Jump to content
Total Rugby League Fans Forum

Recommended Posts

It seems traces of the nerve agent have been found in the restaurant where the Russians ate. 

I found it rather weird to watch the army taking away covered ambulances and police cars. (And how does anyone do anything useful in a hazmat suit for heaven's sake?!)

It's all both bizarre and sinister at the same time.

However, I do find it ludicrous that certain MPs are apparently putting pressure on Theresa May to publicly blame Putin and his cronies before the police investigation has even ended.  Unless that's fake news via Sky and the BBC.  Either way people need to get a grip.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 


With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/7/2018 at 9:02 PM, Bob8 said:

There is a tendency to see Russia as the baddie.  I do not agree with that.  But Russia is next to a huge power block that are reasonably unified and unfriendly.  If we were in such a position, we would try to sow discord, so I find it reasonable to assume that they would too.

Bit of a difference between sowing discord and indiscriminately using banned chemical weapons in a foreign country in a way which affects hundreds of civilians with no connection to Russia. Whether or not is was officially sanctioned is unclear, and I suppose there is the possibility of a false flag operation, but this goes way beyond funding opposition groups, corrupting politicians & officials, attacking IT infrastructure, testing defences by incursions into airspace/patrolled waters and/or fake news & dodgy dealings on social media.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/11/2018 at 8:13 PM, Saintslass said:

I do like this (from the Sunday Times, I believe):

DX_v0uVW0AAit7t.jpg:large

They said today on the news that theTories have received over 800,000 pounds in donations from Russians living in the UK since May became PM and some are friends of Putin. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, The Future is League said:

They said today on the news that theTories have received over 800,000 pounds in donations from Russians living in the UK since May became PM and some are friends of Putin. 

I think there has to be a difference between 'russians' and putins government/friends/dodgy people.  There will be plenty of russians domiciled in the UK with no links to Putin who can donate to whomever they want.  

  • Like 5

With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
6 minutes ago, Bedford Roughyed said:

I think there has to be a difference between 'russians' and putins government/friends/dodgy people.  There will be plenty of russians domiciled in the UK with no links to Putin who can donate to whomever they want.  

Quite. People who looted the country’s silverware following the breakup of the USSR and fled to the U.K. and Europe with their Ill-gotten gains once the party was over.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, JonM said:

Bit of a difference between sowing discord and indiscriminately using banned chemical weapons in a foreign country in a way which affects hundreds of civilians with no connection to Russia. Whether or not is was officially sanctioned is unclear, and I suppose there is the possibility of a false flag operation, but this goes way beyond funding opposition groups, corrupting politicians & officials, attacking IT infrastructure, testing defences by incursions into airspace/patrolled waters and/or fake news & dodgy dealings on social media.

It was more a counter-argument to the assertion that Russia was not meddling.  It was to say that I would expect it to meddle, the rights and wrongs of that action are another matter.


"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, walter sobchak said:

Quite. People who looted the country’s silverware following the breakup of the USSR and fled to the U.K. and Europe with their Ill-gotten gains once the party was over.

As opposed to the people who looted the country following the breakup of the USSR and stayed there to run the place?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
2 minutes ago, JonM said:

As opposed to the people who looted the country following the breakup of the USSR and stayed there to run the place?

No doubt there are corrupt people in the Russian government since the breakup of the Soviet Union just like corrupt politicians in the US, UK, Italy, France and China etc but compare and contrast the Russia under Yeltsin and the Russia under putin/medvedev.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, walter sobchak said:

No doubt there are corrupt people in the Russian government since the breakup of the Soviet Union just like corrupt politicians in the US, UK, Italy, France and China etc but compare and contrast the Russia under Yeltsin and the Russia under putin/medvedev.

Its hard to compare when journalists and opposing political party leaders have a habit of dying in unfortunate circumstances. 

  • Like 2

With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, The Future is League said:

They said today on the news that theTories have received over 800,000 pounds in donations from Russians living in the UK since May became PM and some are friends of Putin. 

All perfectly legal although I'd rather they hadn't given what has just happened.  It's not a good look.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, walter sobchak said:

No doubt there are corrupt people in the Russian government since the breakup of the Soviet Union just like corrupt politicians in the US, UK, Italy, France and China etc but compare and contrast the Russia under Yeltsin and the Russia under putin/medvedev.

I don't recall chemical weapons being used against civilians in the UK under Yeltsin. Or under Stalin, Andropov or Chernenko come to that. Putin is on a par with Kim Jong Il & family, AFAICT. .

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, JonM said:

I don't recall chemical weapons being used against civilians in the UK under Yeltsin. Or under Stalin, Andropov or Chernenko come to that. Putin is on a par with Kim Jong Il & family, AFAICT. .

I question the comparison with Stalin. 


"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Questions asked in parliament about the broadcast license of the Kremlin-funded TV station Russia Today.

Walter may need to start a petition to save it a.s.a.p. or he'll have nothing to watch.

  • Like 1

Millions long for immortality who don't know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon. (Susan Ertz)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Futtocks said:

Questions asked in parliament about the broadcast license of the Kremlin-funded TV station Russia Today.

Walter may need to start a petition to save it a.s.a.p. or he'll have nothing to watch.

WS will be fine; he watches the Russian version from his St Petersburg flat anyway... ?

  • Like 1
  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On the one hand, from a purely objective point of view I can see why Russia would act in this way.

1) they don't half seem to hold a grudge.

2) internationally they are at odds with the west still and are keen to stir the pot in these areas.

3) Putin has an election coming up and everyone hates russia fits his narrative.

 

HOWEVER

This was effectively a terrorist attack on British sovereign territory by a foreign state. If this could be escalated to nato level it should. Frankly Putin needs taking down a peg or two having been able to do what he wants in Syria, Georgia and lets not forget Ukraine. Russian jets and navy vessels are repeatedly having to be escorted out of Nato waters and the Baltics have repeatedly been threatened. Plus the alleged interferences in elections. To me if they want to play that game then fine but we should with our allies fight fire with our own equivalent fire - though of course not by exposing 500 civilians to a nerve agent in a restaurant.

Should we call Putins bluff in Ukraine for example and support the Ukrainian govt militarily and remove the "rebels" Russia has "nothing to do with"? 

Personally, I think that the time for pussyfooting around Putin needs to end sooner rather than later, does anyone think his "re-election" this month will make a difference?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Unless the US / NATO backs us up we are pretty much powerless.

I see the press are suggesting we pull out of the World Cup. While this would save us from 3 weeks of the usual torment and embarrassment, would Russia really care? No-one will back us up on even this.

Do we not also get a lot of our energy supply from Russia?


"I am the avenging angel; I come with wings unfurled, I come with claws extended from halfway round the world. I am the God Almighty, I am the howling wind. I care not for your family; I care not for your kin. I come in search of terror, though terror is my own; I come in search of vengeance for crimes and crimes unknown. I care not for your children, I care not for your wives, I care not for your country, I care not for your lives." - (c) Jim Boyes - "The Avenging Angel"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, tim2 said:

Unless the US / NATO backs us up we are pretty much powerless.

I see the press are suggesting we pull out of the World Cup. While this would save us from 3 weeks of the usual torment and embarrassment, would Russia really care? No-one will back us up on even this.

Do we not also get a lot of our energy supply from Russia?

I doubt economically we could afford to risk even threatening to pull out of the World Cup, let alone go through and do it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

On the one hand, from a purely objective point of view I can see why Russia would act in this way.

1) they don't half seem to hold a grudge.

2) internationally they are at odds with the west still and are keen to stir the pot in these areas.

3) Putin has an election coming up and everyone hates russia fits his narrative.

 

HOWEVER

This was effectively a terrorist attack on British sovereign territory by a foreign state. If this could be escalated to nato level it should. Frankly Putin needs taking down a peg or two having been able to do what he wants in Syria, Georgia and lets not forget Ukraine. Russian jets and navy vessels are repeatedly having to be escorted out of Nato waters and the Baltics have repeatedly been threatened. Plus the alleged interferences in elections. To me if they want to play that game then fine but we should with our allies fight fire with our own equivalent fire - though of course not by exposing 500 civilians to a nerve agent in a restaurant.

Should we call Putins bluff in Ukraine for example and support the Ukrainian govt militarily and remove the "rebels" Russia has "nothing to do with"? 

Personally, I think that the time for pussyfooting around Putin needs to end sooner rather than later, does anyone think his "re-election" this month will make a difference?

I watched Death of Stalin.

It was amusing but not really based on real life to any great extent.  To us, used to such things, it is unimportant.  To those used to Russia, it would be the UK state insulting Russia.  

Then you have pro-Western Russians, who to a Putin mindset must have swallowed Western propaganda.  Why would he not act the same?

This is not justification, but motive.


"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Robin Evans said:

Russia needn't even consider the UK.

You say that but clearly the UK bugs Putin or else why murder/attempt to murder former spies on our patch (has he done the same to those in the US?), wind us up by flying/sailing close to our waters, etc.  If he 'needn't even consider the UK' then he is curiously obsessed by us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A poll released today apparently has 52% of people supporting the idea of the UK teams boycotting the world cup.  (Perhaps this is a defensive move - better to look like we're making a statement than watch our teams get hammered!)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...