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Rugby League Nines World Series?


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The World Sevens Series has recently completed its 7th leg in Singapore this weekend, a week after the prestigious Hong Kong Sevens tournemant and moves on to France next. Should rl adopt something similar?

Pros

Increased international competition

Although New Zealand, Fiji and South Africa have dominated the overall series winners titles since 1999, the vast range and number of nations taking part cannot be ignored.

Over 25 nations have historically competed in the series and many of these are additional to nations playing in the RWC; such as Kenya (who just won their first title in Singapore on Sunday) and Portugal. Such is the international aspect of the series that sevens will become an olympic sport at Rio in the summer. The series has given the less well known rugby nations an outlet to interact with the "bigger" nations consistently, something which has been lacking in league.

The opportunity for rugby league to capitalise on gains made in areas such as Ghana, Jamaica and Serbia to increase the "international" credentials of the game would surely be hard to argue against.

Exposure for Rugby League

Despite Scotland and Wales having previously hosted stages on the Sevens World Series (Scotland having hosted the first international sevens competition to celebrate a centenary of the SRU), neither nation currently does anymore. This must be seen as a golden opportunity for a Rugby League Nines competition to grow its appeal in the Home Nations with minimal equivalent competition in terms of similar events.

The atmosphere of sevens is akin to the Magic Weekend and the success of this event could support a World Nines Series event taking place in Cardiff, Glasgow or Dublin with the aim of creating a festival atmosphere. The effect of hosting these tournemants, with proper marketing and sponsorship, could expose these countries to Rugby League in a different way than has been tried before.

Highly Marketable

"Events" is a buzzword in sports these days and hosting a world nines series would give the RLIF another world-class event (alongside the world cup and planned "confederations cup"). These events, as the World Sevens Series has shown, can be popular in areas where the full 13 (or 15) a-side variations of the game have historically had only a relatively small national footprint. The Vancouver, Las Vegas and Singapore tournemants are not built on "hotbeds of rugby" yet are still perceived as successful events in those respective countries - Vancouver drew in over 26000 fans on its first occasion. Furthermore, in rugby league mad New South Wales, the new stadium deal is looking for ANZ and Allianz stadiums to have long term deals and tennants hosting "world class sport". A rugby league tournemant surely would be viable in these circumstances?

Nines is not completely distinct from 13-a-side

Unlike sevens, which has been criticised by some such as former Wales International John Taylor stating that "in Sevens that [bulk] is not required and new training regimes are making body fat levels even lower so they [players] are not able to transfer from one game to the other", nines is still a credible form of rugby league.

Although the fewer players and overall faster tempo leads to a more open game than 13-a-side rugby, the product is still undeniably recognisable as rugby league. The division between forms of the sports therefore is less likely to happen and makes attracting traditional rugby league fans even easier.

Additionally this means that, as the Auckland Nines has shown, young talent can be mixed into the team and provide experience for them playing with senior players outside of the day to day league setting.

Cons

Cost

Money is not something that is abundant in the rugby league community, and a World Nines Series  would certainly require a significant amount to be set up and flown around the world. This expense would increase further with all players from all teams being fully professional.

Put it this way, including Leigh, Bradford, Sheffield and London Broncos, there are only 36 full time rugby league clubs in the world. Could the sport globally viably afford the expense of another 16 to 24 teams?

Even more so, some of the biggest rugby union international sides, such as Ireland and Italy, have stated finance as one of a number of reasons they don't have a team in the sevens world series. If Ireland finds it difficult to fund a rugby union sevens squad, how could league in Ireland possibly do it for a nines team?

Loss of focus on 13-a-side

I know I said one of the pros of nines is that it is not too distinct from the full version of the game, but there is still the risk of the focus on the 13-a-side game being lost. Once again this comes down to money.

This is especially true for smaller nations that have to choose between 9s and 13s in terms of financing.

Take Fiji for example. One of the dominant teams since the inception of the Sevens World Series and well funded and supported by its respective union. However, almost complete focus on the shortened version of the game has led to a stagnation for the national XV. This is less of an issue for larger nations like Australia, England and New Zealand who have a much larger player pool to draw on but for the smaller nations it becomes quite an issue.

Playing Talent

Where would the players who play on the Nines Series come from and how would they fit into the current set up?

Would they be a core of younger players centrally contracted to the national governing body?

Or would the come from the players already playing professionally who want to improve different aspects of their personal game? Even with this we must ask whether this will be the player's, club's or governing body's choice? I could hardly see Leeds Rhinos allowing Kallum Watkins or Ryan Hall to take a season out to play nines at the clubs expense.

This would then question the very purpose of the concept; is it a pathway into the senior game or is it an end in itself? Wayne Bennett, the current England coach, has appeared to have never fully appreciated the nines concept thus far with his Brisbane team, but perhaps he may see the benefits to the international game.

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Long post... 

 

Rumour has it post-RLWC17, a 9s tournament will take place every other year (at the start!) when the RLIF don't have a main event i.e. World Cup/Confed Cup, to generate income for the RLIF to further develop the game. Just a rumour but hopefully true.

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I'd noted that as well Geordie. What puzzled me a little about it is, yes there is no RLIF tournament at the end of that season, but there will be a few months prior, so it's essentially 3 months after the last RLIF tournament.

In theory 9s would be great interntionally, but we need to get XIIIs established and permanent 1st.

Maybe where it could work best is for tier 3 or 4 nations, who struggle to raise a XIII squad. Let their players focus on XIII domestically, but have 9s as a highly attractive event to attract new fans (and thus new players). Maybe send student/ amateur teams from big nations to add some glamour like the Aussies did to Commenwealth games?

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Nines can be used as part of world wide marketing offensive you don't have to play more than 2 a year to start it off.

 

Cue all the reasons for doing nothing, carrying on as we are, retreating to what we know best and not disturbing the equilibrium!

2 warning points:kolobok_dirol:  Non-Political

 

 

 

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Long post... 

 

Rumour has it post-RLWC17, a 9s tournament will take place every other year (at the start!) when the RLIF don't have a main event i.e. World Cup/Confed Cup, to generate income for the RLIF to further develop the game. Just a rumour but hopefully true.

 

They should call it Rumour League International Federation because we rarely get any concrete information. Anyone got an idea when England's next home fixture is after 2016? Or what is planned for 2018?

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They should call it Rumour League International Federation because we rarely get any concrete information. Anyone got an idea when England's next home fixture is after 2016? Or what is planned for 2018?

Naturally, we know very little for certain on this.

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The prize money at Auckland must have had to be high to persuade all the NRL clubs to play one minute extra on top of their regular season.

 

If a sponsor can come forward with a big enough pot of cash, then the SL clubs will commit and a Northern Hemisphere Nines should be feasible, possibly even with some invitational representation from South of the equator.

 

If those two competitions can become an established part of the RL year, then adding other tournaments some years down the line will be easier. It is certainly the sort of event that cities would be eager to host, like Magic Weekend.

 

And what RU has done for Sevens over the last 20-odd years should be studied very carefully for tips. They do seem to have nailed the concept, even before they got Olympic recognition.

Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
Ralph Waldo Emerson

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The prize money at Auckland must have had to be high to persuade all the NRL clubs to play one minute extra on top of their regular season.

 

 

The Auckland 9's were a concept put together by Duco Events. The NRL didn't give it their "blessing" until Duco Events had secured underwriting/sponsorship from Auckland Council to the tune of NZ $9,000,000 over 5 years with another NZ$3,000,000 in assured marketing spend over that period.

The prize pool is AU $2,250,000 and I'm not sure how much Dick Smith and now Downer pay for naming rights, but with ticket prices keenly leveraged starting at $69 a pop in 2015 going as high as NZ$230.

 

I believe the winners cheque was not too far off that which the winning NRL club get after the Grand Final, so it's no surprise that the clubs have embraced the concept. I suspect many use 9's as part of their speed conditioning training pre-season now. At least 3 more years in Auckland and that's the key......the Council buying in to the concept and giving it time.

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The Auckland 9's were a concept put together by Duco Events. The NRL didn't give it their "blessing" until Duco Events had secured underwriting/sponsorship from Auckland Council to the tune of NZ $9,000,000 over 5 years with another NZ$3,000,000 in assured marketing spend over that period.

The prize pool is AU $2,250,000 and I'm not sure how much Dick Smith and now Downer pay for naming rights, but with ticket prices keenly leveraged starting at $69 a pop in 2015 going as high as NZ$230.

 

I believe the winners cheque was not too far off that which the winning NRL club get after the Grand Final, so it's no surprise that the clubs have embraced the concept. I suspect many use 9's as part of their speed conditioning training pre-season now. At least 3 more years in Auckland and that's the key......the Council buying in to the concept and giving it time.

I hope it is bringing in tons of revenue to the city every year.

Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
Ralph Waldo Emerson

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They should call it Rumour League International Federation because we rarely get any concrete information. Anyone got an idea when England's next home fixture is after 2016? Or what is planned for 2018?

So cynical Scubby... ;)

<I am as frustrated as you regarding the RLIF>

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I hope it is bringing in tons of revenue to the city every year.

Gates have slid by nearly 20% on the first year but prices for the top tickets went up in Year 2 as well. It's hard to get exact attendance figures because the NRL don't run the event, but instead it's run by DUCO events who are a private entity. Cheapest tickets were NZ$69 in year 1, rising to NZ$99 in year 2 and dropping back to $69 in Year 3. DUCO claim 41k, 37k and 35k per day for those three years and it's worth mentioning that they were breath testing people going in in 2016.

 

As for bringing cash into the city, there has been very little mention of any overlying benefit, whereas it is usually headline news when Hotel rooms are at a premium etc..... This points to it not delivering the visitor numbers that they expected. The council would surely be blowing their trumpets on their "investment" paying dividends if it were?

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The Auckland 9's were a concept put together by Duco Events. The NRL didn't give it their "blessing" until Duco Events had secured underwriting/sponsorship from Auckland Council to the tune of NZ $9,000,000 over 5 years with another NZ$3,000,000 in assured marketing spend over that period.

The prize pool is AU $2,250,000 and I'm not sure how much Dick Smith and now Downer pay for naming rights, but with ticket prices keenly leveraged starting at $69 a pop in 2015 going as high as NZ$230.

 

I believe the winners cheque was not too far off that which the winning NRL club get after the Grand Final, so it's no surprise that the clubs have embraced the concept. I suspect many use 9's as part of their speed conditioning training pre-season now. At least 3 more years in Auckland and that's the key......the Council buying in to the concept and giving it time.

$350.000 dollars was what the Eels had their cheating mitts on until the nrl took it back.

Through the fish-eyed lens of tear stained eyes
I can barely define the shape of this moment in time(roger waters)

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$350.000 dollars was what the Eels had their cheating mitts on until the nrl took it back.

It will be interesting to see where that goes, given that the NRL don't control or run the tournament. Personally, I'd like to see it added to the 2017 winners cheque.......then you'd see teams packed with top grade stars!

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I'm not sure that's fair on the RLIF Scubby. People criticise RL authorities for not having a strategy. They publish a strategy, and the next thing we hear is that all they have is a strategy. First you plan a strategy and then you execute it. They have just come up with the plan.

The World Cup is probably, rightfully taking most of the RLIFs time at the moment (see record TV deal and hitherto unheard of states and countries applying for games)as well as having to redo their Sports Accord submissions. Best they sort that before a tournament 3 years away.

Engalnd fixtures in 2018 are not RLIFs remit. They organise World Cup/ Confed Cup every 2 years. Other years the national federations are free to organise with the implication being test series. That will take a bit of negotiation, as if the RLIF comps are in opposing hemispheres, then it's 'your place or mine' for the test series. One suspects those poor tired Aussies will need a rest after the World Cup, so the cash strapped Kiwis will be delighted to come here in 2018, with England touring Oz in 2020. Just my guesswork.

So new dynamics to consider as new administrations and schedules bed in. RLIF seem pretty under resourced at the moment, but hopefully that should change after World Cup revenues start to flow. Really should be reason to be optimistic, with a more robust schedule with more games for more nations than ever before. That is ofcourse, unless you chose not be positive.

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Engalnd fixtures in 2018 are not RLIFs remit. They organise World Cup/ Confed Cup every 2 years. Other years the national federations are free to organise with the implication being test series. That will take a bit of negotiation, as if the RLIF comps are in opposing hemispheres, then it's 'your place or mine' for the test series. One suspects those poor tired Aussies will need a rest after the World Cup, so the cash strapped Kiwis will be delighted to come here in 2018, with England touring Oz in 2020. Just my guesswork.

 

This pretty much sums it up really. 'Just my guesswork'. This is how The ICC (cricket) plans 5 year blocks of international fixtures along with the competing nations. 

 

http://icc-live.s3.amazonaws.com/cms/media/about_docs/547c2a4d42a86-Copy%20of%20Copy%20of%20FTP%202015%20to%202019%20as%20at%20Nov%202014.pdf

 

We don't even have one beyond the next 12-18 months. There are currently no fixtures/series planned for any country in the World of Rugby League beyond November 2017. England currently has nothing organised at home after November 2016, zip! This just gives countries like Australia the opportunity to play piecemeal with the international game.

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That was very selective Scubby. The suggested test locations were my only guesswork.

Cricket, until the rise of the IPL, always totally reliant on Interntionals for most of its income. Hence the priority given.

Conversely RL has been totally reliant on domestic competitions. Hence lack of focus on Interntionals.

For the first time we are moving to a meaningful 4 year schedule. Once that is announced by the RLIF, that will hopefully allows the national federations to fill the gaps.

We are in an evolving situation. Don't expect instant answers, which is easy to do from the luxury of your keyboard. At lest the RLIF has met the demands of the baying mob for a strategy. Give them time to execute it, and nation federations time to respond.

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That was very selective Scubby. The suggested test locations were my only guesswork.

Cricket, until the rise of the IPL, always totally reliant on Interntionals for most of its income. Hence the priority given.

Conversely RL has been totally reliant on domestic competitions. Hence lack of focus on Interntionals.

For the first time we are moving to a meaningful 4 year schedule. Once that is announced by the RLIF, that will hopefully allows the national federations to fill the gaps.

We are in an evolving situation. Don't expect instant answers, which is easy to do from the luxury of your keyboard. At lest the RLIF has met the demands of the baying mob for a strategy. Give them time to execute it, and nation federations time to respond.

 

You seem much more comfortable with this laissez faire approach than I do. My only hope is that David Collier is from a Cricket background and hopefully he will put things in place. We have far more in common with cricket I believe than other sports as it has a couple of very powerful nations and others having to feed off scraps provided by the ICC.

 

Saying that, he is often very conspicuous by his absence - especially on recent eligibility questions which are being thrown up.

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It's not laissez fair Scubby, it's giving credit where credit is due and not expecting everything to happen yesterday.

If by the World Cup, the Confed Cup schedule hasn't been announced allowing for the 2018 tests to have been announced, I'd be inclined to agree, although I would still tolerate some growing pains.

Given this is a new process I would expect post 2021 WC for everything to be fully established and cyclical marketing to be in full flow.

That may sound sub optimal, but I'm realistic, and would still expect big, well attended events along the way

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Auckland has been successful from a tourism and exposure perspective. The target for the tournament was $6.8m in Year 5.

In Year 1 it made $9.3m and Year 2 $6.9m. (http://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/69582798/Auckland-Nines-brings-in-less-money-still-ahead-of-projections) Numbers for Yr 3 should come out in June/July as per previous years.

Auckland Council and ATEED have also already come out to say they want the event staying in Auckland beyond 2018.

Anyway getting back on topic. There is value in both a World Nines World Cup (which is what the RLIF is currently talking about) and a World Nines series.

The Cup, in my opinion should be once every 2 or 4 years and be the only international Nines tournament where NRL and SL players can take part.

A Nines series should aim to be annually and look to feature as much domestic talent as possible. Ideally to keep costs down, places that are prepared to pay for tournaments like this but where the lack of stars won't hurt crowds should be considered.

Such places could include PNG, France, Hawaii (the fact they pay to host Tonga v Samoa most years and wanted Broncos v Panthers shows the promoters there see a market for League events), regional Australian cities like Newcastle, Townsville or somewhere like Perth or Melbourne.

To start off all we need is two events. Maybe one location in Europe and one in the Pacific. Schedule it in the off season and the likes of Fox Sports and Sky NZ will at least pay for the TV content.

From there we can slowly grow it until one day we might have a decent circuit.

Keeping NRL and SL talent out of the circuit will help reduce any interference in the tournament from unhappy coaches, whilst also making the tournament more competitive. (Potentially Championship, NSW & Queensland Cup could be excluded as well)

Will also help reduce insurance and other costs.

PACIFIQUE TREIZE: Join the team by registering as a fan today at pacifique13.com

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The Cup, in my opinion should be once every 2 or 4 years and be the only international Nines tournament where NRL and SL players can take part.

A Nines series should aim to be annually and look to feature as much domestic talent as possible. Ideally to keep costs down, places that are prepared to pay for tournaments like this but where the lack of stars won't hurt crowds should be considered.

Such places could include PNG, France, Hawaii (the fact they pay to host Tonga v Samoa most years and wanted Broncos v Panthers shows the promoters there see a market for League events), regional Australian cities like Newcastle, Townsville or somewhere like Perth or Melbourne.

To start off all we need is two events. Maybe one location in Europe and one in the Pacific. Schedule it in the off season and the likes of Fox Sports and Sky NZ will at least pay for the TV content.

From there we can slowly grow it until one day we might have a decent circuit.

Keeping NRL and SL talent out of the circuit will help reduce any interference in the tournament from unhappy coaches, whilst also making the tournament more competitive. (Potentially Championship, NSW & Queensland Cup could be excluded as well)

Will also help reduce insurance and other costs.

 

The RLEF talked to the London Mayor's office and they said they were keen (although the RLEF said running such an event was neither their focus nor did it really fall under their remit).

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  • 2 weeks later...

Who's remit does Nines in Europe fall under then if not the RLEF? I appreciate the desire by the code to want as many people as possible playing the original form of the game, but honestly if Nines, Tag or Touch is going to help us drive the overall profile, participation and revenues available in the sport, we should be leveraging them as much as possible.

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I asked danny K,of the RLEF,if somekind of 9s comps in europe was on the cards,to help showcase the spread of the sport throughout europe and the possibility of it leading to a world 9s..

He was pretty blunt and said no..

But since i posed the question we've had 9s in the commonwealth games & the auckland 9s...so...i dunno

OLDHAM RLFC

the 8TH most successful team in british RL

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