less forward interchanges, those wide playing forwards would be required back in the middle helping out their tiring collegues, - now this is the clever bit - it would allow those earlier mentioned creative players to exploit those areas in the centre position that were policed by the wide playing forward thus making the game more open, more expansive.

Unquestionably todays player's are fitter especially the full time pro's, but in yesteryear which you find easy to ridicule, the players performed in all positions for usually 80 mins, infact they it could be said were more like "full time" players than a lot of the "part time" 30minute men of today.

Have a look back again and try to find other games from those era's, not just finals. for me the most entertaining team we have today is coached by Mr. Powell at Castleford, he is doing nothing more than employing the very same tactics, game plans, stratergies whatever you wish to name them, as in the era the 80's/90's he played in himself and is familiar with.

If you really believe that todays game with the rules employed which I belive are stiffling the game especially the allowed interchanges is that much better, other than you accusing some of wearing rose coloured glasses, I suggest you get an appointment at the opticians to correct your myopia.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The 85 final was exciting at the time but the gaps between the defence and attack was huge and today's players are better organised and fitter so the space you see on that match would not be there today. And I am fed up of hearing how Powell reinvented the game last season, yes they were good to watch but they were not the best attack in the last 15 seasons not even close. And if you look back at most games that were televised in the 70,80,90 it will still paint the same picture (micron have quite a few). So I don't say that it is perfect now but to keep saying it was better years ago is what all old men(or women) say. 

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Main changes as I see them

 

- toilets now have a roof

- ticket prices gone up out of proportion now making the game relatively more expensive and making fans think twice about going to ad hoc games of other local championship clubs

- the articles and info in programmes are not as good and the price is off putting. I have a programme for every game I went to in the 70s and 80s but once we got to expensive glossy mags with just a squad list on the back seems to disappear away

- fewer enforcers and less biff

- Video ref. Teams not "robbed" as much by dodgy decisions from a ref miles behind play but games now can take an age 

- less spontaneous atmosphere in stadiums. Most now comfortable, family friendly and safe but in the majority of games not full and lacking in atmosphere

- Still limited media coverage but for the fan twitter, facebook etc mean that you can now get information on the game, players etc rather than simply waiting for the Saturday pink or a weekly league paper

- No proper tours and Aussie signings no longer "exotic" or putting bums on seats like the likes of Meninga, Kenny, Sterling did

- Players no longer come in different shapes or sizes. Most can play in many different roles - the likes of Brendan Hill would struggle a bit these days

- Since the Aussie coaches came the game is no about percentages and the off the cuff stuff seems less

 

Your view on these depends on when you started watching. As above your first magical experiences of the game are your base point and everything else never matches up to that. Thats just what happens as you advance in years

Better, worse - its just different.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/13/2018 at 8:58 AM, deluded pom? said:

Why when I read this thread can I hear a brass band playing Dvorak and I get an image of a baker’s boy pushing his bike up a steep cobbled hill?

 

On 1/13/2018 at 9:00 AM, RabbitRhinoovOZ said:

Mental issues I'd say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgjLJSuGPt8

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

The 85 final was exciting at the time but the gaps between the defence and attack was huge and today's players are better organised and fitter so the space you see on that match would not be there today. And I am fed up of hearing how Powell reinvented the game last season, yes they were good to watch but they were not the best attack in the last 15 seasons not even close. And if you look back at most games that were televised in the 70,80,90 it will still paint the same picture (micron have quite a few). So I don't say that it is perfect now but to keep saying it was better years ago is what all old men(or women) say. 

Now young Sir, where did I even suggest that the game years ago was better, I was merely pointing to the fact that players then especially the forwards could and did play for 80 mins, and that was when they contested the scrums and actually spent energy shoving, something totally foreign to modern day forwards, for goodness sake those props of today may spend even less time on the park if they had to scrum down properly, even today's 9's get accolades for playing "Big Minutes". 

Better organised is a moot point, more cautious I will grant you, todays centres see far far less of the ball than they ever have (Cas excepted) and our wingers see most of the ball they recieve cuertosy of cross field kicks other than passing movements.

You may be fed up of reading the number of accolades Mr Powell recieves, but please point me to any team in those years of the recent past you mention were there has been a better return from any particular clubs wingers than those of Castleford in the last 2 years, are the guy's who have played on the flanks for Cas the best wingers in the game? or do you think it could just be coincidence that they play a more expansive game?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many interesting points there, headtsckle, though I wonder what Rob Burrow thinks about players not coming in different shapes and sizes. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Now young Sir, where did I even suggest that the game years ago was better, I was merely pointing to the fact that players then especially the forwards could and did play for 80 mins, and that was when they contested the scrums and actually spent energy shoving, something totally foreign to modern day forwards, for goodness sake those props of today may spend even less time on the park if they had to scrum down properly, even today's 9's get accolades for playing "Big Minutes". 

Better organised is a moot point, more cautious I will grant you, todays centres see far far less of the ball than they ever have (Cas excepted) and our wingers see most of the ball they recieve cuertosy of cross field kicks other than passing movements.

You may be fed up of reading the number of accolades Mr Powell recieves, but please point me to any team in those years of the recent past you mention were there has been a better return from any particular clubs wingers than those of Castleford in the last 2 years, are the guy's who have played on the flanks for Cas the best wingers in the game? or do you think it could just be coincidence that they play a more expansive game?

Warrington had a back line 1to7 who all scored 20 plus tries under Smith and the team scored averaged 39 points per game with also the best defence. A mute point, I played in the pack when scrums were contested in the 70s which shows I am not young. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, headtackle said:

Main changes as I see them

 

- toilets now have a roof

- ticket prices gone up out of proportion now making the game relatively more expensive and making fans think twice about going to ad hoc games of other local championship clubs

- the articles and info in programmes are not as good and the price is off putting. I have a programme for every game I went to in the 70s and 80s but once we got to expensive glossy mags with just a squad list on the back seems to disappear away

- fewer enforcers and less biff

- Video ref. Teams not "robbed" as much by dodgy decisions from a ref miles behind play but games now can take an age 

- less spontaneous atmosphere in stadiums. Most now comfortable, family friendly and safe but in the majority of games not full and lacking in atmosphere

- Still limited media coverage but for the fan twitter, facebook etc mean that you can now get information on the game, players etc rather than simply waiting for the Saturday pink or a weekly league paper

- No proper tours and Aussie signings no longer "exotic" or putting bums on seats like the likes of Meninga, Kenny, Sterling did

- Players no longer come in different shapes or sizes. Most can play in many different roles - the likes of Brendan Hill would struggle a bit these days

- Since the Aussie coaches came the game is no about percentages and the off the cuff stuff seems less

 

Your view on these depends on when you started watching. As above your first magical experiences of the game are your base point and everything else never matches up to that. Thats just what happens as you advance in years

Better, worse - its just different.  

 

Brendan hill would win the golden boot these days - easily- at full back!

Edited by graveyard johnny
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, JohnM said:

Many interesting points there, headtsckle, though I wonder what Rob Burrow thinks about players not coming in different shapes and sizes. 

Burrow is an exceptional example. If he believed what he told as he was developing about being too small to play professional RL he would most likely have been lost to the professional game. There have been several other high profile players that were told the same. In general terms; players have become a lot more uniform in size and shape.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, dhw said:

Burrow is an exceptional example. If he believed what he told as he was developing about being too small to play professional RL he would most likely have been lost to the professional game. There have been several other high profile players that were told the same. In general terms; players have become a lot more uniform in size and shape.

They told the young Johnathan Thurston that he was too small. He's doing okay. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Although a minor point compared with some of the points about how things have changed for fans,  the point made about players sizes does not seem to apply at WIgan.

Morgan Escare is 5' 8" and 12st 3 lbs, whilst Taulima Tautai is 6' 1" and 17 stones 13 lbs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, JohnM said:

Although a minor point compared with some of the points about how things have changed for fans,  the point made about players sizes does not seem to apply at WIgan.

Morgan Escare is 5' 8" and 12st 3 lbs, whilst Taulima Tautai is 6' 1" and 17 stones 13 lbs

The point doesn't apply anywhere, the same could be done for any team. People just like to mix up a general trend of all positions getting bigger (which is true) with there being no room for players of different sizes (which is not). 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are some obvious exceptions to the size rule and Burrow is certainly one

The general point was that back in the day players tended to be more specialist other than the odd "utility" player who could slot in the pack and the backs. Props were props and wingers were wingers.

There were not as many second rowers filling in as prop, loose forwards playing at 6 or 7 etc etc.  

Going back to changes since the 1970s

- don't have to rely on ceefax for scores with updates every 10 minutes or so and after churning through 10 pages of text

- usually know if a game is off in advance rather than turning up to be told by someone at the gate or already on the way back to their car

- Doncaster now win games (not like another bloody Sunday - watch it on you tube)

- Kids can't sit on the wall then on the hooter run on to get autographs and sock tie ups

- Blue comedians no longer get invited to do the pre match community singing at Wembley (can you imagine suggesting a Bernard Manning equivalent these days)

- The excitement, uncertainty and usually disappointment of cross code signings

- Not as many  cup competitions. Charity shield, Lancashire/Yorkshire cups, BBC2 floodlit trophy,  Regal trophy and the Premiership - all gone

-  Seats at Wembley and crowds of 98,000 not seeing much at all a thing of the past

- London now seems a bit closer than it used to do !!

- All games kicking off at 3pm (parts of Yorkshire 3.30) on a Sunday then listening to the radio phone in on the way home

 

 

 

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.


League Express - Online Now

League Express - Every Monday

Rugby League World - Jan 2018



Rugby League Books On Sale Here