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11 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Worst England performance in history. Absolute s**t. No excuses. 

At least it will mean the end of Gareth Southgate being in charge. 

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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15 minutes ago, RayCee said:

At least it will mean the end of Gareth Southgate being in charge. 

With any luck. He's clearly been coached by Boris Johnson's advisors on how to answer interview questions, basically saying, yeah it was a bad performance, I take full responsibility but we have done all these good things years ago. Sounds just like Bojo's partygate address to the commons. 

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15 minutes ago, RayCee said:

At least it will mean the end of Gareth Southgate being in charge. 

Yeah, course. Losing a game at the end of a long season with a massively changed lineup in a competition that’s international football’s Johnstones Paint Trophy is worthy of the sack. 

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5 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

With any luck. He's clearly been coached by Boris Johnson's advisors on how to answer interview questions, basically saying, yeah it was a bad performance, I take full responsibility but we have done all these good things years ago. Sounds just like Bojo's partygate address to the commons. 

I don't expect it to happen but any coach that cannot adapt to a game as it unfolds isn't up to the job at any higher level of the game.

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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23 minutes ago, RayCee said:

At least it will mean the end of Gareth Southgate being in charge. 

I think we should appoint a high profile foreign coach , never mind the cost , just give him what he wants , its bound to bring success .

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15 minutes ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

It was a bad defeat tonight, but it shouldn’t mean a knee jerk moment by the FA concerning Southgate’s position .

 

Normally I'd agree but this wouldn't be knee jerk IMO. He's had some success due to being a good man manager but when things are going against the team, a very poor game manager. This has been an ongoing issue. 

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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6 minutes ago, RayCee said:

Normally I'd agree but this wouldn't be knee jerk IMO. He's had some success due to being a good man manager but when things are going against the team, a very poor game manager. This has been an ongoing issue. 

I agree. Over the last couple of weeks I've seen 4 of the worst England performances I've ever seen.

Boring, safe, uninspiring possession football that is not getting the results. England are having the vast majority of possession in games and creating hardly any chances to score. Not going forward, holding the ball in defence and passing it along the line, passing back to the keeper when they're on the edge of the oppositions box, not putting crosses in when in acres of space, instead trying to move inside and pass their way into the box when all that's needed is a simple cross. I remember one cross being put in tonight and even then the winger had to stop, take the ball onto his other foot to do it because he was playing on the opposite side to his usual position, playing in a position he has never in his career played, all the time doing that allowing Hungary to get every man back into the box so the cross didn't even pass the first defender. 

That was the one cross, the rest of the time they just overcomplicated the game, as I say trying to play inside, pass round the Hungarian defence. Hungary were brilliant on the counter but mainly because the England defence didn't even look like they knew where they were. England have looked so afraid to give the ball away, so afraid to do anything remotely positive in any of these games, it's the sodding nations league for God sake! It doesn't mean anything so you might as well just go for it but there are just waves of negativity coming off them. Hungary's last goal, the ball is dinked over the top of the keeper and just slowly trickles into the net, Walker stood right there just watching it go in and not looking at all interested in doing anything about it. 

Some of the decision making was just baffling from Southgate. Oh look we've gone 2 down so I'll bring on another defender instead of going for it and trying to get back into the game by throwing on a striker like any other team would do. Negativity! That's all this England team is, just negative, negative, negative and it'll be putting people off watching. I'd much rather watch an exciting, positive performance and see England lose say 3-2 than watch this frightened negativity that's seen us concede 5 ###### goals to HUNGARY!!!!!! and not score a single goal in open play for 4 games, not even create one decent sodding chance on goal in my opinion. I watched the first half of Costa Rica v NZ before England and was far more enthralled by that than 6 hours of supposed elite level internationals, christ towards the end of the game I stuck Bonaire v US Virgin Islands on my tablet and was more engrossed by that! 

Sure, I'm alright with Southgate taking us into the world cup so that when we don't get out of the group people might finally stop with the love fest for him and realise he can't actually coach at the highest level. By the time the world cup comes round he'll have been relegated in both top level management jobs he's had. 

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5 hours ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Oh! Is that why Huddersfield don't seem to have a lot of fans? Because they all live down under? 

Just saying from my experience Aussie Soccer fans like the Irish are just like some of the plebs I'm used too in Newcastle etc

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10 hours ago, Sidi Fidi Gold said:

I think we should appoint a high profile foreign coach , never mind the cost , just give him what he wants , its bound to bring success .

Outside possibility that some have taken this seriously.👍

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I'm interested in that drive, that rush to judgment, that is so prevalent in our society. We all know that pleasurable rush that comes from condemning, and in the short term it's quite a satisfying thing to do, isn't it?

J. K. Rowling

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And so ends the 2021/22 season.

The 2022/23 season begins in ... three weeks.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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11 hours ago, hindle xiii said:

Conceding four goals in the fourth game shown on Channel 4?

Some folks will read too much into that.

It was 4cast. Southgate should have had more 4sight.

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I'm interested in that drive, that rush to judgment, that is so prevalent in our society. We all know that pleasurable rush that comes from condemning, and in the short term it's quite a satisfying thing to do, isn't it?

J. K. Rowling

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11 hours ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

I agree. Over the last couple of weeks I've seen 4 of the worst England performances I've ever seen.

Boring, safe, uninspiring possession football that is not getting the results. England are having the vast majority of possession in games and creating hardly any chances to score. Not going forward, holding the ball in defence and passing it along the line, passing back to the keeper when they're on the edge of the oppositions box, not putting crosses in when in acres of space, instead trying to move inside and pass their way into the box when all that's needed is a simple cross. I remember one cross being put in tonight and even then the winger had to stop, take the ball onto his other foot to do it because he was playing on the opposite side to his usual position, playing in a position he has never in his career played, all the time doing that allowing Hungary to get every man back into the box so the cross didn't even pass the first defender. 

That was the one cross, the rest of the time they just overcomplicated the game, as I say trying to play inside, pass round the Hungarian defence. Hungary were brilliant on the counter but mainly because the England defence didn't even look like they knew where they were. England have looked so afraid to give the ball away, so afraid to do anything remotely positive in any of these games, it's the sodding nations league for God sake! It doesn't mean anything so you might as well just go for it but there are just waves of negativity coming off them. Hungary's last goal, the ball is dinked over the top of the keeper and just slowly trickles into the net, Walker stood right there just watching it go in and not looking at all interested in doing anything about it. 

Some of the decision making was just baffling from Southgate. Oh look we've gone 2 down so I'll bring on another defender instead of going for it and trying to get back into the game by throwing on a striker like any other team would do. Negativity! That's all this England team is, just negative, negative, negative and it'll be putting people off watching. I'd much rather watch an exciting, positive performance and see England lose say 3-2 than watch this frightened negativity that's seen us concede 5 ###### goals to HUNGARY!!!!!! and not score a single goal in open play for 4 games, not even create one decent sodding chance on goal in my opinion. I watched the first half of Costa Rica v NZ before England and was far more enthralled by that than 6 hours of supposed elite level internationals, christ towards the end of the game I stuck Bonaire v US Virgin Islands on my tablet and was more engrossed by that! 

Sure, I'm alright with Southgate taking us into the world cup so that when we don't get out of the group people might finally stop with the love fest for him and realise he can't actually coach at the highest level. By the time the world cup comes round he'll have been relegated in both top level management jobs he's had. 

I didn't see or hear last night's game but I assume that it followed the same pattern as the previous ones and I very much agree with your analysis. 

It's as if Southgate was treating to whole competition as a series of friendlies, which to my mind it more or less was, or just one step up.

I do think though, that it would be premature and wrong for him to resign or be sacked. If the clubs can't sort out the inadequacies of the  various players, then Southgate doesn't stand a chance. 

 

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I'm interested in that drive, that rush to judgment, that is so prevalent in our society. We all know that pleasurable rush that comes from condemning, and in the short term it's quite a satisfying thing to do, isn't it?

J. K. Rowling

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1 hour ago, JohnM said:

 

It's as if Southgate was treating to whole competition as a series of friendlies, which to my mind it more or less was, or just one step up.

It was brought in by UEFA specifically to take the place of friendlies. Many countries have explicitly said they're using these games to experiment with formations etc ahead of the world cup.

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Exactly. Not good for the spectators, viewers and pundits. of course.

I'm interested in that drive, that rush to judgment, that is so prevalent in our society. We all know that pleasurable rush that comes from condemning, and in the short term it's quite a satisfying thing to do, isn't it?

J. K. Rowling

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3 hours ago, JohnM said:

I didn't see or hear last night's game

Same , but I understand Puskas wasn’t even playing so it’s even worse 

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18 hours ago, Sidi Fidi Gold said:

I think we should appoint a high profile foreign coach , never mind the cost , just give him what he wants , its bound to bring success .

Yes, I know what you're saying (Ericsson, Capello) but what would Guardiola or Klopp do with the talent England has at its disposal? Much more than Southgate, I suspect. What he did with the squads he had in 2018 and 2021 can't be denied, but the players he has now are better (if possibly knackered right now). I think he gets the Qatar gig, but that's it if they don't progress to at least the quarters. 

"I am the avenging angel; I come with wings unfurled, I come with claws extended from halfway round the world. I am the God Almighty, I am the howling wind. I care not for your family; I care not for your kin. I come in search of terror, though terror is my own; I come in search of vengeance for crimes and crimes unknown. I care not for your children, I care not for your wives, I care not for your country, I care not for your lives." - (c) Jim Boyes - "The Avenging Angel"

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34 minutes ago, tim2 said:

Yes, I know what you're saying (Ericsson, Capello) but what would Guardiola or Klopp do with the talent England has at its disposal? Much more than Southgate, I suspect. What he did with the squads he had in 2018 and 2021 can't be denied, but the players he has now are better (if possibly knackered right now). I think he gets the Qatar gig, but that's it if they don't progress to at least the quarters. 

Maybe be in some areas we have an almost surplus of options like fullback and maybe out wide, but elsewhere England are threadbare imo.

Centre half springs to mind as a weak spot in terms of depth, goalkeeper too, there’s the lack of a playmaker to pull the strings in midfield and up front we seem overly reliant on the form and fitness of one man.

I think it’s possible to cover that in qualifying, but in tournament football I think eventually weaknesses like these get exposed.  Yet despite that Southgate has steered the ship well and created a good team spirit (probably due to his impressive people skills).

Personally I wish we played with less emphasis on being solid and played with a bit more elan - who wouldn’t want that?  Everyone likes attacking football.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Maybe be in some areas we have an almost surplus of options like fullback and maybe out wide, but elsewhere England are threadbare imo.

Centre half springs to mind as a weak spot in terms of depth, goalkeeper too, there’s the lack of a playmaker to pull the strings in midfield and up front we seem overly reliant on the form and fitness of one man.

I think it’s possible to cover that in qualifying, but in tournament football I think eventually weaknesses like these get exposed.  Yet despite that Southgate has steered the ship well and created a good team spirit (probably due to his impressive people skills).

Personally I wish we played with less emphasis on being solid and played with a bit more elan - who wouldn’t want that?  Everyone like attacking football.

 

 

At times we did play like that but at the key moments when we led against Croatia and Italy we drew our heads into our shells. They should take a look at Ben Stokes' approach in the cricket. People will forgive losing if you give it a proper go. As Ben said "You run towards the danger, not away from it". I wonder where he got that from? 

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"I am the avenging angel; I come with wings unfurled, I come with claws extended from halfway round the world. I am the God Almighty, I am the howling wind. I care not for your family; I care not for your kin. I come in search of terror, though terror is my own; I come in search of vengeance for crimes and crimes unknown. I care not for your children, I care not for your wives, I care not for your country, I care not for your lives." - (c) Jim Boyes - "The Avenging Angel"

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