Tommy Holland

[Johndeere]

Can't see why Hemingway wouldn't be an option if and only if he's prepared to sit many games out as a back up but I'm sorry without injury I can't see him getting a start 

As for playing him at hooker unless Leaky is injured not a chance,on their days Dom and Leaky have to be amongst the best 7 and 9 in this league

If he comes he's going to have to wait I would say for game time 

[Bill H]

22 hours ago, distantdog said:

Yes. It was his suggested move for Flanagan to drop the goal in the semi at Fev, as they would be expecting Black or Moore to take it. I remember the interview well.

Thank you DD.  That does ring a bell.

[doggystyle]

Has Hemingway not been brought in as back up.  I agree Leak would be hard to shift at 9, proving how he plays even better given 80 minutes. Patch and Dom are the halves and 13 at times appears to be a free for all. Manu, Farrell, Brown, Chandler in no particular order. Could Dave Scott be shoved forward with the arrival of JC. He is Super Scot(t) after all ?

[phildog]

Well PM, I'm not our scouting system am I? Let's have another look at the situation: someone said that John Kear said that TH was a clever footballer, so why didn't he pick him regularly then, and let him go? Why, when he played against us, did Cain often rip us open, especially on 2 consecutive appearances at The Mount with 'Haven, yet not kick on here? Different style of play perhaps under Kear, hardly full of flair were we? Not decrying, just saying. There will be as many as me with 50 years+ of following Batley's fortunes who would probably say that in their time Batley has rarely been blessed with a lively pair of halves: Briggs and Pickerill, Halloran and Moore, spring to mind recently, but in the past we've generally had one or the other such as a Tomlinson, a Black, a Geldard, two separate Wilsons, a Gorman, an Oldroyd......half back has regularly been a bind for us. Yes, we all have questions and no, we don't all have the answers, or any answers for that matter. Thing is though, as with Cain Southernwood, we get nailed by the opposition stand off, so there must be some somewhere if others have them. We might all be wrong, TH might come in with a fresh attitude and be a success, who knows. But then, a year or two down the line we'll run into the same problem, so why not grab a youngster from somewhere and bring him on, current semi-pro or amateur? We'll be looking again anyway as Brambani won't rule for ever, so let's have a back-up plan. Oops, that's opened a NEW can of wriggly things.......................

[bulldogs17]

53 minutes ago, phildog said:

Well PM, I'm not our scouting system am I? Let's have another look at the situation: someone said that John Kear said that TH was a clever footballer, so why didn't he pick him regularly then, and let him go? Why, when he played against us, did Cain often rip us open, especially on 2 consecutive appearances at The Mount with 'Haven, yet not kick on here? Different style of play perhaps under Kear, hardly full of flair were we? Not decrying, just saying. There will be as many as me with 50 years+ of following Batley's fortunes who would probably say that in their time Batley has rarely been blessed with a lively pair of halves: Briggs and Pickerill, Halloran and Moore, spring to mind recently, but in the past we've generally had one or the other such as a Tomlinson, a Black, a Geldard, two separate Wilsons, a Gorman, an Oldroyd......half back has regularly been a bind for us. Yes, we all have questions and no, we don't all have the answers, or any answers for that matter. Thing is though, as with Cain Southernwood, we get nailed by the opposition stand off, so there must be some somewhere if others have them. We might all be wrong, TH might come in with a fresh attitude and be a success, who knows. But then, a year or two down the line we'll run into the same problem, so why not grab a youngster from somewhere and bring him on, current semi-pro or amateur? We'll be looking again anyway as Brambani won't rule for ever, so let's have a back-up plan. Oops, that's opened a NEW can of wriggly things.......................

But it's not just one style of play or one coach that didn't rate Cain. JK dropped him playing forwards rugby while Diskin played a more expansive style and still he wasn't deemed good enough. 

I don't think we've ever seen anything in a dogs shirt to suggest him at 6 was the answer. When we rested Dom and Patch at the end of last year it said a lot that Diskin still didn't pick him. 

Ive learnt to judge players by what they do in a dogs shirt rather than before or after so Hemingway will be given that same opportunity in 2018.

[DOGFATHER]

45 minutes ago, phildog said:

Well PM, I'm not our scouting system am I? Let's have another look at the situation: someone said that John Kear said that TH was a clever footballer, so why didn't he pick him regularly then, and let him go? Why, when he played against us, did Cain often rip us open, especially on 2 consecutive appearances at The Mount with 'Haven, yet not kick on here? Different style of play perhaps under Kear, hardly full of flair were we? Not decrying, just saying. There will be as many as me with 50 years+ of following Batley's fortunes who would probably say that in their time Batley has rarely been blessed with a lively pair of halves: Briggs and Pickerill, Halloran and Moore, spring to mind recently, but in the past we've generally had one or the other such as a Tomlinson, a Black, a Geldard, two separate Wilsons, a Gorman, an Oldroyd......half back has regularly been a bind for us. Yes, we all have questions and no, we don't all have the answers, or any answers for that matter. Thing is though, as with Cain Southernwood, we get nailed by the opposition stand off, so there must be some somewhere if others have them. We might all be wrong, TH might come in with a fresh attitude and be a success, who knows. But then, a year or two down the line we'll run into the same problem, so why not grab a youngster from somewhere and bring him on, current semi-pro or amateur? We'll be looking again anyway as Brambani won't rule for ever, so let's have a back-up plan. Oops, that's opened a NEW can of wriggly things.......................

Southernwood was playing alongside Sammutt when Whitehaven "ripped us apart". The ideal foil for a halfback with Cain's traits. Liam Finn is a good example of this too, he looks excellent at Wakefield, because they have pace throughout there back line and Jacob Miller as his HB partner. 

Hemingway would not be my first choice as a starting halfback either, but he is no worse than Southernwood, so we are no weaker.

A decent starting halfback is likely to cost us £30k+ and we have a very established halfback pairing already. Therefore, whoever we get will have to be prepared to sit on the sidelines, hopefully for the majority of the season until one of the starting HB's is injured. I think it was one of Diskin's bigget mistakes splitting them up early in the season. I think Kear realised that too, at the end of last season. It is a gamble to split them up, as whoever comes in might not make as good a HB pairing than the one we have. Also, can we really afford to pay £30k+ for a guy who may not figure most weeks? 

I hear what you are saying, about plucking one from the amateur game, but PM is spot on, when he asks you "From where?"

The amateur game is in pretty bad state, with lots of teams going to the wall and player numbers dropping almost by the week.

Players who show anything like potential, are snapped up for big money by SL for there academies and in a full-time environment. Then, in turn the better end of them are DR'd out, to the likes of us and other Championship teams.

So where do you propose we find one?

Even the top sides in this country are struggling to find a great HB. Over the last few years, Leeds (Sutcliffe), Warrington (Ratchford), St Helens (Lomax) and WIgan (Tomkins) have all tried to find the next great halfback and not managed it, even with there vast resources and relatively huge amounts of money. Some very good players there, but none of them have really made it as a halfback.

[Bulldog Days]

2 hours ago, phildog said:

Well PM, I'm not our scouting system am I? Let's have another look at the situation: someone said that John Kear said that TH was a clever footballer, so why didn't he pick him regularly then, and let him go? Why, when he played against us, did Cain often rip us open, especially on 2 consecutive appearances at The Mount with 'Haven, yet not kick on here? Different style of play perhaps under Kear, hardly full of flair were we? Not decrying, just saying. There will be as many as me with 50 years+ of following Batley's fortunes who would probably say that in their time Batley has rarely been blessed with a lively pair of halves: Briggs and Pickerill, Halloran and Moore, spring to mind recently, but in the past we've generally had one or the other such as a Tomlinson, a Black, a Geldard, two separate Wilsons, a Gorman, an Oldroyd......half back has regularly been a bind for us. Yes, we all have questions and no, we don't all have the answers, or any answers for that matter. Thing is though, as with Cain Southernwood, we get nailed by the opposition stand off, so there must be some somewhere if others have them. We might all be wrong, TH might come in with a fresh attitude and be a success, who knows. But then, a year or two down the line we'll run into the same problem, so why not grab a youngster from somewhere and bring him on, current semi-pro or amateur? We'll be looking again anyway as Brambani won't rule for ever, so let's have a back-up plan. Oops, that's opened a NEW can of wriggly things.......................

Absolutely spot on regarding scouting  the amateur game, and building contacts with SL Academies / reserve squads to pick out some gems who will make it with some coaching input. I look at the Warrington team this past season, which has in their ranks the King brothers from Huddersfield. Neither of them featured (or very rarely featured) in the first team this season, but were first team regulars the previous season. Toby King is a very good center with good SL experience, and at 22 has many years ahead in the game. Surely a loan deal would not be too difficult?

Considering the limited resources we have at the Club, it would make sense to invest in this area with a full time scout to scour the amateur game and build contacts with SL Clubs and academies. This would surely prevent the type of loose relationship we had with Cas Tigers that is loaded one way ( accepting the that there is a formal structure around such relationships.) Like any other walk of business, it is the personal relationships that achieve the best deals.

[Piggy's mate]

Sorry lads my attention span is just not long enough to read any of the above 

[Tony F]

2 hours ago, DOGFATHER said:

Southernwood was playing alongside Sammutt when Whitehaven "ripped us apart". The ideal foil for a halfback with Cain's traits. Liam Finn is a good example of this too, he looks excellent at Wakefield, because they have pace throughout there back line and Jacob Miller as his HB partner. 

Hemingway would not be my first choice as a starting halfback either, but he is no worse than Southernwood, so we are no weaker.

A decent starting halfback is likely to cost us £30k+ and we have a very established halfback pairing already. Therefore, whoever we get will have to be prepared to sit on the sidelines, hopefully for the majority of the season until one of the starting HB's is injured. I think it was one of Diskin's bigget mistakes splitting them up early in the season. I think Kear realised that too, at the end of last season. It is a gamble to split them up, as whoever comes in might not make as good a HB pairing than the one we have. Also, can we really afford to pay £30k+ for a guy who may not figure most weeks? 

I hear what you are saying, about plucking one from the amateur game, but PM is spot on, when he asks you "From where?"

The amateur game is in pretty bad state, with lots of teams going to the wall and player numbers dropping almost by the week.

Players who show anything like potential, are snapped up for big money by SL for there academies and in a full-time environment. Then, in turn the better end of them are DR'd out, to the likes of us and other Championship teams.

So where do you propose we find one?

Even the top sides in this country are struggling to find a great HB. Over the last few years, Leeds (Sutcliffe), Warrington (Ratchford), St Helens (Lomax) and WIgan (Tomkins) have all tried to find the next great halfback and not managed it, even with there vast resources and relatively huge amounts of money. Some very good players there, but none of them have really made it as a halfback.

Sammut has never played for Whitehaven. I'm not sure about Phildog's earlier post, either. I can't recall Cain Southernwood having ever "ripped us apart". I don't think he has the capacity to break a tackle, if I'm honest. 

[DOGFATHER]

22 minutes ago, Tony F said:

Sammut has never played for Whitehaven. I'm not sure about Phildog's earlier post, either. I can't recall Cain Southernwood having ever "ripped us apart". I don't think he has the capacity to break a tackle, if I'm honest. 

Sorry my mind playing tricks on me in my old age. Sammut was Workington, I seem to think he had played with a good halfback though, was Rooney his halfback partner at Whitehaven? 

[silverback]

17 minutes ago, Tony F said:

Sammut has never played for Whitehaven. I'm not sure about Phildog's earlier post, either. I can't recall Cain Southernwood having ever "ripped us apart". I don't think he has the capacity to break a tackle, if I'm honest. 

now yer in trouble when bully arrives...but yer right.

[ernieone]

Perhaps this topic should be finished and hopefully a new one started looking forward to the new season.  Hopefully there will be some thing to look forward to 

[Blind side johnny]

3 hours ago, Piggy's mate said:

Sorry lads my attention span is just not long enough to read any of the above 

Ooooh sparkly things!!

[Piggy's mate]

Well I thought whilst I sat here in the root cellar waiting for either the end of days or to be wisked off to Oz I thought I'd get stuck into the Bulldogs forum version  of War & Peace! Some good points made but I still don't see where and how we get either someone good enough but willing to sit on the bench or to usurp Walker at 6? We have cover at loose forward not at 6. 

[Bulldog Days]

I'll throw this into the mix. Could anyone see Farrell as a potential 6?

[fredm]

Isn't Walker's best position at 13?  If it is then we need a 6.  As stated by others preferably someone with pace over 10 - 15 yards who can make that break.

[Piggy's mate]

8 hours ago, fredm said:

Isn't Walker's best position at 13?  If it is then we need a 6.  As stated by others preferably someone with pace over 10 - 15 yards who can make that break.

This is the question FM. His best position might be 13 but we can't find a better 6!

[Blind side johnny]

Thought you were signing a local lad for 6. (Not TH)

[Bill H]

Have you been pestering Paul Harrison again BSJ?

[Dogstew]

If it’s all a done deal, why no announcement?

Jowsbry wind-up merchants posted this weeks ago about Hemingway. 

Good signings so far - Tom Hemingway would not add to that picture.

[Blind side johnny]

On 16/10/2017 at 10:04 PM, Dogstew said:

If it’s all a done deal, why no announcement?

Jowsbry wind-up merchants posted this weeks ago about Hemingway. 

Good signings so far - Tom Hemingway would not add to that picture.

Wind-up merchants? Really?

Don't buy any lottery tickets this week.

[graham fisher]

On 16/10/2017 at 10:04 PM, Dogstew said:

If it’s all a done deal, why no announcement?

Jowsbry wind-up merchants posted this weeks ago about Hemingway. 

Good signings so far - Tom Hemingway would not add to that picture.

Wind up merchant,but i was right. Got another one but I'll let your club announce this one?

[ernieone]

No signings yet Graham  but a couple of signings in the near future depending on which way the wind blows (hopefully)   

[9' oller]

Would this player be a number 6 with a lovely show and go.

Cryptic Ernie. Does the wind mean a gust along the m62. No flatcaps required

[grumpyoldram]

7 hours ago, 9' oller said:

Would this player be a number 6 with a lovely show and go.

Cryptic Ernie. Does the wind mean a gust along the m62. No flatcaps required

Nah - mate of a mate at the Fox told him Danny Brough had left the giants for  .... surely not.