Italy RL - FIRL/LIRFL split (Merged threads)

[wackojacko]

Because we don't we to be under union's umbrella, we are a different sport.

[Amorugby]

Because we don't we to be under union's umbrella, we are a different sport.

[Amorugby]

You miss the point! You are not under Union umbrella. You are under Rugby umbrella which is governed by CONI.

LIRFL is an independent body, it has its own management committee and constitution which the Rugby Union body has no control or duristiction over.

Look at Twitter and Facebook feeds of FIRL to see what it promotes, small activity with a few children and mostly retweets of NRL and Super league. Look for information of activity for senior growth and championship. Is difficult to find

Italy wants home grown players and the LIRFL is committed to developing players and opportunities for people to play the sport.

LIRFL also wants to accept that heritage players have a big part to play in the growth of RL in Italy but not to buy a team of heritage players to represent the country in a World Cup. That is not sustainable and is not going to help promote the game in its own borders

[wackojacko]

I agree that they are doing more to promote the sport but all official statements seem to suggest they would be doing this under the FIR, a union body. In any case, I don't think having a single governing body for two different sports is at all a good idea. This is where the RLIF need to be fighting to get recognition.

[Amorugby]

I agree that they are doing more to promote the sport but all official statements seem to suggest they would be doing this under the FIR, a union body. In any case, I don't think having a single governing body for two different sports is at all a good idea. This is where the RLIF need to be fighting to get recognition.

[Amorugby]

They are doing nothing under FIR, rugby or 'the oval ball' is recognised by CONI as being delivered and managed by FIR for 15 a side as well as 7's and Beach rugby then LIRFL is recognised for managing and delivering 9 a side and 13 a side league formats.

It is a unique set of circumstances I agree, but circumstances that are the only solution to getting access to the governing support structures that the great game of RL need.

LIRFL is autonomous in every way, it has no say in FIR and vice versa, however I believe that the solution is best for opening the game up officially to all players.

The RLIF and RLEF should now focus on unifying Italy now that CONI have finally recognised the sport as a discipline which can only be a good thing.

[wackojacko]

OK, in the first official statement I read it says 'under the FIR' and 'with the approval of the FIR', doesn't sound ideal to me...

[Futtocks]

OK, in the first official statement I read it says 'under the FIR' and 'with the approval of the FIR', doesn't sound ideal to me...

I think that's the bit that causes the most concern.

 

I appreciate the hard work that the rebel organisation has done in promoting the game and, according to their own claims, their work has achieved more than the official body.

 

But Einstein's definition of insanity does come to mind when having dealing with an organisation that did so much harm to RL in the past: "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results".

[Amorugby]

Great article by Rob Wilkinson

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/italian-rugby-league-bid-unity-rob-wilkinson

[Evil Homer]

I just can't see the RLIF being happy with the FIR involvement.

[themainbrace]

   The situation in Italy is confusing and I'm no expert on Rugby in Italy.  However, the article doesn't look good at all.

 

    If I've understood the article correctly, the Italian RFU have essentially decided that Rugby League should be controlled by them and should have no direct link with CONI.  I don't think any sport would be happy with that set up.

 

   It may seem a bit tempting to team up with the LIFRL to increase the spread of the game in Italy but it would be a big mistake.  That template could then set a precedent for other European countries where people are fighting to have Rugby League recognised as a separate sport.

 

  The RLEF and RLIF need to remain strong here and have a separate body for RL even if it hampers short term targets of increasing RLs profile in 1 country.  By all means attend talks with CONI but make it clear that RL in Italy should be governed by an independent body that reports to the RLEF. 

[Amorugby]

A very good post, your points are fair but it would be remiss not to point out that without CONI any body on Italian soil cannot refer to itself as a federation. It has no recognition at all.

LIRFL ask for a democratic unification process that follows the constitution as set out by the all sports governing body.

This in turn potentially opens funding streams not previously available and allows the game to be grown in the proper manner with full support of the state.

It does seem like a very challenging situation but surely if you have an organisation committed to working on Italian soil then that should be welcomed and a potential unification considered?

[Evil Homer]

A very good post, your points are fair but it would be remiss not to point out that without CONI any body on Italian soil cannot refer to itself as a federation. It has no recognition at all.

LIRFL ask for a democratic unification process that follows the constitution as set out by the all sports governing body.

This in turn potentially opens funding streams not previously available and allows the game to be grown in the proper manner with full support of the state.

It does seem like a very challenging situation but surely if you have an organisation committed to working on Italian soil then that should be welcomed and a potential unification considered?

It should be welcomed, but the LIRFL may have done themselves no favors by accepting a collaboration with RU rather than fighting for RL as an independent sport. If CONI think that RL and RU are the same sport then they need to be informed that they are wrong, and LIRFL did not help matters by accepting their wrongful terms.

[themainbrace]

Hi Amorugby, I understand what you are saying about the importance of recognition by CONI but surely that should be done directly with the governing body of the sport.  Are there any other current examples of sports in Italy that link to CONI via a different sport.

 

Looking at the CONI website there appears to be a second tier of sports affiliated under the title Associated Sports Disciplines which includes Cricket, Billiards and American Football.  Surely, that's a level Italian RL should be aspiring too at the moment. 

 

I do agree with what you are saying about the importance of working on Italian soil and also hope that unification can be reached one day.

[Gambass]

It should be welcomed, but the LIRFL may have done themselves no favors by accepting a collaboration with RU rather than fighting for RL as an independent sport. If CONI think that RL and RU are the same sport then they need to be informed that they are wrong, and LIRFL did not help matters by accepting their wrongful terms.

 

In Italy (and in France and in many other european countries), multi-disciplines sport federations are a thing. It doesn't mean these disciplines are considered the same sport. For instance, in Italy, they have an ice sport federation, yet no one thinks that ice hockey and figure skating are the same sport.

 

PS: American Football is miles ahead of RL in Italy.

[EastLondonMike]

Any unification would create a new body would it not?.. so even if the LIRFL is affiliated with the RU in Italy, that wouldn't necessarily mean any new body would be also. They would be completely independent. Seems to me that the LIRFL have taken an easier route, for whatever reason, and chosen to go through the RU for CONI recognition, and as has been said, could have made it difficult for any proper RL governing body.

[Evil Homer]

In Italy (and in France and in many other european countries), multi-disciplines sport federations are a thing. It doesn't mean these disciplines are considered the same sport. For instance, in Italy, they have an ice sport federation, yet no one thinks that ice hockey and figure skating are the same sport.

 

That is a very strange way of doing things but either way, the LIRFL jumped the gun by getting involved in this. I understand why they did it and it may turn out to be the right way to go in somewhere like Italy but I just can't see the RLIF being happy, especially after what has just happened in UAE.

[Gambass]

That is a very strange way of doing things but either way, the LIRFL jumped the gun by getting involved in this. I understand why they did it and it may turn out to be the right way to go in somewhere like Italy but I just can't see the RLIF being happy, especially after what has just happened in UAE.

 

It's a ###### way of doing things actualy, and, it can get a lot more worse than that... In Turkey, they have an baseball, softball, american football and RU federation ! 

 

That's what you get when you mix sports and politics.

 

You guys are luckily enough to live in a country where the state has very little to say when it comes to sports and sports governance. Sadly, it's far from being the norm,, and the RLIF should beginning to get used to it.