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John Drake

Labour leadership contest

Which of the candidates would make you more likely to vote Labour if they win the leadership?  

55 members have voted

  1. 1. Which of the candidates would make you more likely to vote Labour if they win the leadership?

    • Andy Burnham
      13
    • Yvette Cooper
      13
    • Jeremy Corbyn
      14
    • Liz Kendall
      7
    • I would never vote Labour
      8
  2. 2. Did you vote Labour in the 2015 General Election?

    • Yes
      26
    • No
      29
  3. 3. Do you have a vote in the Labour leadership election?

    • Yes
      11
    • No
      44
  4. 4. Who would you vote for in the Labour leadership election?

    • Andy Burnham
      15
    • Yvette Cooper
      13
    • Jeremy Corbyn
      18
    • Liz Kendall
      9


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Social media (twitter especially) operates in self selecting bubbles.  The SNP found this out last year.  Many YES supporters thought they were a shoe in due to the number of pro-yes comments they saw. 

 

It was highlighted again at the election.  You tend to follow people because you like what they say.

All the SNP members I came into contact with pre-referendum knew the score, and realised that all the euphoria on the streets, in TV and newspaper polls, and on social media wasn't the real situation. You asked "How's it looking?" and you'd get the same knowing grimace that you used to get from Labour Party activists in the 80s and early 90s.

The people who did get carried away were those on the periphery of the wider Yes campaign, especially those who weren't out campaigning.

The other point is that many of the same people thought the SNP were a shoe-in in the Westminster elections, partly because of social media - and they won a landslide.

While I personally don't see Corbyn winning an election, it is possible that the activity on social media points to him doing better than any of the other candidates. Time will tell.

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Pretty poor if true

Kendal and Burnham have'nt got a chance anyway

Coopers got Ed Balls as a lead weight to carry

So its the JC the messiah all the way to electoral oblivion

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You'll have to go and work abroad again as an economic migrant. Don't come back in a hurry will you, we'll be building a better non bigoted society. Enjoy!

Another example of why you're getting a 1 week vacation from the forum.  You were warned earlier in this thread.


“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" - Mark Twain

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Not even 10am on Monday morning and I've probably heard the point of the week about the Labour leadership.  One guy in the office had his voting form and hadn't voted yet, a proper long-standing member, he said that choosing his preferred candidate was a bit like choosing which STD he would rather get.


“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" - Mark Twain

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Not even 10am on Monday morning and I've probably heard the point of the week about the Labour leadership.  One guy in the office had his voting form and hadn't voted yet, a proper long-standing member, he said that choosing his preferred candidate was a bit like choosing which STD he would rather get.

 

Unless Corbyn gets in, your mate will be getting the SDP.


Under Scrutiny by the Right-On Thought Police

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Not even 10am on Monday morning and I've probably heard the point of the week about the Labour leadership.  One guy in the office had his voting form and hadn't voted yet, a proper long-standing member, he said that choosing his preferred candidate was a bit like choosing which STD he would rather get.

 

Perhaps you and he might be in the wrong party. 


Four legs good - two legs bad

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Perhaps you and he might be in the wrong party. 

 

I see it as healthy skepticism; similar in a way to the way RL fans are often the greatest critics of the game they love. :dry:


"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

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Perhaps you and he might be in the wrong party. 

Not really...  If you think about it: Burnham, Cooper, Kendall and Corbyn, not exactly a leadership dream team.  Corbyn is being massively successful because the other three are weak.  The only one who could effectively challenge Cameron is Cooper but I think she'd be an abysmal PM.  Burnham has the worst of Ed Miliband and would be easy fodder for the media.  Kendall is just wrong in everything that Labour is about.  Corbyn may poke the right places for many people but he'd be an abysmal leader in trying to rally persistent and challenging Opposition and would need a 100+ majority to get anything through Parliament as PM because he can't exactly command respect based on past history of supporting the whip.  There's a reason why they have to keep dragging Gordon Brown out of retirement to speak on things, it's because they've few big hitters on the leadership stage with any credibility.

 

Same in the Tory party.  Look at Cameron, weak and useless in many ways, not a single patch on Major or Thatcher in terms of clear leadership.  When Hague was in charge, I got a distinct feeling of a natural leader but a bit unloved because he dared to have a non-southern accent at the wrong time for the Tories.  Look at the leadership candidates for when Cameron goes:  Boris, May and Osborne, all three would be disasters as leader and fit right in with the calibre of Burham, Cooper and Kendall.


“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" - Mark Twain

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Its vital that whatever happens, there is an effective "opposition" and there hasn't been one for five years, and to be honest, the signs don't look good. Its not a matter of "winning" in PMQs, as the public audience can't really be that many. What counts is "opposition" to call the govt to account across the board, in debates, in committee, in public.  Who will be best able to do that? Not Jezza, that's for sure.


Four legs good - two legs bad

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Not really...  If you think about it: Burnham, Cooper, Kendall and Corbyn, not exactly a leadership dream team.  Corbyn is being massively successful because the other three are weak.  The only one who could effectively challenge Cameron is Cooper but I think she'd be an abysmal PM.  Burnham has the worst of Ed Miliband and would be easy fodder for the media.  Kendall is just wrong in everything that Labour is about.  Corbyn may poke the right places for many people but he'd be an abysmal leader in trying to rally persistent and challenging Opposition and would need a 100+ majority to get anything through Parliament as PM because he can't exactly command respect based on past history of supporting the whip.  There's a reason why they have to keep dragging Gordon Brown out of retirement to speak on things, it's because they've few big hitters on the leadership stage with any credibility.

 

Same in the Tory party.  Look at Cameron, weak and useless in many ways, not a single patch on Major or Thatcher in terms of clear leadership.  When Hague was in charge, I got a distinct feeling of a natural leader but a bit unloved because he dared to have a non-southern accent at the wrong time for the Tories.  Look at the leadership candidates for when Cameron goes:  Boris, May and Osborne, all three would be disasters as leader and fit right in with the calibre of Burham, Cooper and Kendall.

Cable in this weekend's Guardian is scathing about Cameron. He implies that it's Osborne who's really running things. Dave is pretty much hands off.  He just likes chillaxing as PM and letting other people do the work.


“Few thought him even a starter.There were many who thought themselves smarter. But he ended PM, CH and OM. An Earl and a Knight of the Garter.”

Clement Attlee.

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Good. Looking forward to Osborne as PM, against  Jezza. If today's debate is anything to go by, Labour is doomed to decades out of power.


Four legs good - two legs bad

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I have worked for a couple of councils in their children's services and came across many households similar to those you refer to. 

And no wonder councils are are failing. You refer to it as 'work'.

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Good. Looking forward to Osborne as PM, against  Jezza. If today's debate is anything to go by, Labour is doomed to decades out of power.

Cable describes Osborne as cynical, only interested in power. Not interested in economics just in what will keep him in power.  Sort of stacks up with his reported non stop texting of Clegg on 7th May when he thought there'd be a hung parliament.  Osborne is not a popular personality. Look at the way he was roundly booed at the parolympics.


“Few thought him even a starter.There were many who thought themselves smarter. But he ended PM, CH and OM. An Earl and a Knight of the Garter.”

Clement Attlee.

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hes popular alright....with the voters.

you citing Cable as any sort of authority? How quaint.

but the leadership election? will it be delayed becuase lots of papers not gone out?


Four legs good - two legs bad

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And no wonder councils are are failing. You refer to it as 'work'.

And that's a bit of a personal comment for such a new member... suspended until we can investigate troll-finder logs OR you can convince us you're not a troll.


“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" - Mark Twain

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The SDP had existing elected MPs. Apples and oranges.

Left Unity was not brought up by me but by JohnM asking whether LU members have a vote in the Labour leadership contest. We don't.

What benefit will I be to the Labour Party? Well, i was previously elected to many positions in the party, so maybe I'll try that again. I've been politically active since i was 12 and joined the Labour Party at 15. I won't be thinking that political activity is about having sycophantic selfies looking like a love sick schoolgirl next to Andy Wandy Burnham.

 

One thing I agree with Jeremy Corbyn on is that political activity shouldn't involve resorting to cheap personal attacks.


.

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but the leadership election? will it be delayed becuase lots of papers not gone out?

 

Delayed? Oh please, noooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!! :fie:


.

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Its vital that whatever happens, there is an effective "opposition" and there hasn't been one for five years, and to be honest, the signs don't look good. Its not a matter of "winning" in PMQs, as the public audience can't really be that many. What counts is "opposition" to call the govt to account across the board, in debates, in committee, in public.  Who will be best able to do that? Not Jezza, that's for sure.

 

You say that there hasn't been an effective opposition for the past five years, but here's one right wing commentator who was fair enough to provide some evidence to the contrary prior to the last General Election.

 

Ed Miliband’s critics hate him for his success - Peter Oborne

On Murdoch, big business, Syria and Palestine, the Labour leader has changed the game. Some will never forgive him

http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/9438172/ed-milibands-biggest-critics-dont-hate-him-for-how-hes-failed-they-hate-him-for-how-hes-succeeded/

 

Then there's the work done by Labour's probable next deputy leader Tom Watson holding the Murdoch empire to account on the Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee, and I know you're full of admiration for the way Margaret Hodge has tormented bankers during her tenure as chair of the Public Accounts Committee. ;)

 

You're right that opposition takes many forms, and shouldn't be judged on the weekly pantomime of PMQs, though failure on that platform does cast a large shadow over any other achievements.


.

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Not even 10am on Monday morning and I've probably heard the point of the week about the Labour leadership.  One guy in the office had his voting form and hadn't voted yet, a proper long-standing member, he said that choosing his preferred candidate was a bit like choosing which STD he would rather get.

 

There's no pleasing some folk, though, particularly grumpy and depressed members of the Labour Party.


.

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You say that there hasn't been an effective opposition for the past five years, but here's one right wing commentator who was fair enough to provide some evidence to the contrary prior to the last General Election.

 

Ed Miliband’s critics hate him for his success - Peter OborneOn Murdoch, big business, Syria and Palestine, the Labour leader has changed the game. Some will never forgive himhttp://www.spectator.co.uk/features/9438172/ed-milibands-biggest-critics-dont-hate-him-for-how-hes-failed-they-hate-him-for-how-hes-succeeded/

 

Then there's the work done by Labour's probable next deputy leader Tom Watson holding the Murdoch empire to account on the Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee, and I know you're full of admiration for the way Margaret Hodge has tormented bankers during her tenure as chair of the Public Accounts Committee. ;)

 

You're right that opposition takes many forms, and shouldn't be judged on the weekly pantomime of PMQs, though failure on that platform does cast a large shadow over any other achievements.

chicken feed, though.

and it's Dame Margaret to you, by the way.


Four legs good - two legs bad

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chicken feed, though.

and it's Dame Margaret to you, by the way.

 

There's not much more any opposition can achieve in Parliament when faced with a government majority. Just ask all those fallen Tory leaders vanquished by Tony Blair.

 

Opposition is a thankless job, which is one of the reasons I'm keen for Labour to pick a leader who can get back to winning elections instead of losing them.


.

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hes popular alright....with the voters.

you citing Cable as any sort of authority? How quaint.

but the leadership election? will it be delayed becuase lots of papers not gone out?

Cable was right there at the centre of affairs, who else (who'd be willing to talk) would know?  As for popularity, if I were as popular as Gideon I'd blow my brains out.


“Few thought him even a starter.There were many who thought themselves smarter. But he ended PM, CH and OM. An Earl and a Knight of the Garter.”

Clement Attlee.

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Not really...  If you think about it: Burnham, Cooper, Kendall and Corbyn, not exactly a leadership dream team.  Corbyn is being massively successful because the other three are weak.  The only one who could effectively challenge Cameron is Cooper but I think she'd be an abysmal PM.  Burnham has the worst of Ed Miliband and would be easy fodder for the media.  Kendall is just wrong in everything that Labour is about.  Corbyn may poke the right places for many people but he'd be an abysmal leader in trying to rally persistent and challenging Opposition and would need a 100+ majority to get anything through Parliament as PM because he can't exactly command respect based on past history of supporting the whip.  There's a reason why they have to keep dragging Gordon Brown out of retirement to speak on things, it's because they've few big hitters on the leadership stage with any credibility.

 

Same in the Tory party.  Look at Cameron, weak and useless in many ways, not a single patch on Major or Thatcher in terms of clear leadership.  When Hague was in charge, I got a distinct feeling of a natural leader but a bit unloved because he dared to have a non-southern accent at the wrong time for the Tories.  Look at the leadership candidates for when Cameron goes:  Boris, May and Osborne, all three would be disasters as leader and fit right in with the calibre of Burham, Cooper and Kendall.

 

Who should have stood who didn't?

 

I think it is difficult to judge a leader until they become one. I remember Tony Blair being derided as weak and ineffective before he got the job, but his nickname 'Bambi' didn't last long once he did get it!

 

And what was it Churchill said about Clement Attlee... 'a very modest man with much to be modest about', yet look at what he achieved in office.


.

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