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The never-ending League Restructure debate (Many merged threads)

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JohnM
JohnM

Page 157, post #3127  Think we'll beat "Cas Vegas is Ace"?

gingerjon

gingerjon

Posted
Posted

4 games actually

 

Four definite sell outs of 11k.  Predicted well in advance of even knowing when these games will take place or under what conditions.

 

Very impressive.

 

Do you also do the attendances for the RFU?

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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gingerjon

gingerjon

Posted
Posted

Given that the poster specified $uperleague, yeah, they would.

 

And they'd be bound to sell out because Stuart Raper said something once.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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DAZROVER1985

DAZROVER1985

Posted
Posted

I think what also needs to be considered in relation to Leigh's previous time in a SL is that they now have a top class modern day sporting facility and the board of management is far more professional and business savvy.

so they have a different fan base to last time
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Griff

Griff

Posted
Posted

And they'd be bound to sell out because Stuart Raper said something once.

 

Jeez,  you said the games wouldn't even take place but I didn't believe that either.

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"

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The Parksider

The Parksider

Posted
Posted

I think what also needs to be considered in relation to Leigh's previous time in a SL is that they now have a top class modern day sporting facility and the board of management is far more professional and business savvy.

 

I think we can say that of Widnes, so would you like to compare your forecasts with the reality of Widnes's crowd performance??

 

Widnes are a bit bigger better supported club, but it's a half decent comparison?

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Wellsy4HullFC

Wellsy4HullFC

Posted
Posted

In the end Huddersfield had to go in 2001, after coming bottom of Superleague for the fourth consecutive time flatlining on 3,000+ crowds. They had a largely "bought in" their team with plenty of Aussies, but no real junior development system.

They became a "Championship club" but they had the trump card of a very rich "Investor".

What did this man invest in?? Ten years on do we see 15,000 crowds in Huddersfield? Do we see a production line of talent for the game from a well funded and well staffed academy??

Does the game not need to produce numbers of quality home grown players so we can have a good International side? Does it no need to attract numbers of fans so we can fill stadiums for our showpiece club and international events?

This money isn't investment, it's self aggrandisment. What was the first thing Mr. Koukash invested in? Development officers for Manchester/Salford?? Reopening the Salford academy and staffing it with the best?? Maybe, but that may be real investment.

If I invest £Millions into Hunslet will that increase player production and fan generation in Leeds, or will every pound I put in be a blow to Leeds and muck up their fantastic solid progress?? Had Neil Hudgell put £500K a year into Hull.F.C. where may they be now??

Throwing millions at small clubs isn't "Investment" and when you work it through it can undo a lot of real investment and hard work, and be very damaging to the game.

I may have misread this, but is this suggesting that Huddersfield do not produce their own players?

Can someone reply for me since Parky won't.

Wells%20Motors%20(Signature)_zps67e534e4.jpg
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The Parksider

The Parksider

Posted
Posted

I think what also needs to be considered in relation to Leigh's previous time in a SL is that they now have a top class modern day sporting facility and the board of management is far more professional and business savvy.

 

Widnes’s games against Wigan, Saints, Warrington and Leeds on promotion averaged 7,261

 

Games against Salford Hull and Huddersfield averaged  4,901

 

Widnes built attendances on a core support of 3744.

 

Widnes’s attendances were on average improved by  61%

 

If Leigh were to be promoted now on an “ageing” core fanbase of 1,556 then a 61% increase would give them 2,505.

 

I think they would get more than this, but only if they actually competed. Check out the 3,178 Salford crowds last year when the club won 6 Superleague games.

 

Widnes, Leigh and Salford all have modern stadia. Hope this helps....

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gingerjon

gingerjon

Posted
Posted

Jeez,  you said the games wouldn't even take place but I didn't believe that either.

 

I said that if we go to the 3x8 that quite a few people still seem to think is a good, rather than alarmingly awful, idea that those games would not take place.  I don't think it's yet been decided what will actually be called Super League from 2015 - whether it's the top tier, the top two tiers, the top tier and then the middle 8 ...

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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GIANTSTRIDES

GIANTSTRIDES

Posted
Posted

I may have misread this, but is this suggesting that Huddersfield do not produce their own players?

Can someone reply for me since Parky won't.

 

 

I will Wellsy. Huddersfield are improving slowly at producing players, They still lag behind lots of clubs, and i think that is because they lag behind many areas in the number of Amateurs playing the game.

 

To be honest i think this has nearly always been the case , So the fact that Fartown themselves had got to such a low ebb for such a long time, may not have a very big bearing .

 

As i have said before Fartowns biggest problem is Soccer, Even back in the 50s when they had a good side, Town would still outdraw them, Although back in those days people could afford to go to both, and many did,

Dont expect anything from a pig but a grunt

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andyram

andyram

Posted
Posted

Hope it gets all sorted out before the season starts, lets get promotion anf relegation back and all Super League teams will have something to play for until September, not like in the past few years when half of the teams are going through the motion from around July onwards.

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willy

willy

Posted
Posted

I agree with him. The standard of the championship clubs needs to improve, so there is competition to get into the stagnant pool that is SL. Competition that has a sound business behind it. Unlike now!!!!! SL is stuffed full of teams that seem on the edge of bankruptcy all the time. If the aim is to get championship sides with more full time players then its a big start and means less players get lost to the sport at the upper levels and less average players in the championship.

 

Makes sense if you don't have meaningful academy matches anymore

 

Much more cut throat I guess all round, more money flowing down through the game, assist the likes of Oxford and anyone else just climbing on board, keeps the likes of Sheffield and Leigh on a more even keel. Protects the sport to a degree.

 

It doesn't promote the interests of the top tier but then neither did licensing, it provided a stable backdrop but no real growth, hence no main sponsor, simples.

 

The new system promotes innovation and growth throughout the sport, exactly what you don't want if its a small pie and you want more of it

 

Odd thing to say but Lenighan = no growth as a sport through self interest = luddite!!!!

 

We wont get a sponsor until the sport innovates and moves on, licensing here was only part of the journey, to grow the sport nationally we need a path through to the upper reaches. Aus don't because money buys a franchise a la NFL etc.

 

Different business model here, licensing was necessary, now lets move on, re-invigorate and aggressively target sponsors and new markets through the likes of Gloucester and Oxford and other regions such as Bristol and even the like of Italy eventually

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GIANTSTRIDES

GIANTSTRIDES

Posted
Posted

I agree with him. The standard of the championship clubs needs to improve, so there is competition to get into the stagnant pool that is SL. Competition that has a sound business behind it. Unlike now!!!!! SL is stuffed full of teams that seem on the edge of bankruptcy all the time. If the aim is to get championship sides with more full time players then its a big start and means less players get lost to the sport at the upper levels and less average players in the championship.

 

Makes sense if you don't have meaningful academy matches anymore

 

Much more cut throat I guess all round, more money flowing down through the game, assist the likes of Oxford and anyone else just climbing on board, keeps the likes of Sheffield and Leigh on a more even keel. Protects the sport to a degree.

 

It doesn't promote the interests of the top tier but then neither did licensing, it provided a stable backdrop but no real growth, hence no main sponsor, simples.

 

The new system promotes innovation and growth throughout the sport, exactly what you don't want if its a small pie and you want more of it

 

Odd thing to say but Lenighan = no growth as a sport through self interest = luddite!!!!

 

We wont get a sponsor until the sport innovates and moves on, licensing here was only part of the journey, to grow the sport nationally we need a path through to the upper reaches. Aus don't because money buys a franchise a la NFL etc.

 

Different business model here, licensing was necessary, now lets move on, re-invigorate and aggressively target sponsors and new markets through the likes of Gloucester and Oxford and other regions such as Bristol and even the like of Italy eventually

 

 

There is a long thread going about this, But just for the sake of answering.

 

1  This money you talk of that is going to to be flowing down through the game, Where is that going to come from ?  If you think that the SKY money from 2 relegated SL clubs is going to fund all this , I think you are going to be very disappointed.

 

2  A very odd thing to say i agree, But the huge amount of money he has put into the game will look like nothing compared to your season ticket, so i see your point.

 

3  What has been stopping this from happening before the impending Revolution , Could it possibly be the fault of the only section of the game that has been going forward and bringing in revenue perhaps.

Dont expect anything from a pig but a grunt

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Keith T

Keith T

Posted
Posted

Every club and all the fans of those clubs want money and lots of it.

 

The top 12 or 14 clubs have a nice lump of money from Sky and them and their fans want to hang on to it no matter what else happens in the game.

 

The rest of the clubs and their fans want to get amongst that money and some will agree to anything if it means getting some of that money.

 

That sums it up and also how many people on here argue.

 

Now do we need another thread on the subject because nothing is going to change in posts on here.

I remember when .............................

"It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996.

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