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The whole article is available but I found this bit the most interesting,

 

“We also had to dovetail that with actual stadium availability. Can you actually get on a ground at a particular day? When you don’t have a national stadium, you become a taker of a day rather than a maker of a day."

It's about a possible return to the Ashes Series but with regard to the above comment surely he should be working on changing this if it's such a big issue.

 

Also some of the best articles on our sport come from the Yorkshire Post.

 

Here's the URL

http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/return-of-ashes-series-possible-as-nigel-wood-adopts-bullish-approach-1-8281418

2 warning points:kolobok_dirol:  Non-Political

 

 

 

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Please somebody get rid of Big Nigel. A true weight around the neck of RL.

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Now the positives....

 

there was a total of 132,655 (18,951 per match), compared to 128,065 (18,295 per match) in 2011.

So an increase in crowds despite the bad choice of venues according to the majority of keyboard warriors on this forum.

 

Coventry ......30 per cent, maybe 35 per cent, of ticket purchases came from within an hour of that venue. These are people who would not ordinarily get to see rugby league.

New market..expansion...do we want a national game or not..make your minds up ...

 

40,000 in to watch a final (Australia v New Zealand) without the home team in it....“That’s more than Australia v New Zealand got when they played in Perth.

Despite the negative comments about Anfield not being suitable..a healthy crowd in yet another expansion area.

 

Not all doom and gloom unless your a flat capper ;-)

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The whole article is available but I found this bit the most interesting,

 

“We also had to dovetail that with actual stadium availability. Can you actually get on a ground at a particular day? When you don’t have a national stadium, you become a taker of a day rather than a maker of a day."

Well when you don't have a coherent international calendar planned well in advance and only decide the tournament and fixtures at the 11th hour, then yes it probably is diifficult to get the grounds on the days and times that they would like...

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Well when you don't have a coherent international calendar planned well in advance and only decide the tournament and fixtures at the 11th hour, then yes it probably is diifficult to get the grounds on the days and times that they would like...

That's the issue. A sufficiently planned international calendar is a must.

I've not seen that many posts criticising crowds, but we can certainly do better. It's not like the RFL have only just started doing Internationals.

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How can a serious journalist claim that a venue in the north for a game V the kangaroos would get a bigger crowd when we've fairly recently not filled Wigan for a game against them?

 

That may well be true... Then again, not that it would ever happen, I guess we continue to build all national facilities down London way - a good way to continue to reinforce the balance between South and North...

 

Then again I guess we are saying that whilst people may well travel down South to a facility, not many will bother travelling to the North.

 

Why not able to fill Wigan for the game you mention has to do with more than its location being up North.   I guess it isn't as attractive to the mind as some other Cities to the non average RL fan when trying to promote a game to persons more likely to be attracted to sporting events.

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Why not able to fill Wigan for the game you mention has to do with more than its location being up North.   I guess it isn't as attractive to the mind as some other Cities to the non average RL fan when trying to promote a game to persons more likely to be attracted to sporting events.

 

I think that's right. Not many non-regular RL fans in the south will travel up north for an international, just for the event.

But what would be interesting is if games at iconic northern stadiums can attract more northern non-regular fans. Must still be thousands of untapped potential fans in the north for an 'event' game.

 

Is there any way to find out how many of those who attended the Anfield final weren't regular fans? Difficult if postcodes is all the RFL have, but maybe City of Liverpool and City of Manchester postcodes could perhaps tel them something.

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40,000 in to watch a final (Australia v New Zealand) without the home team in it....“That’s more than Australia v New Zealand got when they played in Perth.

Despite the negative comments about Anfield not being suitable..a healthy crowd in yet another expansion area.

 

 

They'd struggle to get 40,000 into a stadium that only holds 20,000 but I get the journos point.

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This apologetic thinking really does highlight that Wood is completely out of his depth regarding anything other than counting beans.

 

His tournament director stated that his target was sell outs at all venues - he failed miserably. Now we are making excuses and filing back through the records to try and make cheap comparisons. We are about the same as we were 5 years ago despite posting crowds of 45k, 67k, 74k, 44k for games in 2013 and 2015. Whoopee!!

 

He should not be making excuses. He should be saying this wasn't good enough and lessons need to be learned and fast. If venues had been secured 2 years out I am convinced they would have got the kick off times and days they were hoping for. Scratching around in February/March was a disgrace.

 

I have no faith we can deliver big in 2021 never mind get 150k for 3 Ashes tests.

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Someone should be asking Nigel if he thought placing some adverts on the London Underground for a two week period, three weeks or so before the game, was enough to guarantee a bigger crowd than the last one at the Olympic Park.

As Scubby said the objective was to sell out all stadia. It would be good to know what the plans were in place for doing that, not just here in London, but at all other stadia. RL fans living in those locations would be better placed than me to say what activities took place to promote the games and encourage greater ticket sales.

Apart from the hardcore RL fans in London, no one would even know a game in Wigan was taking place, so naturally very few would travel. But if these things were promoted more widely, who knows how many more might travel to towns and cities around the country.

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Someone should be asking Nigel if he thought placing some adverts on the London Underground for a two week period, three weeks or so before the game, was enough to guarantee a bigger crowd than the last one at the Olympic Park.

As Scubby said the objective was to sell out all stadia. It would be good to know what the plans were in place for doing that, not just here in London, but at all other stadia. RL fans living in those locations would be better placed than me to say what activities took place to promote the games and encourage greater ticket sales.

Apart from the hardcore RL fans in London, no one would even know a game in Wigan was taking place, so naturally very few would travel. But if these things were promoted more widely, who knows how many more might travel to towns and cities around the country.

 

We couldn't even sell out Workington FFS. Just stick it on a few months before and they will come regardless doesn't work anywhere.

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We couldn't even sell out Workington FFS. Just stick it on a few months before and they will come regardless doesn't work anywhere.

 

That says more about how 'big' our game actually is, despite you me, and the vast majority of RL supporters believing it to be the greatest game in the world. Until it's accepted that RL is actually not that big, or popular, the game will never grow and expand in the UK.

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Coventry ......30 per cent, maybe 35 per cent, of ticket purchases came from within an hour of that venue. These are people who would not ordinarily get to see rugby league.

New market..expansion...do we want a national game or not..make your minds up ...

 

It is a national game. It's played all around England and Wales to various levels. Hence the RFL take games around the country as our audience is not just an M62 one, it is countrywide.

 

Of course they ordinarily get to see an RL game because it's plastered all over SKY and the BBC have run all the big games for decades.

 

I am not surprised thousands of midlands people bought a ticket for the game was a top class RL game.

If we put the same game on in Southampton we'd no doubt sell thousands of tickets locally there too. 

 

But it's not "New market"...."Expansion"......

 

You've been listening to the bone headed idea that if thousands of people are attracted to go watch a top class RL International outside off the M62, they'll all then go away and start junior clubs, and get their kids playing the game, and feeding talent into the Coventry RL club, and more locals will then go watch Coventry and Coventry will attract local investment and climb the league and get more fans watching, more kids playing and even more investment.

 

But that isn't a reality and the RFL did not put a game in Coventry for that. Do we think the only people who watch RL on television come from the M62?? They watch it all over the country.

 

This was the chance to reward our nationwide fans with a big game in their area that is all. It was not introducing the game to people who never knew about Rugby League until it hit Coventry. Many Union people went apparently (I went to England/Aussie at Twickenham but I'm not starting a kids RU team) and a lot of the dads took their kids to be flag bearers for the England team and had a great day as one poster told us on here. After which the kids "went back to their RU clubs".

 

I know you didn't start this naive nonsense, but your not doing reality any favours repeating this "play as many Internationals as possible" magic solution to all the game's Ill's.  

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You've been listening to the bone headed idea that if thousands of people are attracted to go watch a top class RL International outside off the M62, they'll all then go away and start junior clubs, and get their kids playing the game, and feeding talent into the Coventry RL club, and more locals will then go watch Coventry and Coventry will attract local investment and climb the league and get more fans watching, more kids playing and even more investment.

Do you have any evidence that this is a bone headed idea and that what you describe above wouldn't happen? Unfortunately your arguments lack substance.

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That says more about how 'big' our game actually is, despite you me, and the vast majority of RL supporters believing it to be the greatest game in the world. Until it's accepted that RL is actually not that big, or popular, the game will never grow and expand in the UK.

 

Well said Les...

 

This is the other bone headed idea that somehow we don't get the gates we think we should get at out internationals because we don't promote them enough, the "market them until they a sell out" nonsense.

 

This is as you say based on the idea we love Rugby League and therefore the rest of the country should love it too, that they don't come must be because they don't know about the game.

 

The BBC have pumped RL out on nationwide television for all the years I have watched the game so of course all sports fans know RL and will have seen it. I'm sure Millions are not interested because they like Rugby Union, tens of Millions are not Interested because they like soccer, or some other sport, millions because they think RL is boring, tens of Millions because they don't like sport, Millions because they can't afford to go if they wanted to etc.

 

But hey ho, play Internationals all over Britain, and spend massive amounts marketing them to death, and if they don't sell out it's always Mr. Wood's fault.  

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Do you have any evidence that this is a bone headed idea and that what you describe above wouldn't happen? Unfortunately your arguments lack substance.

 

When the magical solutions to all the games Ill's were announced to us as play more internationals regularly around the country, and market them heavily until they sell out I asked for more than just a couple of "one liners" I wanted some substance as to how this would work.

 

I said you can't market things so heavily all your profits are gone, and you can't assume that well marketed Rugby League would automatically grow crowds up and up and up year after year.

 

I wan't given any substance at all. Given a lot of stick though ;)

 

Why don't you abandon silly one liners and set out for me how this is supposed to work when in reality playing big events around the country is something we have done for years - want the evidence for that??

 

The reality is that there aren't Millions of sports fans outside the M62 who don't know RL, as I say above it's been on the national telly for 50 odd years now and they have seen it. The reality is marketing is OK getting fans in but at some point nobody else wants to come - even if it's free like that Salford game.

 

I've lots of arguments that this is boneheaded and naive which have substance and logic, which you dismiss in a sentence.

 

But I see no argument from you as to how these things are a great idea?? let's hear something.

 

Because all I hear when crowds disappoint is the usual it's all the RFL's fault. 

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Nah brothers and sisters, how you spread a game is to hide it from everyone not born into it in a weirdly incestuous manner. Then declare nobody else is interested.

 

How on earth is our game hidden from the rest of the country when it's been on terrestrial nationwide TV for over 50 years, and post free gangway everyone in the country has been able to take it up and take it up they have in just about every county.

 

We ran Superleague clubs in the North east (soccer country)Bridgend (union country) and London (all sports country) a city that has hosted internationals and CC finals for decades

 

Yet there's this small cabal that think nobody outside the M62 knows about Rugby league.........

 

.........and if we just take the game around the country and heavily market big events it will boom!!!

 

Remember the first Millenium magic in Cardiff 

 

Remember the first Scottish Milleniun Magic in Edingburgh......

 

We've actually been there and we have actually done that.........

 

So I have evidence most people are not interested in Rugby league 

 

Jeez most people in Liverpool, Manchester and Sheffield are not interested and these are northern cities in Rugby league land that stage big games ;)

 

What's your evidence the country is bursting to take up RL Johnoco or Mr. Geek?

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When the magical solutions to all the games Ill's were announced to us as play more internationals regularly around the country, and market them heavily until they sell out I asked for more than just a couple of "one liners" I wanted some substance as to how this would work.

Which people have provide in countless threads and you have chosen to dismiss. That doesn't mean their arguments are any less worthy than your own.

 

I said you can't market things so heavily all your profits are gone, and you can't assume that well marketed Rugby League would automatically grow crowds up and up and up year after year.

I don't recall anybody suggesting that the RFL's marketing budget should exceed their projected profits

 

 

I wan't given any substance at all. Given a lot of stick though ;)

Which you are happy to dish out as well, such as describing people's arguments as "bone-headed and naive".

 

 

Why don't you abandon silly one liners and set out for me how this is supposed to work when in reality playing big events around the country is something we have done for years - want the evidence for that??

No thanks - I enjoy delivering "silly one liners". I have also repeatedly told you that I have explained my thoughts on expanding the international game on numerous threads, and so won't be repeating myself as it would be a waste of time as you will most likely dismiss the ideas as "bone-headed and naive".

 

If you were genuinely interested then you would search back through my post history. However, I don't think you are genuinely interested, because you appear to have already made your mind up on the topic (which is entirely your prerogative).

 

The reality is that there aren't Millions of sports fans outside the M62 who don't know RL,

Yes there are. I can only assume that you live near the M62 corridor, as you don't seem to understand that many people in the south don't even know there are 2 types of rugby. However, you will most likely dismiss this point as I haven't conducted a rigourous scientific study that has been published in a peer-reviewed journal that supports this view.

 

 

I've lots of arguments that this is boneheaded and naive which have substance and logic

Only in your opinion. In my opinion your arguments lack substance and logic. It's all a matter of opinion.

 

 

But I see no argument from you as to how these things are a great idea?? let's hear something.

If I honestly thought that you had an open mind on this then I would provide you with an argument. But I don't, so I'll stick to my "silly one liners" instead thanks.

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The BBC have pumped RL out on nationwide television for all the years I have watched the game so of course all sports fans know RL and will have seen it. I'm sure Millions are not interested because they like Rugby Union, tens of Millions are not Interested because they like soccer, or some other sport, millions because they think RL is boring, tens of Millions because they don't like sport, Millions because they can't afford to go if they wanted to etc.

 

 

The BBC's coverage of  RL is half hearted to say the least.  They have been using the same graphics for the Challenge Cup, Super League Show n 4 nations  for the last few seasons.  In the case of the CC, other  major sporting events they will market weeks before nut with the CC they will only announce it on that week , they also do it sporadically.   Every other sports programs get new graphics each season...so it adds to the impression that it is stayed n old.  Having worked for the BBC I know if they put their mind to  it they could do a documentary on the hatching of an egg..pump marketing into it n attract huge audiences....ok slight exaggeration ..but if they want success they achieve it..it all depends who is pulling the strings. 

 

For my mind  RFL  n IRFL  should promote the RLWC more...it is older than Unions  by decades yet somehow when people think of  The Rugby World Cup union springs to mind...RL  needs to claim it back  as the original World Cup...

 

Someone mentioned venues been announced.. I was looking at The British n Irish Lions tour to NZ next year...all the matches n stadium have already been confirmed ...that is how far ahead RL needs to plan.   

 

 

BTW here is the fixtures for that tour  ,I only mention it because this is the kind of thing RL should be doing.   

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38233542

 

 

I read Lewis Jones biography n he talked about not only in GB tour   New Zealand but Aus as well then back to  New Zealand ..i appreciate we can't have as long tours but give the public something meaty to watch then they more likely to get behind it...think they also toured France before start of tour.  

 

Anyway my main point is if you only do things half heartedly of course you not going to get big following...personally I agree with others marketing is important ,it also got to be fresh. Which the beeb's ain't. 

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That says more about how 'big' our game actually is, despite you me, and the vast majority of RL supporters believing it to be the greatest game in the world. Until it's accepted that RL is actually not that big, or popular, the game will never grow and expand in the UK.

I think a huge percentage recognise the opposite, that RL is actually 'not that big'. Demographics show us that.

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It is a national game. It's played all around England and Wales to various levels. Hence the RFL take games around the country as our audience is not just an M62 one, it is countrywide.

 

Of course they ordinarily get to see an RL game because it's plastered all over SKY and the BBC have run all the big games for decades.

 

I am not surprised thousands of midlands people bought a ticket for the game was a top class RL game.

If we put the same game on in Southampton we'd no doubt sell thousands of tickets locally there too. 

 

But it's not "New market"...."Expansion"......

 

You've been listening to the bone headed idea that if thousands of people are attracted to go watch a top class RL International outside off the M62, they'll all then go away and start junior clubs, and get their kids playing the game, and feeding talent into the Coventry RL club, and more locals will then go watch Coventry and Coventry will attract local investment and climb the league and get more fans watching, more kids playing and even more investment.

 

But that isn't a reality and the RFL did not put a game in Coventry for that. Do we think the only people who watch RL on television come from the M62?? They watch it all over the country.

 

This was the chance to reward our nationwide fans with a big game in their area that is all. It was not introducing the game to people who never knew about Rugby League until it hit Coventry. Many Union people went apparently (I went to England/Aussie at Twickenham but I'm not starting a kids RU team) and a lot of the dads took their kids to be flag bearers for the England team and had a great day as one poster told us on here. After which the kids "went back to their RU clubs".

 

I know you didn't start this naive nonsense, but your not doing reality any favours repeating this "play as many Internationals as possible" magic solution to all the game's Ill's.  

Parky WTF are you on about !!!!!!!

 

Where have I said anything about about anyone going away and starting a junior club,where have I said anything about playing as many internationals as possible ???

 

You are some character for putting words into peoples mouths marra.

 

All I have stated is

1) this years crowds saw a slight rise despite complaints about the venues .

2) 40,000 was a healthy crowd considering England didnt make the final and

3)Coventry had 30/35% of their crowd from within an hours drive.

 

ALL Positive points to lift the doom and gloom merchants out of their pre christmas slumber ..then you come on and attack me for things I have never even mentioned......Guess you been on the sherry three weeks to early pal.

 

The Coventry game IS EXPANSION as it is supporting an area were a Championship 1 club is based.Nowt going on in Hampshire so why go to Southampton ???

 

I keep hearing "lets do this lets do that" and the crowds will come ..well I will tell you something after being involved in the game (at all levels) for over 40 years a lot of people need to realise RL is a small time sport in a massive competitive market and people are living in a fantasy world if they think its something extra special that others are missing out on.

 

But carry on Parky old lad you seem to know everything that's right and wrong about the game.

 

Now back to the points I DID make......Bigger crowds,decent final gate,30% new/local audience at Coventry..wow that's pretty good for a sport with no income no vision and no leadership.

 

Yes not ideal but FFS can we just have some positivity on this forum because its the same old same old day in day out.

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It is a national game. It's played all around England and Wales to various levels. Hence the RFL take games around the country as our audience is not just an M62 one, it is countrywide.

 

Of course they ordinarily get to see an RL game because it's plastered all over SKY and the BBC have run all the big games for decades.

 

I am not surprised thousands of midlands people bought a ticket for the game was a top class RL game.

If we put the same game on in Southampton we'd no doubt sell thousands of tickets locally there too. 

 

But it's not "New market"...."Expansion"......

 

You've been listening to the bone headed idea that if thousands of people are attracted to go watch a top class RL International outside off the M62, they'll all then go away and start junior clubs, and get their kids playing the game, and feeding talent into the Coventry RL club, and more locals will then go watch Coventry and Coventry will attract local investment and climb the league and get more fans watching, more kids playing and even more investment.

 

But that isn't a reality and the RFL did not put a game in Coventry for that. Do we think the only people who watch RL on television come from the M62?? They watch it all over the country.

 

This was the chance to reward our nationwide fans with a big game in their area that is all. It was not introducing the game to people who never knew about Rugby League until it hit Coventry. Many Union people went apparently (I went to England/Aussie at Twickenham but I'm not starting a kids RU team) and a lot of the dads took their kids to be flag bearers for the England team and had a great day as one poster told us on here. After which the kids "went back to their RU clubs".

 

I know you didn't start this naive nonsense, but your not doing reality any favours repeating this "play as many Internationals as possible" magic solution to all the game's Ill's.

Indicating that children and adults cannot be stimulated to get involved in a sport by going to watch a live international, or any sports game, is just not the case at all. How many players, now or in the past, refer to being drawn to RL after watching a game? The majority.

Believing that RLs future lies firmly in the heartlands alone, really is bone headed.

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Unless I've missed it not many posts about the lack of a National Stadium for our sport.

 

I know it's been discussed before but if it's as big an issue as Nigel says it is, what is being done about it?

2 warning points:kolobok_dirol:  Non-Political

 

 

 

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