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England starting 13 v NZ


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Why just Super League players?

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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This would look a little different if the NRL crew were included...

 

Lomax

 

McGilvary

Cudjoe

Watkins

Manfredi

 

Brown

Sneyd

 

Walmsley

Roby

Hill

Ferres

Currie

O'Loughlin

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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This is quite fun as I'm sure we'd have a load of NRL players in the side, but here goes (based on how I hope they'll be at the end of the year as opposed to form right now):

Tomkins

Manfredi

Ratchford

Watkins

McGilvary

Williams

Gale

Hill

Houghton

Watts

Westwood

Ellis

O'Loughlin

Bateman

Clarke

Warmsley

Currie

Plenty ifs and buts in that team with one player being retired and others needing to find some form.

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1. Shaul

2. Hall

3. Watkins

4. Yeaman

5. Manfredi

6. Williams

7. Sneyd

8. Taylor

9. Houghton

10. Hill

11. Ellis (if we can get him out of retirement!)

12. Bateman

13. O'Loughlin

Some slight Hull bias there, but we are top of the league so there must be a reason!

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Yeaman! You had my sympathy til then as the first few posters seemed to be Hull phobic......never ones to pick in form players ......but where the f does OLoughlin come from? Take a Wigan shirt off and he is now a nobody.

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Yeaman! You had my sympathy til then as the first few posters seemed to be Hull phobic......never ones to pick in form players ......but where the f does OLoughlin come from? Take a Wigan shirt off and he is now a nobody.

 

O'Loughlin is the current England captain, man of the series against New Zealand and one of the proven genuine world class players that we have.

 

If he is fit, I wouldn't hesitate to pick him.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Yeaman! You had my sympathy til then as the first few posters seemed to be Hull phobic......never ones to pick in form players ......but where the f does OLoughlin come from? Take a Wigan shirt off and he is now a nobody.

Knew I'd get a bite for Yeaman
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Possibly not but he is in a winning team!

As for OLoughlin I know that he was captain and given the press accolade but what has he done this season..apart from get older and play less minutes through injury and ability?

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Possibly not but he is in a winning team!

As for OLoughlin I know that he was captain and given the press accolade but what has he done this season..apart from get older and play less minutes through injury and ability?

 

When you select an international team I think you have to balance form vs. proven international quality and experience.

 

I thought O'Loughlin was absolutely immense against New Zealand last year and if he is fit I think that level of proven quality deserves to keep his position.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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The problem with an International series is that you have to get the team right first time. Too many English teams( and soccer) have been picked on reputation rather than form and the results are inevitable. Look how we struggled over 3 games last year against a depleted NZ team. Man of the Series, hardly an achievement last year. Remember the Olympic Stadium bore!

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Right now, O'Loughlin is not playing well enough to deserve selection. This isn't a wind up, but my honest opinion.

Defensively he's good. Nothing more, nothing less, but offensively we need more from a 13 and skipper. We cannot keep selecting on past performance. He needs to regain some offensive form IMO.

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The problem with an International series is that you have to get the team right first time. Too many English teams( and soccer) have been picked on reputation rather than form and the results are inevitable. Look how we struggled over 3 games last year against a depleted NZ team. Man of the Series, hardly an achievement last year. Remember the Olympic Stadium bore!

 

Well, I guess it proves we have moved on as an international nation when being named as the man of the series in a series win against New Zealand is not considered to be an achievement.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Jethro Tull's brother...Living in the Past?

We are picking a team for the future.

Open your eyes.

We have moved on as an international nation and changed the coaching team to try and bury the bad memories of the past.

And we will certainly need a new captain!

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Jethro Tull's brother...Living in the Past?

We are picking a team for the future.

Open your eyes.

We have moved on as an international nation and changed the coaching team to try and bury the bad memories of the past.

And we will certainly need a new captain!

 

OK. you don't rate my opinion - how about Wayne Bennett, the highest regarded coach of the last 30 years.

 

Wayne Bennett on Sean O'Loughlin...

 

"He's a good leader who's highly regarded in Australia by everyone and the feedback on him has been outstanding from people I've spoken to.  So there's no cause to change it. I haven't come here to change things that worked in the past."

 

You had better tell Wayne to open his eyes.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Well, I guess it proves we have moved on as an international nation when being named as the man of the series in a series win against New Zealand is not considered to be an achievement.

Of course it was an achievement. A great achievement, whether the opposition was at full strength or not, it was still NZ.

I am gauging my argument on what I see. When players are coming to the end of their careers, losing pace, or out of form, they take short cuts, based on their experience. O'Loughlin is doing that now and losing his focus now and again. He's been a very good player, I hope he can regain it for England's sake, but I have doubts.

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I trust Bennett has now watched Wigan in recent weeks. And of course OL has to be fit and selected to start before captaincy even comes into it.

And then Bennett can pick his own team...he might even have an NRL candidate in mind now!

I respect your view just oppose this hero worship of certain ageing players.....

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I trust Bennett has now watched Wigan in recent weeks. And of course OL has to be fit and selected to start before captaincy even comes into it.

And then Bennett can pick his own team...he might even have an NRL candidate in mind now!

I respect your view just oppose this hero worship of certain ageing players.....

 

And I respect your views... a healthy debate.

 

I don't add O'Loughlin to my team through any kind of hero worship - as a 46 year old man I think my days of hero's are behind me.  No, just I think that a fully fit O'Loughlin (and I absolutely accept it has to be a fully fit O'Loughlin) is still the best option we have at loose forward.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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And I respect your views... a healthy debate.

I don't add O'Loughlin to my team through any kind of hero worship - as a 46 year old man I think my days of hero's are behind me. No, just I think that a fully fit O'Loughlin (and I absolutely accept it has to be a fully fit O'Loughlin) is still the best option we have at loose forward.

Not forgetting that this thread is also about SL based Egngland players only making it more likely O'Loughlin gets in.

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Not forgetting that this thread is also about SL based Egngland players only making it more likely O'Loughlin gets in.

I would have O'Loughlin as loose forward anyway... with all the players being considered.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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