NRL England players overrated

[snoopdog7]

Not the British way!!

[yipyee]

Trying to beat them at their own style doesnt work.

If you read longys book he says he was allowed to play unstructured when we beat them in sydney!

Playing with flair and attacking from deep will unsettle them. This aussie stuff of only playing with flair on your opponents line and only chancing your arm when yout in dire straights doesnt work for England.

Sadly the last time i saw the aussies rocked is when kyle eastmond and tomkins were ripping it up at the DW!

[fairfolly]

I actually think that we can match the Aussies and Kiwis in the pack.Out problem is in the halves,they totally outclass us in that department.When was the last time we had a pair of class half backs,Millward and Murphy possibly.Gregory and Edwards,unfortunately with the latter the forwards could not match theirs.In S.L. the British half backs have all had a go and cannot live with them,McGuire,Burrows,Gayle,Brown,Brough,etc,etc,etc. Unfortunately the Clubs themselves are not brave enough to persevere with any youngster coming through,except possibly Wigan.They want instant success for their clubs and do not take a lot of interest in the International set up.Until that changes we will have the same results year on year.

[Roy Boy]

I see from the comments that a lot of "youngsters" here never saw the fear in the Aussie teams when Millward tore them apart!

You don't beat the Aussies by playing their structured way - you beat them by off-the-cuff skills which have been coached out of our players since the inception of Super League!

 

I won't go into a "better in the old days" diatribe, but if you wonder where the half backs are that used to grace the game, look no further than the "percentage footie" we now seem to call for!

[Allora]

I see from the comments that a lot of "youngsters" here never saw the fear in the Aussie teams when Millward tore them apart!

You don't beat the Aussies by playing their structured way - you beat them by off-the-cuff skills which have been coached out of our players since the inception of Super League!

 

I won't go into a "better in the old days" diatribe, but if you wonder where the half backs are that used to grace the game, look no further than the "percentage footie" we now seem to call for!

I agree England don't have the players that can play off the cuff style at Test level.

Some players can only pass in one direction.

I have followed the game for 40 years and Millward is beyond my personal memories.

[Ant]

People who talk about off the cuff play forget that defences were frankly abysmal

Even in the 1990 and 1992 series when GB genuinely challenged the defence on both sides were terrible, dog leg and players jumping out

[fairfolly]

Allora,

           I have been watching the game since 1950 and yes maybe the defences were not as good but believe me Millward,Murphy,Bishop would still be able to find away through these defences.You must also remember that these guys played to a far different set of laws than today.In those days the general rule of law was "you can not run without your head" as of now " you can not run without your legs".I am not saying for a minute that it was a better game,only that it was more brutal and to get round that you had to have the skills to combat and beat the "hatchet" men.I was also fortunate enough to go on the 1988 and 1992 tours and for 95% of the time Gt.Britain were outclassed even by the club sides.We have not produced a Wally Lewis,Peter Sterling,Brett Kenny,Cooper Cronk,Jonathan Thurston for more years than I care to remember,Why?

[Blind side johnny]

Allora,

           I have been watching the game since 1950 and yes maybe the defences were not as good but believe me Millward,Murphy,Bishop would still be able to find away through these defences.You must also remember that these guys played to a far different set of laws than today.In those days the general rule of law was "you can not run without your head" as of now " you can not run without your legs".I am not saying for a minute that it was a better game,only that it was more brutal and to get round that you had to have the skills to combat and beat the "hatchet" men.I was also fortunate enough to go on the 1988 and 1992 tours and for 95% of the time Gt.Britain were outclassed even by the club sides.We have not produced a Wally Lewis,Peter Sterling,Brett Kenny,Cooper Cronk,Jonathan Thurston for more years than I care to remember,Why?

 

 

Because soccer pays good money in England and it doesn't in Australia, maybe. We also had decent half backs when the first three were playing - it was their forwards that beat us then by using the underhand tactic of running about.

[CGD]

Hodgo was England's best player against the Kiwis by far.

He had a poor game against the Scots.

He was one of your best against us.

After reading this forum during this tournament I'm convinced a lot of you wouldn't recognise good hooker play if your lives depended on it.

There is absolutely no way he played better for England while he was still in SL, that's for sure.

[Dave T]

Hodgo was England's best player against the Kiwis by far.

He had a poor game against the Scots.

He was one of your best against us.

After reading this forum during this tournament I'm convinced a lot of you wouldn't recognise good hooker play if your lives depended on it.

There is absolutely no way he played better for England while he was still in SL, that's for sure.

He was excellent in 2014 for England Down Under when he played SL. He was very good last year versus the Kiwis. 

He was solid this year, apart from missing 13% of his tackles in the Australia game. That isn't good enough, just because he plays for your team (iirc).

Add to that the key play of missing touch with the penalty (after Widdopp had already done it) and it is absolutely right to question his performance.

[St Reatham]

If I'm totally honest, I was disappointed with the performances of some the NRL based players. My England player of the tournament was Jermaine McGillvary.

[Scubby]

If ever a game was screaming out for Daryl Clark to come on after 25 minutes it was Sunday. The Aussies hate speed from the ruck. Even Matty Russell and Isaac Luke were troubling them from there. He was our one game changer from the bench and we sacrificed him because we cant find half backs.

[CGD]

He was excellent in 2014 for England Down Under when he played SL. He was very good last year versus the Kiwis.

He was solid this year, apart from missing 13% of his tackles in the Australia game. That isn't good enough, just because he plays for your team (iirc).

Add to that the key play of missing touch with the penalty (after Widdopp had already done it) and it is absolutely right to question his performance.

Yep, his failure to find touch was a clanger for sure. Never seen him do that before.

[Roy Boy]

He was excellent in 2014 for England Down Under when he played SL. He was very good last year versus the Kiwis. 

He was solid this year, apart from missing 13% of his tackles in the Australia game. That isn't good enough, just because he plays for your team (iirc).

Add to that the key play of missing touch with the penalty (after Widdopp had already done it) and it is absolutely right to question his performance.

The last time Danny Houghton did that he was 6!

[Dave T]

Another thing when you look at the stats that we should consider is that the Aussies made only 2 fewer errors than us, and they gave us 2 more penalties.

 

Their missed tackle count was extremely low, but they missed plenty against the Kiwis, I think the relatively risk-free style we played led to the low number of misses, whereas the Kiwis targeted the halves more and had Johnson dancing around out wide, particularly late on. When we tried some decent attacking plays we did trouble them - the three tries, plus the chance created by Hodgson for Burgess which would have been a try under the posts in particular.

 

I think it was a strange game, and I do think with some tweaking we could have been pretty close. At first I thought the comments from Meninga and Smith about England being really close were a bit patronising, but after watching it again and looking at the stats and discussing it here a bit more I think there is some truth in that.

[Dave T]

Daryl Clark is a hooker who while he is pacey out of dummy half is significantly behind Hodgson and even Roby in regards to service, decision making and game management. His running game is great though. If ever a game wasn't screaming out for a player like Daryl Clark, it would be a game against a team who are much better at dominating and wrestling in the PTB and therefore slowing down the ruck. and much better at managing the game than England. If ever there was a match to not pick him, it's against Australia. 

That's not the Daryl Clark I watch at Warrington.

[deluded pom?]

There are two Darryl Clarks!!!!!

[Lowdesert]

The closest we have been to beating the Aussies in a series was the Andy Gregory,Offiah, Mike Gregory era, playing our own style of rugby, the aussies and Kiwis don't like the off the cuff attack, in my opinion we will never match either playing this completions, pressure , kick Chase game. Our super league is not all based around this structure, so how can we ask players to change tactics for a couple of weeks every year.

Kick chase? Are you getting confused with Union?

[Lowdesert]

1992 so near but yet so far, if we keep following that's all we will ever do, we need to lead and play to our strengths, kick Chase, yardage sets is definitely the British way .

Having watched the Kiwis beat the Aussies in the world cup final in Brisbane, there was outcry due to the Kiwis out wrestling the Aussies,the Aussies realised things had to change , they then changed the game completely by bringing in 2 refs, thus negating much of the wrestle.

Let's build our own style, play to our strengths and maybe we can again challenge.

International rules are one ref. If anything it favours us.

[Thegreatestgameofall]

Long time lurker from Australia. Minimal poster. Massive love for Rugby League and it's potential

I always cheer for England as I feel that there is a bigger passion and love for the game than there is here in Australia where it is just a TV product now.

I feel the biggest problem is there are too many meaningless games in the Super league including the challenge cup where there is no constant need for intense grinding Rugby League that there seems to be more of in Australia barring during our stupid State of Origin period where the NRL just means nothing for 8 weeks.

Englands best players personally were a couple of the Super League boys. 11 was outstanding in defence and everyone of the Superleague players in that squad could slide into any NRL team, so the talent is there. Unfortunately not the consistency of grinding pressured league.

The fact that we also have those 3 highly intense Origin matches is for my opinion the sole reason that Australia always almost untouchable by NZ or England.

In both matches Aus played against either team, there were sustained periods of the game where neither England or NZ could force repeat sets or take advantage of a possible tiring Australian defence, then once the Aussies get the ball back they stick to a game plan that is perfected in by playing Origin they take back control of the game.

The English had every chance to put away Australia but had no idea how to. That is where the absolute class of Thurston and Cronk showed

I feel widdop is better suited to fullback.

I would love nothing more than to see England play Australia much more regularly so the English players can get a feel for the grinding rugby league that is unfortunately played here in Australia.

I love the passion you all show for the game and you are all the reason international rugby league even still matters.

I have a lot to say but I won't bore. Looking forward to coming over and watching the 2021 World Cup as I did in 13, English Rugby League support is so much more passionate than we have here in Sydney (not the home of rugby league) atleast

NZ to win for the love of the Game

[deluded pom?]

Long time lurker from Australia. Minimal poster. Massive love for Rugby League and it's potential

I always cheer for England as I feel that there is a bigger passion and love for the game than there is here in Australia where it is just a TV product now.

I feel the biggest problem is there are too many meaningless games in the Super league including the challenge cup where there is no constant need for intense grinding Rugby League that there seems to be more of in Australia barring during our stupid State of Origin period where the NRL just means nothing for 8 weeks.

Englands best players personally were a couple of the Super League boys. 11 was outstanding in defence and everyone of the Superleague players in that squad could slide into any NRL team, so the talent is there. Unfortunately not the consistency of grinding pressured league.

The fact that we also have those 3 highly intense Origin matches is for my opinion the sole reason that Australia always almost untouchable by NZ or England.

In both matches Aus played against either team, there were sustained periods of the game where neither England or NZ could force repeat sets or take advantage of a possible tiring Australian defence, then once the Aussies get the ball back they stick to a game plan that is perfected in by playing Origin they take back control of the game.

The English had every chance to put away Australia but had no idea how to. That is where the absolute class of Thurston and Cronk showed

I feel widdop is better suited to fullback.

I would love nothing more than to see England play Australia much more regularly so the English players can get a feel for the grinding rugby league that is unfortunately played here in Australia.

I love the passion you all show for the game and you are all the reason international rugby league even still matters.

I have a lot to say but I won't bore. Looking forward to coming over and watching the 2021 World Cup as I did in 13, English Rugby League support is so much more passionate than we have here in Sydney (not the home of rugby league) atleast

NZ to win for the love of the Game

Lurk no more. Feel free to add your thoughts. There's no right and no wrong, just opinions.