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Listenening to the Dewsbury Chairman on Proper Sport, he said the reason that his team were short on numbers (players) for their game in Toronto was that a some of those had a problem with their visa applications albeit they had applied in April there were clerical implications which prevented them not recieving 'a pass' and therefore unable to travel.

Fast forward to the Eights, in that the TWP are to play 4 games in Canada (yet to be scheduled) and could be less than 2 weeks notice once the 23 rounds are complete, some clubs may find they are denied the services of a player(s) if the same 'clerical' issues abound.

I would think that it would effect the 2 SL clubs more, as the Championship teams will have already made the trip, looks like Widnes could be applying for their Visa's now but that is not a given albeit I expect Widnes to be competing in the qualifiers theirs and Torontos finishing positions will deem if they are travelling or will have a home fixture.

BUT, another point to consider is clubs may as in previous seasons strengthen their playing rosters for the qualifiers TWP have already stated it is their intention to do so, other Championship clubs could do the same - when is the transfer window closed, is it the first of July? - that would be a shorter period than Dewsbury's stated application to game time.

One of the biggest gripes of the 8's is if a SL team gets relegated and what it means to individuals in losing their jobs, I fully expect to hear more if teams are denied fielding their best teams for reasons beyond their control by playing in Canada.

 

Edited by Harry Stottle
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2 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Listenening to the Dewsbury Chairman on Proper Sport, he said the reason that his team were short on numbers (players) for their game in Toronto was that a some of those had a problem with their visa applications albeit they had applied in April there were clerical implications which prevented them not recieving 'a pass' and therefore unable to travel.

not the first time this has happened and not always clerical some were denied visas because they had been naughty in the past  the rfl should have applied for a  rugby league visa so every body could travel

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In your last paragraph Harry Stottle about individuals losing their jobs, all I can say is welcome to the real world! In businesses all over the world the bottom line is if you are poor at your job and fail, you get the boot! It's called life! I just don't get this mentality of sympathy for failure, we should be rewarding success and endeavour not mollycoddling failure and weakness.

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5 minutes ago, POR said:

not the first time this has happened and not always clerical some were denied visas because they had been naughty in the past  the rfl should have applied for a  rugby league visa so every body could travel

Why should the RFL be asked to do things like this? It's really not difficult to apply for a visa, the Wolfpack even recommend an immigration specialist to make life easier for visiting clubs. Are we really saying that clubs aren't capable of filling in a few forms and sending them off in plenty of time? It's pretty basic admin.

Edited by nadera78
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You would like to think this possibility had been discussed pre-Toronto joining League One and pre-this year in regards to the 8’s, but this is Rugby League, it’s governed by The RFail, so it’s probably never been thought of.

I wonder if Toronto will even play in Canada in the 8’s or will they reverse all their home games or play at a neutral venue (that Manchester Rangers place?).

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2 minutes ago, Private Baldrick said:

In your last paragraph Harry Stottle about individuals losing their jobs, all I can say is welcome to the real world! In businesses all over the world the bottom line is if you are poor at your job and fail, you get the boot! It's called life! I just don't get this mentality of sympathy for failure, we should be rewarding success and endeavour not mollycoddling failure and weakness.

That I totally agree with, note and read back I did not say I was in agreement with relegation, for I most certainly am. 

I was pointing out that teams could possibly be denied players if they do not obtain the required paperwork, that would be an unmittigating circumstance that should not be acceptable, it could have an adverse effect for the individual, team and club.

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7 minutes ago, nadera78 said:

Why should the RFL be asked to do things like this? It's really not difficult to apply for a visa, the Wolfpack even recommend a company specialising in immigration issues to make life easier for visiting clubs. Are we really saying that clubs aren't capable of filling in a few forms and sending them off in plenty of time? It's pretty basic admin.

Is 2 weeks plenty of time Nadera? If you believe the Dewsbury Chairman that some did not get a pass after 8 weeks from application, 2 weeks is not enough.

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11 minutes ago, nadera78 said:

Why should the RFL be asked to do things like this? It's really not difficult to apply for a visa, the Wolfpack even recommend an immigration specialist to make life easier for visiting clubs. Are we really saying that clubs aren't capable of filling in a few forms and sending them off in plenty of time? It's pretty basic admin.

because it would come with more clout and you would have thought missing out on  naughty boy visas would be more unlikely

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For starters it's an electronic "visa". It took me all of 40 minutes to complete the application and it cost me C$17, roughly 10 quid. It is valid for 5 years so once done it would just about see out your career?

I really don't get all this havering over what is a simple task. As we used to say back in the day RTFM.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, DKL79 said:

For starters it's an electronic "visa". It took me all of 40 minutes to complete the application and it cost me C$17, roughly 10 quid. It is valid for 5 years so once done it would just about see out your career?

I really don't get all this havering over what is a simple task. As we used to say back in the day RTFM.

 

 

DK, I am quoting the Dewsbury Chaiman, you either believe him or percieve him to be a complete liar, which ever way you sway, that is your prerogative.

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It's simple really, i.e. complete the details accurately. If you, say, get your passport number wrong on the application you will be stopped at the boarding gate. Once again RTFM.

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46 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Is 2 weeks plenty of time Nadera? If you believe the Dewsbury Chairman that some did not get a pass after 8 weeks from application, 2 weeks is not enough.

Quite possibly they didn't get a pass because of previous criminal convictions. Nothing much to do with the time-frame at all.....

 

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18 minutes ago, Damien said:

Ah any excuse to find a stick to beat Toronto with! 

Who's trying to put Toronto down, you would not want them to compete on anything other than a level playing field would you, gain promotion and forever have that stigma that they got it by default!

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What sort of "visa" is needed to play a single game as a visiting player in Canada? Because if it's the standard tourist E. T. A. then it really does only take 20 minutes to fill in online and comes through withing 48 hours unless you've got a crim record. 

Or do they need some sort of working visa? 

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4 minutes ago, marklaspalmas said:

Quite possibly they didn't get a pass because of previous criminal convictions. Nothing much to do with the time-frame at all.....

 

OK, That is a possibillity, I will go along with that, but, the laws of this country and the rules of the RFL allows them to make their living and play the game in this country, is it right that a 'home' club should be penalised of the services of one of their player's by the laws of another country.

Please note all detractors, I am not including the TWP, I don't think for one minute they would object to any player competing against them.

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We all know very well the poster making a big deal about this would not be so vociferous should a Canadian or French side suffer similar issues coming here. 

Edited by scotchy1
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15 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

OK, That is a possibillity, I will go along with that, but, the laws of this country and the rules of the RFL allows them to make their living and play the game in this country, is it right that a 'home' club should be penalised of the services of one of their player's by the laws of another country.

Please note all detractors, I am not including the TWP, I don't think for one minute they would object to any player competing against them.

Im not clear on what you're saying. If I work for a UK company I must be allowed to go and work for that company in Canada even if the laws of Canada don't allow me to enter?

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The main problem is some players do not put down all convictions, no matter how minor, and also some clubs do not allow enough time to correct any changes in visa applications or personal. It is not if they don't know they are going. 

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23 minutes ago, marklaspalmas said:

Im not clear on what you're saying. If I work for a UK company I must be allowed to go and work for that company in Canada even if the laws of Canada don't allow me to enter?

Thats a fair point Mark, lets take this to the extreme, if multiple clubs come into existance in the N. Americas do/should our clubs be subjected to who they can or cannot employ by having players who would be unavailable to play in those countries?

 

Edited by Harry Stottle

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14 minutes ago, newbe said:

The main problem is some players do not put down all convictions, no matter how minor, and also some clubs do not allow enough time to correct any changes in visa applications or personal. It is not if they don't know they are going. 

The point of this thread if you care to read the OP is that by the time the league placings are confirmed and the games scheduled there will be very little time to organise never mind correct visa applications.

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5 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Thats a fair point Mark, lets take this to the extreme, if multiple clubs come into existance in the N. Americas do/should our clubs be subjected to who they can or cannot employ by not having players who would be unavailable to play in those countries?

Well, I'm far from an expert on this matter, but I'd say the clubs can continue to sign who they want. However, they'd need to bear in mind that certain players have certain convictions which would prevent them from travelling to North America.

TWP themselves would have to be careful in their UK recruitment, as rather than a one-off fixture, they of course play 50% of their games there.

It's far from a new or unique situation. 8 years ago Fev had a PNG player whose visa didn't allow him to travel to France (to play Toulouse).

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3 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

The point of this thread if you care to read the OP is that by the time the league placings are confirmed and the games scheduled there will be very little time to organise never mind correct visa applications.

Any clubs with players who have a criminal record should surely be already applying for their visa,the rest can do it online without problems,not rocket science is it,we are talking about professional Superleague clubs after all.

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