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It’s Ottawa in 2020 says Eric Perez

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2 minutes ago, JM2010 said:

I don't think it should just be for new clubs. It should be a minimum criteria for all clubs.

I don't have a problem with shared academies for the elite players as I think they have their benefits.

So how do you force a club to produce SL quality players ?

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15 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Well the Hull clubs do , that they believe that there isn't enough quality juniors within their area to run 2 academies of a competitive standard is the worry ? , 

Similarily Salford are essentially feeding from the same table of juniors as Wigan,Wire and Saints , and because of that they get 4th pick which again makes producing players of SL standard very difficult for Salford , I have plenty of arguments with fellow Leigh fans about us not running an academy , we have tried , but due quite simply to not being able to entice enough quality to compete makes it a worthless enterprise 

The situation with the NA teams is slightly different , the suggestion made by Mr Perez was that they'd convert Gridiron players , that won't happen , they just do not have the skill set required , the only chance of finding genuine NA ( Canadian ) Pro RL players is to find Union players who have some RL experience ( possibly Pacific Island background ) as juniors , but even that will need a coach who is willing to take the risk , rather than just pick up SL/Championship/NRL and lower tier Aussies/Kiwis 

I know for a fact though that those big clubs also go looking across the Pennines for players and up into Cumbria etc. Perhaps all clubs should broaden their search area, including the Hull clubs? Regardless Salford cut their academy because of costs more than anything, they're skint and everyone knows it. Leigh I can appreciate have that problem but they are also a division below the 4 SL teams.

I take your point on North American development of players, but after 3ish years without signing Canadian RU players (probably 7s players at that) I don't think its realistic at the moment. This is compounded again like you say by coaches who are risk averse. IMO the more teams and the more profile would logically make more people consider it an aspiration to play RL in NA - and indeed I think that it could, if sold right, work for increasing interest in youngsters over here too. 

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25 minutes ago, JM2010 said:

I don't think it should just be for new clubs. It should be a minimum criteria for all clubs.

I don't have a problem with shared academies for the elite players as I think they have their benefits.

I agree but can you see the problem with imposing criteria with the current crop in SL? Next it becomes quality of stadia, that's Wakefield and Cas kicked out. Ok well its x% of stadia filled every week: that's a number of clubs gone. How about spending up to the cap, again nearly a quarter of the league start worrying. 

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10 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

I know for a fact though that those big clubs also go looking across the Pennines for players and up into Cumbria etc. Perhaps all clubs should broaden their search area, including the Hull clubs? Regardless Salford cut their academy because of costs more than anything, they're skint and everyone knows it. Leigh I can appreciate have that problem but they are also a division below the 4 SL teams.

I take your point on North American development of players, but after 3ish years without signing Canadian RU players (probably 7s players at that) I don't think its realistic at the moment. This is compounded again like you say by coaches who are risk averse. IMO the more teams and the more profile would logically make more people consider it an aspiration to play RL in NA - and indeed I think that it could, if sold right, work for increasing interest in youngsters over here too. 

Again how do you force clubs to produce players of a set standard ?

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1 hour ago, GUBRATS said:

So how do you force a club to produce SL quality players ?

There's no guarantee on producing SL quality players so I'm with you there.

Maybe the criteria could be based on funding with X amount of each team's central funding ringfenced for schools and community club development. 

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On 05/04/2019 at 19:58, bbfaz said:

Cakers gonna cake.

You mean canker...your comments are like a recurring canker sore...

Yes indeed, thats what you meant...now it all makes sense!

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On 05/04/2019 at 22:54, bbfaz said:

So essentially you have nothing to contribute to this discussion?  Are you aware of the word "wasteman" and how it applies to you?

 

On 05/04/2019 at 22:57, bbfaz said:

In order:

Suburbs, out east, can't remember, think it was Oshawa.

Good for you, you must've lived somewhere better than she did.  My tourist friends have always been stunned at how bad the public transport is in Toronto.

Expensive for what it is.  London isn't so expensive when you are earning pounds, though pricey for tourists.

There has been a history of lies perpetuated by any number of sources to drive immigration to Canada going back over 100 years.  They don't hide it, they were trying to talk up the Canadian Prairies as a new home for skilled British farmers pre-First World War.  The immigration department spent 2m in 2 years on Facebook advertising alone, so much for the queue of people.  Conservative/nativist politicians in Canada are kicking up such a fuss about the current immigration system, the current government launched a website to sing the praises of immigration and the current system.  It's a bit of a mess tbh.

I think that my sister's experiences are more representative than people would like to believe.  Anecdotally, looking at places like Quora or Reddit, it's full of horror stories that you might be a highly-educated engineer in your home country but it's likely that your qualifications won't be recognised and you'll end up driving a taxi or working as a cashier, trapped in your situation because of disproportionately high costs of living.  You think it'll happen to somebody else, somebody from Pakistan or China, but it can happen to anybody.  Hey, not everywhere is sweetness and light.  Everywhere has problems.  Male life expectancy in the East End of Glasgow and the North End of Winnipeg aren't dissimilar and are worse than some developing world countries.  The difference is that one country isn't in denial that there's a massive problem, the other one is.

I also love how you assume I'm "ethnic".  If you're going to start worrying that I'm not Anglo-Saxon, get your word origins right and learn that caker came from the Italian community.

Please tell me you live alone...for the Love of Mike...don't tell me that...that...that....

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On 05/04/2019 at 22:57, bbfaz said:

Suburbs, out east, can't remember, think it was Oshawa.

Oshawa is way out there. Barely “Toronto.” I don’t think far outer suburbs in many cities have what your sister seems to have been looking for honestly. You’re going to depend on a car and have mostly chain restaurants to choose from. But that’s a lot different from Toronto itself.

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6 minutes ago, westside said:

So the St Helens chairman says he wants Toulouse in SL instead of Toronto (or Ottawa or New York) because there is too much competition from rugby union in North America. Huh?!

http://www.rlnews.co.uk/reports-sl-wants-seat-at-expansion-meeting-saints-chair-favours-different-path/

The "no away fans" argument has reared its head again.  I wouldn't be surprised to see both bids knocked back at this rate.

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This comment from the St Helens Chairman makes no sense. In fact, it is illogical.

France has the strongest professional rugby union clubs in the NH.  There are literally three levels of Pro Rugby Union in France and their clubs are the richest in the world.

By his logic no clubs should be in France then because its the Mecca of professional rugby union in the NH.

 

 

Edited by CanadianRugger
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2 minutes ago, CanadianRugger said:

This comment from the St Helens Chairman makes no sense. In fact, it is illogical.

France has the strongest professional rugby union club in the NH.  There are literally three levels of Pro Rugby Union in France and their clubs are the richest in the world.

By his logic no clubs should be in France then because its the Mecca of professional rugby union in the NH.

 

 

Exactly. If he had said hockey or football that’s one thing, but RU makes no sense at all and I like both codes.

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The big concern is SL stating that they will pull the drawbridge up and exclude whichever of the foreign teams they want, even if they win the Champ. Which they will, because their pea brains won't see that 8 English SL sides + NA tv deal > 11 English SL sides.

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11 minutes ago, Chamey said:

The big concern is SL stating that they will pull the drawbridge up and exclude whichever of the foreign teams they want, even if they win the Champ. Which they will, because their pea brains won't see that 8 English SL sides + NA tv deal > 11 English SL sides.

I've been saying since the beginning.  The biggest danger to the TWP and other upstart League Franchises in NA, France and elsewhere is the RFL and Super League clubs themselves.

The RFL and clubs come from Pro-Brexit areas, they don't want expansion anymore than they want to remain in the EU.  It's all about Making England Great Again as if it were 1955.

  • Haha 1

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Just now, CanadianRugger said:

I've been saying since the beginning.  The biggest danger to the TWP and other upstart League Franchises in NA, France and elsewhere is the RFL and Super League clubs themselves.

The RFL and clubs come from Pro-Brexit areas, they don't want expansion anymore than they want to remain in the EU.  It's all about Making England Great Again as if it were 1955.

It's more clear all the time that having those upstate franchises in the same league as the small time away fan-dependent traditional clubs is a mix of oil and water.

A whole new transatlantic league is needed for the upstarts.

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8 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

Steve Mascord's take on things does not make encouraging reading.

"And, finally, three: if we accept them, how much money can we screw them for? How much can we bend them over? These guys are clearly desperate and cashed up. We’re not."

Sums up the approach to expansionism pretty well.

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8 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

It's more clear all the time that having those upstate franchises in the same league as the small time away fan-dependent traditional clubs is a mix of oil and water.

A whole new transatlantic league is needed for the upstarts.

The issue being that the new upstarts are not particularly wedded to rugby league. See: TWP's community development actions.

Edited by Chamey

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6 minutes ago, Chamey said:

The issue being that the new upstarts are not particularly wedded to rugby league. See: TWP's community development actions.

In fact they are, because the transatlantic aspect is key to their prospects for success and RL is the only sport which doesn't already have entrenched interests strong enough to block a new transatlantic league from taking flight.

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Rugby league really is like a parralel universe compared to other sports. Here you have Ottawa and Nyc bids asking Batley, Dewsbury and co if they can come play. With a distinct possibility they may say no. It beggars belief really and would be hilarious if it wasn't so true.  

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5 hours ago, Big Picture said:

The "no away fans" argument has reared its head again.  I wouldn't be surprised to see both bids knocked back at this rate.

Some of the things he's stuff do make sense though.

Away fan numbers have dropped over the years, most likely due to TV schedules making it difficult for them to attend. I'm not sure the solution, but the of Saturday evening TV spot is one I miss. They were far easier to attend and they really felt like a day out rate than a sprint to and from the ground. I think clubs need to find ways to maximise time spent at the ground.

The way to get around minimising the impact of travel for/against the overseas clubs is to be a large enough league to not have to play them all home and away. NRL doesn't play everyone. If you have 4 overseas teams, find a structure that allows playing 2 at home and 2 away.

Edited by Wellsy4HullFC

Wells%20Motors%20(Signature)_zps67e534e4.jpg

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On 06/04/2019 at 10:04, GUBRATS said:

Again how do you force clubs to produce players of a set standard ?

Through squad limits, quotas and the structure of salary caps. 

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