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graveyard johnny

so now 31 charged in huddersfield

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the usual sounding names on the published list so far- that's a fact- a fact that has been published on the bbc news website (before any loonie left wing do gooders want this thread locking), turns my stomach over to think how these poor  young girls must have suffered at the hands of so called adults that should be classed in the law lower than rats.

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1 hour ago, gingerjon said:

Bishop Bell?

2 wrongs always equal a right in the deranged mind of the fairy tale left, yes we know- but now that's just boring now and the ostriches have to get their heads out of the sand and fast

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1 minute ago, graveyard johnny said:

2 wrongs always equal a right in the deranged mind of the fairy tale left, yes we know- but now that's just boring now and the ostriches have to get their heads out of the sand and fast

When some people make comments about the names of the accused here looking familiar it is always worth pointing out that child abuse occurs in all sections of society. And that does not diminish the suffering of the victims here - rather it says we should all be vigilant and aware or else we’ll be blind to abuse in the future.

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3 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

rather it says we should all be vigilant and aware or else we’ll be blind to abuse in the future.

This is always the correct and only real lesson on these occasions and of course the other one is using it to bash people we don't agree with politically.

In all the cases I've seen the most difficult ones to spot have been the most outwardly responsible and good citizen ones.

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15 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

When some people make comments about the names of the accused here looking familiar it is always worth pointing out that child abuse occurs in all sections of society. And that does not diminish the suffering of the victims here - rather it says we should all be vigilant and aware or else we’ll be blind to abuse in the future.

We can all agree it is wrong when done by Muslims, if others prefer to give a blind eye when it is done by others, then that is another thread.

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31 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

When some people make comments about the names of the accused here looking familiar it is always worth pointing out that child abuse occurs in all sections of society. And that does not diminish the suffering of the victims here - rather it says we should all be vigilant and aware or else we’ll be blind to abuse in the future.

you have just bolstered your own own left wing nonsense of 2 wrongs making a right, lol - un believable 

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8 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

you have just bolstered your own own left wing nonsense of 2 wrongs making a right, lol - un believable 

Putting a lol on a child abuse thread that you started is definitely the best way of showing concern.

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Maybe the way to stop all this is to find a way of giving the girls involved some self worth from a very young age. I know it’s radical, but let’s get to the root of the problem, fixing poverty.

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3 hours ago, graveyard johnny said:

the usual sounding names on the published list so far- that's a fact- a fact that has been published on the bbc news website (before any loonie left wing do gooders want this thread locking), turns my stomach over to think how these poor  young girls must have suffered at the hands of so called adults that should be classed in the law lower than rats.

Are you posting this to raise the awareness of truly despicable crimes or to point out that the alleged perpetrators have usual sounding names and are basically a racist

 

If it's the latter, then you;re a complete idiot

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1 minute ago, Mark S said:

Maybe the way to stop all this is to find a way of giving the girls involved some self worth from a very young age. I know it’s radical, but let’s get to the root of the problem, fixing poverty.

I am not sure there is much correlation.  Poor girls might be more vulnerable, and I agree that the root of the problem should be tackled.  But, it seems to happen across a terrible cross section of backgrounds.

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11 minutes ago, Mark S said:

Maybe the way to stop all this is to find a way of giving the girls involved some self worth from a very young age. I know it’s radical, but let’s get to the root of the problem, fixing poverty.

I think you may find your statement is otherwise known as victim blaming.

These gangs are very devious.  They act as boyfriends and then gradually control the girls.  It isn't hard to do if you are an older male dealing with girls just entering or not long into puberty in particular.  While I am sure some girls will have low self worth that is not a prerequisite to being groomed by older males.  Older males often hold a fascination for teenage girls and it becomes more and more difficult for them to challenge the eventual abuse because they are teenage girls and don't know what to do when they begin to feel uncomfortable.  They may also be hooked on something by that stage and/or imprisoned and/or beholden in some way to an individual or to the gang as a whole.  On top of all that by the time they become desperate their self worth is actually crushed because they feel uncomfortable, perhaps even abused, but cannot see a way out and so they begin to believe that is all they are worth.  

Poverty has stuff all to do with sexual abuse.  Girls from all backgrounds can be drawn in.

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2 hours ago, gingerjon said:

When some people make comments about the names of the accused here looking familiar it is always worth pointing out that child abuse occurs in all sections of society. And that does not diminish the suffering of the victims here - rather it says we should all be vigilant and aware or else we’ll be blind to abuse in the future.

As has been pointed out when this subject has been discussed before, Asian males - and usually they are predominantly of Pakistani origin - almost always work in gangs in this context.  Non-Asian males tend to work as individuals.  The abuse is abuse but the scale and reach is different and so is the way in which they must be approached, for very obvious reasons.  

These girls were abused for years prior to 2012.  I am quite sure Huddersfield will not be the last of these cases, and these are just the historic ones (of which there have now been quite a few recently dealt with, finally).  

Edited by Saintslass

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21 minutes ago, Mark S said:

Maybe the way to stop all this is to find a way of giving the girls involved some self worth from a very young age. I know it’s radical, but let’s get to the root of the problem, fixing poverty.

How do you know the victims were living in poverty?

The root of the problem is surely the behaviour of the perpetrators.

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22 minutes ago, Kenilworth Tiger said:

Are you posting this to raise the awareness of truly despicable crimes or to point out that the alleged perpetrators have usual sounding names and are basically a racist

 

If it's the latter, then you;re a complete idiot

If we don't accept that there appears to be a cultural and criminal problem with a small element of one particular identifiable community, then we are all idiots.

I'm not sure that name-calling people who point this out is a sensible approach, particularly after we have seen the consequences of not having dealt with the problem adequately over a period of many years.

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26 minutes ago, Kenilworth Tiger said:

Are you posting this to raise the awareness of truly despicable crimes or to point out that the alleged perpetrators have usual sounding names and are basically a racist

 

If it's the latter, then you;re a complete idiot

Ah right.  Well, aside from Martyn's point (which is very important IMO), do you not think that if you see the name Smith then the person may be, say, English or American or Australian?  But if you see the name Schmidt they may be German or Austrian?  Would that be you being racist if you considered those possibilities?  No, that's right, you wouldn't be.  So why is it racist to see the name Ahmed or Mohammed and not think those individuals may be Asian?  They are both as common in Asia as Smith and Jones are in the UK.

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35 minutes ago, Kenilworth Tiger said:

Are you posting this to raise the awareness of truly despicable crimes or to point out that the alleged perpetrators have usual sounding names and are basically a racist

 

If it's the latter, then you;re a complete idiot

of course names and religions are a race, how silly of me?

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18 minutes ago, Martyn Sadler said:

If we don't accept that there appears to be a cultural and criminal problem with a small element of one particular identifiable community, then we are all idiots.

I'm not sure that name-calling people who point this out is a sensible approach, particularly after we have seen the consequences of not having dealt with the problem adequately over a period of many years.

I’ll accept that on the sole condition that it’s an all-inclusive one relating to all classes, groups, nationalities and religions that are performing the abuse. 

Better yet, why not just look at the wider pattern of humans doing despicable things because they can and they are given shelter by weakness, be it an unwillingness to be called racist, a criminal  deceit when covering up for those within their “establishment” circle or simply because it’s too easy to ignore the victims. 

If someone is unwilling to take the same moral stance against vile criminals hiding in western establishment circles as they do against vile criminals hiding in Muslim communities then that tells me one hell of a lot about them. 

A vile criminal is a vile criminal regardless of their cultural background. 

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5 minutes ago, ckn said:

I’ll accept that on the sole condition that it’s an all-inclusive one relating to all classes, groups, nationalities and religions that are performing the abuse. 

Better yet, why not just look at the wider pattern of humans doing despicable things because they can and they are given shelter by weakness, be it an unwillingness to be called racist, a criminal  deceit when covering up for those within their “establishment” circle or simply because it’s too easy to ignore the victims. 

If someone is unwilling to take the same moral stance against vile criminals hiding in western establishment circles as you do against vile criminals hiding in Muslim communities then that tells me one hell of a lot about them. 

A vile criminal is a vile criminal regardless of their cultural background. 

thanks ckn- cant we just say that there is a huge chip on the shoulder of muslim  men when it comes to westernised white women? 

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5 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

thanks ckn- cant we just say that there is a huge chip on the shoulder of muslim  men when it comes to westernised white women? 

As long as you’re willing to say that all Catholic priests see young boys as fair game. No?

SOME, and by some I mean a tiny and unrepresentative minority, of Muslim men are as you describe. Same as with all other groups known to have an abuse problem. 

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16 minutes ago, ckn said:

A vile criminal is a vile criminal regardless of their cultural background. 

And if there weren't other agendas at work here that would be enough. Vile is the word and we shouldn't make light of it in any way or use it for other reasons.

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33 minutes ago, ckn said:

A vile criminal is a vile criminal regardless of their cultural background. 

I don't think you will find anyone who disagrees with that, nor anyone who will not condemn such behaviour from anyone who commits it.

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21 minutes ago, ckn said:

As long as you’re willing to say that all Catholic priests see young boys as fair game. No?

SOME, and by some I mean a tiny and unrepresentative minority, of Muslim men are as you describe. Same as with all other groups known to have an abuse problem. 

yes sorry ckn- should have stated not all muslim men- just a minority

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