Would You Like to See Licensing Back and What Are Your Opinions on It?

[Buderus]

Coming from an NRL background I was a big fan of licensing and have been underwhelmed by the super 8 system that has replaced it. I personally believe licensing is the best way to grow the sport going forward. I would like to see 3 year licensing opened up for all 3 divisions. The Super League and Championship will both run at 12 team comps with League 1 split into 2 8 team conferences. This gives the teams in the Championship there own competition with its own grand final. It also allows clubs to find there level. Licensing would help the right clubs be in the right competition and for Super League to really grow. It would be important for the system to be transparent and not be afraid to make the right changes. The Super League will be the elite level, the Championship a place for teams with super league aspirations to grow and improve, and league 1 for development and heritage clubs. 

 

An example of a Super League with Licensing (that looks much better in my opinion) would be

 

Super League

Leeds, St Helens, Wigan, Hull FC, Catalans, Toulouse, Warrington, Huddersfield, Widnes, Salford, Leigh, Hull KR

Championship 

Toronto, Castleford, Wakefield, London, Bradford, Halifax, Sheffield, Featherstone, Batley, Newcastle, Coventry, Doncaster

League 1

Remaining 16 teams, 2 Conferences of 8 teams

 

Would like to hear some opinions on whether you liked licensing and would like to see it back or would prefer to go in another direction

[Hvy wg]

I'd pledge for a "one off" P&R game combined with licenses. Bottom SL team vs Top Championship team. Whoever wins gets the right to be in SL.

 

[Southerner]

I'd pledge for a "one off" P&R game combined with licenses. Bottom SL team vs Top Championship team. Whoever wins gets the right to be in SL.

 

^ This!

Licensing saw Catalans enter SL who have been a huge benefit to the competition (as well as helping build the game internationally). Licensing needs to be one route to SL as it provides a short cut for investors to back the sport. We also need the opportunity to promote teams such as Leigh, who in my opinion deserve the opportunity. We must remember that we are not a sport like Football who can simply rely on P&R. If a team such as Huddersfield got relegated it could be the start of their demise and whilst in Football there would be many teams ready to take their place, the same cannot be said for SL. We need to protect the clubs such as Hudds whilst providing a clear route for successful clubs to gain promotion.... If there was a team who were meeting licensing criteria then they should be promoted through a licensing system rather than waiting for them to gain promotion via an unfair (salary cap) system. 

I also like the idea of Bottom SL team vs Top Championship team playoff, so that there are sufficient benefits (of finishing top of Champ) and consequences (of finishing bottom of SL).

[RidingPie]

I preferred licensing! I can understand people thought that the road to getting a license was convoluted and that the governing body just made up which clubs got points for what at license renewal time. If it were brought back I would like to see more transparency in that area. Without out that Super League does seem a closed shop which it should never be.

[Bull4Life]

But what if the bottom team in Super League loses to the top team in the Championship, but still meets the same licensing requirements that have given all the other SL teams their place? Would their expulsion from SL be deemed as fair?

 

We need to protect the clubs such as Hudds whilst providing a clear route for successful clubs to gain promotion....

 

I understand what you are saying, but what if Hudds were the team that finished bottom - would they be protected and the second from bottom team face potential relegation instead? What would be the criteria for 'protecting' a club?

[Colin James]

It is a sport. As such success and failure should be judged on the pitch, not by a panel deciding that team X has a nicer car park than team Y. Licensing is not sport.

Give the 8s a chance. We've had one year and one game.

[Hvy wg]

But what if the bottom team in Super League loses to the top team in the Championship, but still meets the same licensing requirements that have given all the other SL teams their place? Would their expulsion from SL be deemed as fair?

 

 

I understand what you are saying, but what if Hudds were the team that finished bottom - would they be protected and the second from bottom team face potential relegation instead? What would be the criteria for 'protecting' a club?

If the top Championship club meets the requirements, I don't see why it wouldn't be fair. Two teams able to get a license play a game to see who's going to be in SL. 

All SL clubs needs to meet the requirements and all clubs looking to get in SL should too. 

[Guest]

What's wrong with the simple and straight forward system of promotion and relegation??

[roughyed8]

What's wrong with the simple and straight forward system of promotion and relegation??

There is nothing wrong with it when teams in both divisions are on a levelish playing field finance wise ie central funding full time squads etc.

what was hapening pre licencing was the team that won promotion had 3 months to go full time and put a team together to compete, and generally ended up signing many of the players from the team that had just gone down, and struggled to compete.

[JM2010]

If licensing was reintroduced I'd like to see a couple of conferences created. I think there's probably enough teams for two conferences of 8 at the moment which would have the potential to expand to 10 and 12 if more teams reached the required standard in the future.

[DemonUK]

No. How many more FT teams did licensing produce? How many more FT teams do we have now? Absolutely zero point in teams outside of a licensed SL being FT

[Buderus]

The problem I have with promotion and relegation is the potential for damage it can cause. If Huddersfield or Leeds get relegated (albeit unlikely) the damage that could cause to the competition would be devastating. I also believe that it's hard for some clubs to put long term plans in place to improve themselves. They instead get stuck in a year to year relegation battle doing just enough to survive. A comparison is my club Newcastke in the NRL who are doing a complete rebuild to make themselves a better club but bringing through the young players. They can do this because they have time something which licensing would give super league clubs

[Bob8]

It is a sport. As such success and failure should be judged on the pitch, not by a panel deciding that team X has a nicer car park than team Y. Licensing is not sport.

Give the 8s a chance. We've had one year and one game.

It is a sport.  As is kids playing tag in the play ground, kids running round with a rugby ball in a park two women playing badminton in a leisure centre.  If you want it to be an economically viable and successful sport, you have to start being pragmatic.

 

Much as I was against the 8s, another needless change would be pointless.

[Mattrhino]

Id love to see licensing back!

P&R has proven not to work they even struggle in the richer code.

If we had a second tier full of full time city clubs then i'd say go for it. but just to bring in jeopardy for the sake of it. So a few small town clubs can earn a few quid getting tonked 60 nil does nothing for the sport.

Grooming clubs like Toulouse for a SL spot is the best way to go and strengthen our current clubs instead of getting involved into a raceto the bottom.

[Buderus]

No. How many more FT teams did licensing produce? How many more FT teams do we have now? Absolutely zero point in teams outside of a licensed SL being FT

I understand your point of view however I don't think this issue is unsolvable. If the RFL promoted and financially backed the championship I see no reason why it can't be successful. I disagree with the zero point comment as the super league licenses are only 3 years and if run correctly there will be opportunity for championship teams. I also beive the longer the championship goes the more it builds to the the point it is a competition that supports itself financially similar to the QLD Cup in Australia

[Mattrhino]

The problem I have with promotion and relegation is the potential for damage it can cause. If Huddersfield or Leeds get relegated (albeit unlikely) the damage that could cause to the competition would be devastating. I also believe that it's hard for some clubs to put long term plans in place to improve themselves. They instead get stuck in a year to year relegation battle doing just enough to survive. A comparison is my club Newcastke in the NRL who are doing a complete rebuild to make themselves a better club but bringing through the young players. They can do this because they have time something which licensing would give super league clubs

And people want one up one down. Imagine the RFL saying 5-6 years ago our plan going forward is letting go of Bradford and Leeds so that we can let boom or bust Leigh into SL in thier place or part time Fev or Batley. Its crazy

[Buderus]

I preferred licensing! I can understand people thought that the road to getting a license was convoluted and that the governing body just made up which clubs got points for what at license renewal time. If it were brought back I would like to see more transparency in that area. Without out that Super League does seem a closed shop which it should never be.

This would be the key! If the RFL are honest and transparent it will go along way to making licensing a success

[Mattrhino]

I understand your point of view however I don't think this issue is unsolvable. If the RFL promoted and financially backed the championship I see no reason why it can't be successful. I disagree with the zero point comment as the super league licenses are only 3 years and if run correctly there will be opportunity for championship teams. I also beive the longer the championship goes the more it builds to the the point it is a competition that supports itself financially similar to the QLD Cup in Australia

Like it used to be with well attended GF's now the championsip has turned into a joke with shields, middle 8's

[EastLondonMike]

I was always a fan of licensing, in principle. But felt that only a handful of clubs were ever going to achieve that desired 'A' status.

 

The RFL needed to be a lot more strict with certain clubs and their failure to improve and meet the desired requirements. We'd probably have an 8 team Superleague in 2016 if they had of been more strict, and some clubs probably wouldn't even exist now.

How about an 8 team SL of clubs that met the criteria to a decent level (A and B status), or as many that meet those requirements. Promotion would only occur when a championship team reach a minimum of a B status (the status and progress of clubs could be monitored annually and scores handed out at the end of each season), thus expanding SL, with potential promotion possible at the end of any season and not just at the end of a three year period. Relegation would only occur after a three year license period ends, and if a club drops to a C status.


if we ever got to a place where we had 14 teams of a minimum B status we'd be in a good place.

[Hvy wg]

What's wrong with the simple and straight forward system of promotion and relegation??

Because the Championship teams that would go up would be worse than the Bottom SL team that would go into the Championship. 

 

[bamfordsbeans]

The biggest question is how can we increase the present number of 6 "true "Super League teams?

The traditional "big four" over the last few seasons and Hull and Catalans certainly qualify but for the rest the jury is still out.Whatever form of licensing,P and R etc cannot disguise this fact.

[RidingPie]

This would be the key! If the RFL are honest and transparent it will go along way to making licensing a success

 

Lets be honest it was obvious Crusaders were being forced in for expansion reasons. Had they been a standout club, with junior development, a great stadium, secure funding etc, it wouldn't have been an issue, and frankly they probably wouldn't have gone bust, but instead the process felt fudged.

[Oxford]

Lets be honest it was obvious Crusaders were being forced in for expansion reasons. Had they been a standout club, with junior development, a great stadium, secure funding etc, it wouldn't have been an issue, and frankly they probably wouldn't have gone bust, but instead the process felt fudged.

The trouble with assessing this kind of thing is that for a Crusaders you have a Widnes and you have to ask did licensing work but other variables made it look shakey or was the system itself at fault from the outset. I know those who wanted P - R would argue against licensing but that can't really be a criteria for did it work or not.

[RidingPie]

The trouble with assessing this kind of thing is that for a Crusaders you have a Widnes and you have to ask did licensing work but other variables made it look shakey or was the system itself at fault from the outset. I know those who wanted P - R would argue against licensing but that can't really be a criteria for did it work or not.

 

Indeed, but at the same time there was a feeling the playing field wasn't level and that had, say Widnes (I can't remember who were the next team after Cru in that round) been marginally better in every way Cru would still have won. It was the lack of transparency I feel that was the problem, not the system.

[JM2010]

This is why I think a conference type system might work. If a team applies for a franchise and fulfil the criteria they could be accepted without replacing anyone as they could just increase the size of the conferences or add new conferences. This would allow the RFL to judge them on the criteria and not against any other clubs. It would also give the Championship clubs a boost as it wouldn't be a closed shop, if they are ready they can join.

For this to work the amount of teams would have to correspond to the amount of money available and the criteria needs to be well thought out