The never-ending League Restructure debate (Many merged threads)

[RSN]

Wood just said on Boots n All.

'We need a change to allow our top clubs to remain internationally competitive.'

'Some clubs haven't had the impact they should of had with the 5 year protection they've had and haven't made the progress we would of liked.'

At least he highlights two of the main issues in the game, our clubs being left behind and a lot of clubs not progressing.

I still agree with the two tens Ken Davey proposed with more cup competitions.

[Northern Sol]

When you put it like that......

There are capable people at Red Hall though, regardless of whether the CEO is one of them, and I honestly think central control is needed in London, along with a central base for the sport.

Disagree.

 

Broncos management might be incompetent but at least they know London. The RFL would add geographical ignorance without adding any competence.

[Northern Sol]

I see what you mean NS, but we need homogeneity

when these teams joined the comp, especially the new ones they will have budgeted for transport costs, or maybe they all even recieve a subsidy-money well spent.

I think the clubs, again expecially the new ones will have been aware of what their attendances would be-and I think they do remarkably well in their first campaign.

Yeah but bums on seats is what clubs need and lower transportation costs. Potentially we could have a couple of Cumbrian sides in CC1 at some point. Not good either for the south or Cumbria. Too much spent on fuel and too much travelling for players who are paid very little.

 

If Skolars vs Hemel is a bigger drawcard than Skolars vs Rochdale then we should think about how we can get the likes of St Albans and Medway into the league within the next 5 years.

[Father Ted]

I like Rod Studd, he runs a fast paced show something B n A isn't.

He likes P & R although it has failed before and will again as Rod well knows.

What isn't mentioned is that clubs voted to go from 12 to 14 as there weren't enough home games with just 11. What they will gain with extra central funding theyr will lose in gate receipts.

Those at the bottom end of the SL will look to recruit mature NRL journeymen who will cost a fortune in the hope they will keep the club up.

Thought they made a good point about the Magic weekend saying it has no place in a League with P & R.

Noting London v Catalan and Salford V Widnes.

The Magic needs to be transferred to the C Cup and be the round in which the SL clubs join the comp.

Start the C Cup Spring Bank Holday and end August Bank Holiday as now.

[MrFussy]

Short answer is: no-one knows. Including the RFL.

But surely there must be some sort of outline plan for this 3 x 8 thing for it to have been proposed? I must be honest it sounds rather bizarre to me, I'm struggling to understand it all. 

Edited July 17, 2013 by MrFussy

[bobbruce]

I like Rod Studd, he runs a fast paced show something B n A isn't.

He likes P & R although it has failed before and will again as Rod well knows.

What isn't mentioned is that clubs voted to go from 12 to 14 as there weren't enough home games with just 11. What they will gain with extra central funding theyr will lose in gate receipts.

Those at the bottom end of the SL will look to recruit mature NRL journeymen who will cost a fortune in the hope they will keep the club up.

Thought they made a good point about the Magic weekend saying it has no place in a League with P & R.

Noting London v Catalan and Salford V Widnes.

The Magic needs to be transferred to the C Cup and be the round in which the SL clubs join the comp.

Start the C Cup Spring Bank Holday and end August Bank Holiday as now.

Even when there were 12 teams in the league they still had 14 home games because of repeat fixtures.

[bobbruce]

Wood just said on Boots n All.

'We need a change to allow our top clubs to remain internationally competitive.'

'Some clubs haven't had the impact they should of had with the 5 year protection they've had and haven't made the progress we would of liked.'

At least he highlights two of the main issues in the game, our clubs being left behind and a lot of clubs not progressing.

I still agree with the two tens Ken Davey proposed with more cup competitions.

I'm starting to see where the RFL is going with this its not about enlarging SL it will effectively reduce SL to eight teams. Behind that though there will be another 8 teams who can step in if one of the 8 over stretch themselves and go bust.

[Doghead]

Wood just said on Boots n All.

'We need a change to allow our top clubs to remain internationally competitive.'

'Some clubs haven't had the impact they should of had with the 5 year protection they've had and haven't made the progress we would of liked.'

At least he highlights two of the main issues in the game, our clubs being left behind and a lot of clubs not progressing.

I still agree with the two tens Ken Davey proposed with more cup competitions.

 

 

 

But he seemed to rule out that the bottom two will automatically be dropped at the end of next season, saying the main criteria will be results on the field, but other factors need to be considered also. can see this being sorted in the courts.

 

[Ponterover]

Watched Super League Back Chat and there isn't a week that goes by where Rod Studd isn't pushing P & R, and irritatingly shouts down anyone that dares disagree with him. 

 

Is there a chance we could get a journalist on this show that actually knows what the hell they are talking about?

 

I would also appreciate it if they stopped saying that all of the fans want it back because that isn't the case. I know just as many who are against that are for.

 

Memo to Rod Studd and the other so called journalists on BackChat:

 

Promotion & Relegation is a british sporting tradition, but so is losing. 

 

Why can't we just stick to one thing for a few years without chopping and changing?

 

 

Haven't you worked it out yet?

 

Our broadcast partner and main benefactor, Sky want it.  He who pays the piper calls the tune etc. Rod Studd is merely their mouthpiece.

 

 

Chris Irvine delivered the line of the night though "Licensing is Boring" - Genius and so very true.  I think that too many people have forgotten that we are part of the entertainment industry and should try not to be boring.

Edited July 17, 2013 by Ponterover

[Guest]

I've never met anyone against P&R. It just a small vocal minority on here

Usually from suppoters of teams that would be threatened with relegation. the most constant form of criticism I hear from non rugby league sports fans to me is that the of the lack of P&R makes it a joke and what's the point of the leagues below super league.

[Pottsy]

I'm starting to see where the RFL is going with this its not about enlarging SL it will effectively reduce SL to eight teams. Behind that though there will be another 8 teams who can step in if one of the 8 over stretch themselves and go bust.

Glad the penny has dropped. Aside from Sheffield the aspiring clubs below super league don't seem to have grasped this yet.

I agree with the earlier poster too; Davy's two tens + more cup fixtures has a lot of merit and should've been properly discussed.

It just proved that Wood is desperate to push through his latest crackpot schemes. How many of these stupid ideas does wood get to push through before he falls on his sword?

[The Parksider]

I'm starting to see where the RFL is going with this its not about enlarging SL it will effectively reduce SL to eight teams. Behind that though there will be another 8 teams who can step in if one of the 8 over stretch themselves and go bust.

 

This is it for me. Hard to miss though unless you ignore the differences between 15,000 crowds and 800 crowds, fully professional teams with stars and dual reg bolstered semi pro teams, or chairmen worth tens of millions against chairmen with nowt to put in.

[GeordieSaint]

Glad the penny has dropped. Aside from Sheffield the aspiring clubs below super league don't seem to have grasped this yet.

I agree with the earlier poster too; Davy's two tens + more cup fixtures has a lot of merit and should've been properly discussed.

It just proved that Wood is desperate to push through his latest crackpot schemes. How many of these stupid ideas does wood get to push through before he falls on his sword?

 

I'd love to know what Wood meant by internationally competitive as well? Only one team a season plays a game outside of the SL season so don't understand the comment. If he is referring to keeping hold of players, then it won't make a blind bit of difference considering the clubs can't afford to compete against a salry cap double our own in Australia.

[Pottsy]

I'd love to know what Wood meant by internationally competitive as well? Only one team a season plays a game outside of the SL season so don't understand the comment. If he is referring to keeping hold of players, then it won't make a blind bit of difference considering the clubs can't afford to compete against a salry cap double our own in Australia.

He's looking increasingly out of his depth in my opinion.

His one 'significant achievement' since assuming the mantle of leadership has been to completely divert any attention that could and should have been placed on the forthcoming World Cup.

[GeordieSaint]

He's looking increasingly out of his depth in my opinion.

His one 'significant achievement' since assuming the mantle of leadership has been to completely divert any attention that could and should have been placed on the forthcoming World Cup.

 

Agreed.

 

Anyone with club links should be nowhere near the top job in the UK game, even more so if they failed in those club positions.

[Pottsy]

I don't care what links people have as long as they're competent.

[GeordieSaint]

I don't care what links people have as long as they're competent.

 

Competency is obviously the most important requirement. But in my opinion impartiality at CE level is essential as well.

[Pottsy]

Competency is obviously the most important requirement. But in my opinion impartiality at CE level is essential as well.

I see where you're coming from but if you're genuinely competent you should also be capable of leading impartially.

[The Parksider]

He's looking increasingly out of his depth in my opinion

 

He's up against a rival code that is the national game and swamps all others, up against two other sports who have had tremendous home grown success very recently, up against a direct rival handling code with a bigger infrastructure and again international success in recent weeks. Only one TV company wants his game at knockdown price, advertisers see no value in it, and to top that he's got a rival league within his own sport who are draining his clubs of quality players. He can't get development money for the grass roots as kids prefer other sports, and he only has a handful of chairmen willing to invest in his flagship SL clubs.

 

So perhaps people may consider actually judging him against the circumstances, and pondering on the idea that somewhere there's someone that can succeed against such massive odds.

[Doghead]

Glad the penny has dropped. Aside from Sheffield the aspiring clubs below super league don't seem to have grasped this yet.

I agree with the earlier poster too; Davy's two tens + more cup fixtures has a lot of merit and should've been properly discussed.

It just proved that Wood is desperate to push through his latest crackpot schemes. How many of these stupid ideas does wood get to push through before he falls on his sword?

got to agree, a Super League of 2x10 with the right funding must be the aim of all the "shakers and movers" in our game, whether its achievable is a different matter.

[Doghead]

This is it for me. Hard to miss though unless you ignore the differences between 15,000 crowds and 800 crowds, fully professional teams with stars and dual reg bolstered semi pro teams, or chairmen worth tens of millions against chairmen with nowt to put in.

There will always be clubs with a larger fan base and more money, but they will be in the same lake, swimming with the big fish, tiddlers ot not.

[Viking Ste]

How do you see the leagues lining up then? I think...

SL 1

Bradford

Catalans

Huddersfield

Hull FC

Hull KR

Leeds

Salford

St Helens

Toulouse

Wakefield

Warrington

Wigan

SL2

Batley

Castleford

Dewsbury

Doncaster

Featherstone

Halifax

Leigh

London

NW Crusaders

Sheffield

Widnes

Workington

[Pottsy]

How do you see the leagues lining up then? I think...

SL 1

Bradford

Catalans

Huddersfield

Hull FC

Hull KR

Leeds

Salford

St Helens

Toulouse

Wakefield

Warrington

Wigan

SL2

Batley

Castleford

Dewsbury

Doncaster

Featherstone

Halifax

Leigh

London

NW Crusaders

Sheffield

Widnes

Workington

I'm not going to pick out the names but it's absolutely essential in my eyes that the 24 teams involved initially need to be selected through some form of licensing, rather than arbitrarily as happened in 1996.

Looking at your list I'm also even more convinced that the RFL and its c

[Griff]

He's up against a rival code that is the national game and swamps all others, up against two other sports who have had tremendous home grown success very recently, up against a direct rival handling code with a bigger infrastructure and again international success in recent weeks. Only one TV company wants his game at knockdown price, advertisers see no value in it, and to top that he's got a rival league within his own sport who are draining his clubs of quality players. He can't get development money for the grass roots as kids prefer other sports, and he only has a handful of chairmen willing to invest in his flagship SL clubs.

 

So perhaps people may consider actually judging him against the circumstances, and pondering on the idea that somewhere there's someone that can succeed against such massive odds.

Very fair comment.

[Pottsy]

He's up against a rival code that is the national game and swamps all others, up against two other sports who have had tremendous home grown success very recently, up against a direct rival handling code with a bigger infrastructure and again international success in recent weeks. Only one TV company wants his game at knockdown price, advertisers see no value in it, and to top that he's got a rival league within his own sport who are draining his clubs of quality players. He can't get development money for the grass roots as kids prefer other sports, and he only has a handful of chairmen willing to invest in his flagship SL clubs.

So perhaps people may consider actually judging him against the circumstances, and pondering on the idea that somewhere there's someone that can succeed against such massive odds.

Your defence of Nigel is admirable with Parky and you're right: whoever is top dog at the RFL is going to be faced with some monumental challenges.

However, the harsh reality is that Nigel's every whim has been backed by the clubs (clubcall, licensing etc) and he's now not only gone completely about face and is telling us that the sport NEEDED p&r after all. Not only this but he's also shoehorning in another of his daft schemes.

I just don't see how he has any credibility left given his previous position on licensing.

Moreover, this whole process has been handled so clumsily in the full glare of the public and has completely detracted from the build up towards the World Cup.