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RayCee

Qualifying 8's Brief History

Qualifying 8's Brief History  

39 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the current system be retained? 

    • Keep it as it is
      12
    • Keep it with some modifications
      10
    • Scrap it altogether
      17


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I believe few if any would say that the Q 8's aren't exciting. Of course, along with excitement comes anxiety too. Hope coupled with concern as the fate of a club is determined over seven matches. For me it's a great idea but for others too much. Should the current system be retained? 

For greater detail: 

https://rugbyl.blogspot.com/2018/08/uks-qualifying-8s.html

Edited by RayCee

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I think we should go with this:

12th in SL relegated

1st in Championship promoted

Promotion/ Relegation playoff:

Playoff 1- 2nd CH V 5th CH

Playoff 2- 3rd CH V 4th CH

Championship Final:

PO 1 Winner V PO 2 Winner

Promotion Final:

CH Final winner v 11th SL

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1 minute ago, Mr Plow said:

I think we should go with this:

12th in SL relegated

1st in Championship promoted

Promotion/ Relegation playoff:

Playoff 1- 2nd CH V 5th CH

Playoff 2- 3rd CH V 4th CH

Championship Final:

PO 1 Winner V PO 2 Winner

Promotion Final:

CH Final winner v 11th SL

So that system would guarantee one promotion and a possible second. That’s well thought out.

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Just now, RayCee said:

So that system would guarantee one promotion and a possible second. That’s well thought out.

It's what they do in Scottish football. They also have a similar system in Germany and France where they have automatic P and R but also have a promotion/relegation playoff.

i think RL had a similar system between the Championship and League 1 years ago maybe circa 2004ish

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Great, EXCEPT it isn’t a complete solution. How do the SL clubs get the 14 league games they believe that they need to get revenue from? There is only really one way to do that without some complicated perversion of the fixture list and that’s to have 14 clubs in SL.

That means 2 more clubs on SL rations from the cash pie with a resulting reduction for the championship. Once that happens then the championship sides will have even less chance of making a sustainable entry into SL than they do now. So how do you justify promoting 2 of them???

Also, the relegated SL sides will likely get a parachute payment each so the likelihood is that they’ll just wipe the floor with the remaining championship clubs, who will have even less money than they do now and fewer quality players to choose from. So what has been achieved?

Of course it might work if suddenly RL clubs were able to significantly increase their revenue and magic up a bigger pool of quality players. But I don’t see that happening anytime soon!

if there’s got to be PR then 1 up 1 down.

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Unless I'm missing something, I think you're on the wrong thread WT, interesting as you post is. This is about the Qualifying 8's, not Super 8's. 

First impressions of the poll surprise me with so many wanting the whole Q 8's scrapped. I assume that means those voting nah want either a closed shop SL or an automatic  one up one down situation. The Q 8's have created much excitement with not that much movement up and down. That's what a poll is for, to see what the populous really want. It's not the first time a vote has surprised me. 

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I literally have no idea how that works and I’ve sat and looked at it for a good five minutes. Is because it’s before 7am and it’s a lot simpler than it looks? Perhaps but how it’s a fair system when teams effectively lose points, as with the case of Cas and Wakefield, it’s, therefore, a system I want no doing with. 

 

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1 hour ago, Bomb Jack said:

Why isn't there an "I don't give a monkey's " option?   😀

There is. It’s called opting out.

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I personally like the 8s , it gives real incentives to stay out of the middle 8s and provides hope for the clubs below to strive for something greater. Only downside is we dont have enough cash in our game to help the ones that have a go. Toronto, Toulouse and Red Star Belgrade can see a way to the top table now rather than it been a locked down top league with no hope for ambitious clubs below

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3 hours ago, iangidds said:

I personally like the 8s , it gives real incentives to stay out of the middle 8s and provides hope for the clubs below to strive for something greater. Only downside is we dont have enough cash in our game to help the ones that have a go. Toronto, Toulouse and Red Star Belgrade can see a way to the top table now rather than it been a locked down top league with no hope for ambitious clubs below

The Qualifiers award failure though. How can 9th be relegated but 12th stay up. Same goes for the championship, 4th could be promoted but 1st might have a bad run of games and not make the top 3 or MPG. 

I do enjoy the Qualifiers but I think there are better way of doing P and R, as I mentioned earlier in the thread perhaps a promotion/relegation playoff along with 1 up 1 down would work 

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19 hours ago, Mr Plow said:

I think we should go with this:

12th in SL relegated

1st in Championship promoted

Promotion/ Relegation playoff:

Playoff 1- 2nd CH V 5th CH

Playoff 2- 3rd CH V 4th CH

Championship Final:

PO 1 Winner V PO 2 Winner

Promotion Final:

CH Final winner v 11th SL

Bit rubbish for 11th SL with two weeks without a game then thrust into a relegation game. Maybe shift them in to the relegation playoffs and, and 5th in Championship out. 

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1 hour ago, Spidey said:

Bit rubbish for 11th SL with two weeks without a game then thrust into a relegation game. Maybe shift them in to the relegation playoffs and, and 5th in Championship out. 

Yeah you could. Or have 10th v 11th play each other so there's only 1 week before the final

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I think the idea of p/r is part of sport in the UK, but cases like the Bradford Bulls and their spiral downward puts some off. However, I see that as a freakish situation that isn’t typical.

Others like Leigh try to establish themselves at the top but are now resigned to not getting there. A let down for their supporters.

With only 12 sides in SL, it means in any given season, even top sides like Leeds can have their SL place put at risk if they have a poor season. The gap between success and failure is very small.

So it would help if there were more SL teams but game can’t afford that. When teams from France, Canada or elsewhere come along, there is a group of RL fans who are less than welcoming, even if they will add value with wealthy backers and the chance to spread the game and its popularity to a wider audience. 

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So there you have it. A typical RL reaction. No consensus. Maybe that’s a reflection of modern day society. Very individual, independent and differing.

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I'd scrap it even though I think it actually has achieved what it set out to, and has made the championship more exciting for neutrals.

The reason I fall on the side of scrapping it is more to do with me having to repeatedly explain the concept to casual fans who I work with, which can't be doing us any favours in attracting these fans over permanently, and also that it feels a bit gimmicky.

i like 2 leagues of 12. 2 up, 2 down, could have a playoff from 2-5 in the championship for the second promotion place. Top five play offs in Super league.

i concede this leaves a few fixtures to find as an issue to get more than 11 home fixtures.

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2 hours ago, Markos said:

I'd scrap it even though I think it actually has achieved what it set out to, and has made the championship more exciting for neutrals.

The reason I fall on the side of scrapping it is more to do with me having to repeatedly explain the concept to casual fans who I work with, which can't be doing us any favours in attracting these fans over permanently, and also that it feels a bit gimmicky.

i like 2 leagues of 12. 2 up, 2 down, could have a playoff from 2-5 in the championship for the second promotion place. Top five play offs in Super league.

i concede this leaves a few fixtures to find as an issue to get more than 11 home fixtures.

If 11 home games isn't enough why don't the RFL restructure the Challenge Cup so SL clubs enter earlier and bring back the Northern Rail Cup for the Championship and L1

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2 hours ago, Mr Plow said:

If 11 home games isn't enough why don't the RFL restructure the Challenge Cup so SL clubs enter earlier and bring back the Northern Rail Cup for the Championship and L1

My concern the challenge cup part would be two fold; one it would potentially lead to huge mismatches and two unless you rigged the draw you couldn’t guarantee more home fixtures for anyone. 

Resurrecting a lower league comp works well for those clubs I think, as it remains competitive and could be done in regional groups.

That would just leave the super league clubs around 4 home games shy of what they have now.

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4 hours ago, Markos said:

My concern the challenge cup part would be two fold; one it would potentially lead to huge mismatches and two unless you rigged the draw you couldn’t guarantee more home fixtures for anyone. 

Resurrecting a lower league comp works well for those clubs I think, as it remains competitive and could be done in regional groups.

That would just leave the super league clubs around 4 home games shy of what they have now.

Big problem with the 8s is teams are playing each other too many times. I think less is more, we need quality over quantity. If the clubs want more games expand to 14 teams. 

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