MattSantos Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I think I've just about had enough of Rugby League now. I used to like the idea that we were often an innovative sport that had other sports following our example, but the powers that be seem to revel in that and now just impose changes to the laws and systems for the sake of it. I gave up on Super league around the third season in when I realised that it was more about money than sport, and that they play by a different set of laws to the rest of Rugby League, but now that the Super league clubs are ruining the championships as well with this dual registration nonsense I am seriously considering just sticking to my amateur game on Saturdays and saving my money on Sundays. This. Running the Rob Burrow marathon to raise money for the My Name'5 Doddie foundation: https://www.justgiving.com/fundraising/ben-dyas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 It is also too easy for people to say things like 'our game is undersold'. We hear this a lot. We have had some pretty well qualified people in charge of the governing body and individual clubs. What have they done about it? Maybe it isn't actually that easy. Maybe they are trying to do this by making games as intense as possible by getting teams into tiers that suit their level. They will have a few key points of the season to market and get the media interested: 1 - The cut after 11 rounds. There will be games in that 11th round which will probably determine whether a club plays in the 1st or 2nd tier, or 2nd or 3rd tier. If this was done at Magic Weekend, we could see a much bigger crowd at an event which is always one of the bigger events of the year. This could be brilliant sporting drama in front of massive crowds. 2 - The end of the regular season. a ) Tier 1 will see the battle for the playoff spots - top teams playing top teams. Great stuff and surely where the focus should be? Tier 2 will see teams clamouring for that top 4 which will see them make it into SL1 for the next season (and I assume the playoffs) 3 - The playoffs and Grand Final series. Where the champions are decided. So based on the above, I suspect they will have an easier job selling those games. We hear everybody banging on about meaningless games in the regular season, this solution goes a long way to addressing that. I do agree that strong leadership is needed and get the challenges around allowing clubs to rule the game, but I don;t think the proposal is a bad one at all. In your theoretic system at 1. Will the 2nd tier also have a Magic weekend as well or are you just concerned with Tier 1? What about the unfairness in the fixtures in that first 11 games, where one team could be away to the top teams and another playing them at their own ground? At the end of the regular season it is suggested that there will be playoffs for each of the 8 team groups, but what are they playing -off for? If the top 4 from Tier 2 go in to the middle group of 8 with 4 teams from SL then they are playing to decide the four teams that play in the top Tier1 the next season but what is the third group of 8 playing-off for? Which teams will be the Championship Champions? I remember when ............................."It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 ... i.e. purely hypothetical say the bottom four in Super League are London 9, Hull KR 8, Castleford 8, Salford 6. And the top of Championship are Halifax 20, Featherstone 16, Sheffield 16, Leigh 15. The full-time clubs then have ground to make up instead of simply running away on an even keel, but also would add spice to try harder in the first 11 games... Teams in the middle group of 8 teams do not carry over their points from the first 11 games, only those in the 1st and 3rd group of 8 carry them forward. I remember when ............................."It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hindle xiii Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Teams in the middle group of 8 teams do not carry over their points from the first 11 games, only those in the 1st and 3rd group of 8 carry them forward. Yes I know. I was suggesting they could do. Apologies if that didn't come across in the first half! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 1 -In your theoretic system at 1. Will the 2nd tier also have a Magic weekend as well or are you just concerned with Tier 1? What about the unfairness in the fixtures in that first 11 games, where one team could be away to the top teams and another playing them at their own ground? 2 - At the end of the regular season it is suggested that there will be playoffs for each of the 8 team groups, but what are they playing -off for? If the top 4 from Tier 2 go in to the middle group of 8 with 4 teams from SL then they are playing to decide the four teams that play in the top Tier1 the next season but what is the third group of 8 playing-off for? Which teams will be the Championship Champions? 1 - It's not my theoretic system, it's what has been suggested and reported on. I'd prefer the split to come after the full home and away system with 10 teams in each division. On the Magic Weekend question, suppose that's up to the clubs, there is none currently in the 2nd tier, it's up to them. 2 - They are playing for a trophy. 3 - They can call the divisions/tiers/conferences what they want - the name championship may not even be around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 1 - It's not my theoretic system, it's what has been suggested and reported on. I'd prefer the split to come after the full home and away system with 10 teams in each division. On the Magic Weekend question, suppose that's up to the clubs, there is none currently in the 2nd tier, it's up to them. 2 - They are playing for a trophy. 3 - They can call the divisions/tiers/conferences what they want - the name championship may not even be around. 1. Sorry, I thought this whole review and suggestions was for Rugby League not just Super League. There isn't a Magic Weekend currently for the Championships because they currently have the NR Cup Final weekend and the Championship Grand Finals weekend. 2. This would seem to be a pointless trophy as they would be Champions of what exactly? 3. There are still 10 - 14 teams outside the 24 teams in Tiers 1 and 2, currently known as Championship 1. Are we just forgetting about them? I remember when ............................."It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doghead Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 (edited) So Martyn Sadler doesn't like the new proposals, from day one all we have had from this man is negativity, no one at LE has yet come up with anything specific, only that its a can of worms its a mess, the longest suicide note in sport etc, a lot of fans are now warming to the proposals, to quote the Warrington coach as a reason it should be scrapped is joke, if you have any specific problem lets hear them. ... i.e. purely hypothetical say the bottom four in Super League are London 9, Hull KR 8, Castleford 8, Salford 6. And the top of Championship are Halifax 20, Featherstone 16, Sheffield 16, Leigh 15. The full-time clubs then have ground to make up instead of simply running away on an even keel, but also would add spice to try harder in the first 11 games...Don't forget the relegated bottom two sides at the end of the 2014 season, they will make up the bottom 12, surely they can keep a decent squad together, if so the middle 8 could contain 6 SL sides from 2014 season. Edited May 13, 2013 by Doghead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hindle xiii Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Don't forget the relegated bottom two sides at the end of the 2014 season, they will make up the bottom 12, surely they can keep a decent squad together, if so the middle 8 could contain 6 SL sides from 2014 season. Oh I did yes, sorry about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry the Leit Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 So Martyn Sadler doesn't like the new proposals, from day one all we have had from this man is negativity, no one at LE has yet come up with anything specific, only that its a can of worms its a mess, the longest suicide note in sport etc,Don't forget the relegated bottom two sides at the end of the 2014 season, they will make up the bottom 12, surely they can keep a decent squad together, if so the middle 8 could contain 6 SL sides from 2014 season. I'm pleased that LE has expressed an editorial opinion. Please take note LoveRugbyLeague. I don't find Martyn Sadler negative, I think he's alright. I don't like the way his organisation named Kevin Sinfield as the best player in the world to generate a bit of publicity, but that's publishing. The Unicorn is not a Goose, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doghead Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I'm pleased that LE has expressed an editorial opinion. Please take note LoveRugbyLeague. I don't find Martyn Sadler negative, I think he's alright. I don't like the way his organisation named Kevin Sinfield as the best player in the world to generate a bit of publicity, but that's publishing. Taken from the editorial. In fact we have had absolutely no positive response from any of our readers. Come again Martyn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrywebbisgod Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I prefer Ben and Jerry's Cookie Dough. Thank you for your valuable contribution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Taken from the editorial. In fact we have had absolutely no positive response from any of our readers. Come again Martyn. So, how many from here have actually written a positive response to the RLE? I remember when ............................."It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry the Leit Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Taken from the editorial. In fact we have had absolutely no positive response from any of our readers. Come again Martyn. It's quite conceivable that there is nothing in the mailbag from any of their readership that is of a positive nature in relation to this nonsense proposal. The Unicorn is not a Goose, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doghead Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 It's quite conceivable that there is nothing in the mailbag from any of their readership that is of a positive nature in relation to this nonsense proposal.Off we go again "nonsence proposal" specifics please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry the Leit Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 (edited) Off we go again "nonsence proposal" specifics please. I've been consistent on this one, admittedly elsewhere on the board. I see this proposal as an opening gambit that will be rejected, to be replaced by something less silly, but silly enough to have been rejected if it had been put up first. I think it will lead in time to the top clubs getting stronger and stronger, clubs from the bottom half of the superleague won't be able to budget properly because they can't predict their crowds, and they will be weakened by playing sides that are currently part time for over half the year. What has absoultuey amazed me is the willingness of the supporters of clubs currently at the top of the second tier of professional rugby league to accept a proposal that will put them at the bottom of the second tier of professional rugby league. It's not good for any club in the long run as supporters tire of repeat fixtures at the top, budgets are slashed and club go bust lower down, and below the top of the current championship is turned into a forgotten wasteland. Edited May 13, 2013 by Larry the Leit The Unicorn is not a Goose, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry the Leit Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I'm guessing that if there is Rocky Road at the RFL, then Nigel Wood will have eaten it by now, probably with a side order of a suckling pig*. *apologies, but this is the third page of this thread and nobody has referred to the man's weight, which breaks all tradition. The Unicorn is not a Goose, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 1. Sorry, I thought this whole review and suggestions was for Rugby League not just Super League. There isn't a Magic Weekend currently for the Championships because they currently have the NR Cup Final weekend and the Championship Grand Finals weekend. 2. This would seem to be a pointless trophy as they would be Champions of what exactly? 3. There are still 10 - 14 teams outside the 24 teams in Tiers 1 and 2, currently known as Championship 1. Are we just forgetting about them? What are you mithering me for? I was just commenting on the specific things that have been called out. I don't care whether we have 1, 2 or no Magic Weekends, let the RFL/clubs decide. I am not commenting on the whole game, as to be quite honest, no details of anything other than the 2 x 12 has been reported, so without making a load of stuff up I have nothing to say on them. Not really any need for your style of questioning about my points which are in response to things in the public domain. As and when we hear anything about the teams below 1-24 then I'll give my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 What are you mithering me for? I was just commenting on the specific things that have been called out. I don't care whether we have 1, 2 or no Magic Weekends, let the RFL/clubs decide. I am not commenting on the whole game, as to be quite honest, no details of anything other than the 2 x 12 has been reported, so without making a load of stuff up I have nothing to say on them. Not really any need for your style of questioning about my points which are in response to things in the public domain. As and when we hear anything about the teams below 1-24 then I'll give my opinion. Because from the tone of your post it seemed like your only interest was for the top tier clubs and no-one else. I was just giving an alternative viewpoint. I remember when ............................."It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gav Wilson Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I'm pleased that LE has expressed an editorial opinion. Please take note LoveRugbyLeague. Fill your boots mate, I'm actually just writing mine now too as it happens... @GavWilson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 Because from the tone of your post it seemed like your only interest was for the top tier clubs and no-one else. I was just giving an alternative viewpoint. Nope, you were reading something that wasn't there. I was commenting on what has been written. There was no mention of a 2nd division Magic Weekend - if this was mentioned, I'd have commented on it. I have no idea whether the NR Cup would be retained, it hasn't been mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Methven Hornet Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 ... i.e. purely hypothetical say the bottom four in Super League are London 9, Hull KR 8, Castleford 8, Salford 6. And the top of Championship are Halifax 20, Featherstone 16, Sheffield 16, Leigh 15. The full-time clubs then have ground to make up instead of simply running away on an even keel, but also would add spice to try harder in the first 11 games... That is quite an intriguing proposal, and could possibly go some way to solving the problem of having full-time clubs from the top 12 playing the part-time clubs from the bottom 12. You'd probably have to tweak the points carried forward in some way to make it more of a realistic handicap, but it would probably make for a more exciting competition. The only problem, again, would be that if the part-time finished in the top 4 they would still only have weeks to put a full-time squad together. And they would be more likely to finish in the 'middle play-off' the next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.n Other Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 The only problem, again, would be that if the part-time finished in the top 4 they would still only have weeks to put a full-time squad together. And they would be more likely to finish in the 'middle play-off' the next season. With an increased cap and increased payment, a few (Fev, Fax) may go mainly full time. So therefore some the complete change of squad wouldnt be needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Methven Hornet Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 With an increased cap and increased payment, a few (Fev, Fax) may go mainly full time. So therefore some the complete change of squad wouldnt be needed. Have these been announced as part of the proposals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steef Posted May 13, 2013 Share Posted May 13, 2013 I think the two divisions spliting to three mid season could be brilliant. The key to it working is if the caps are close enough to give meaningful competition in the middle division. As stated by others it would produce so many more games with something riding on them plus the top players would play more intense games each year. If this becomes reality it would need to be executed very well though. More details of funding etc need to be made public to make a proper judgement though. "surely they've got to try somthing different now, maybe the little chip over the top?2 http://www.flickr.com/photos/stufod/ http://www.facebook.com/pages/Stuarts-photography/156268557729980 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Methven Hornet Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 I think the two divisions spliting to three mid season could be brilliant. The key to it working is if the caps are close enough to give meaningful competition in the middle division. As stated by others it would produce so many more games with something riding on them plus the top players would play more intense games each year. If this becomes reality it would need to be executed very well though. More details of funding etc need to be made public to make a proper judgement though. And then the problem could be that the standard of the elite competition falls significantly, possibly affecting future TV contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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