Boxing

[Gerrumonside ref]

Hard-hitting Bellew has a puncher’s chance in this one against a much better technical boxer in Usyk.

Unlike his recent fights against Haye, Bellew won’t have the advantage in speed or mobility against his opponent.  This will be all about setting up and landing his big power shots.

Be interesting to see whether Usyk chooses to respect Bellew’s power and aim to build up a lead on points rather than mix it, forcing the Liverpudlian into desperate measures that he might be able to exploit later in the fight.

 

Edited November 10, 2018 by Gerrumonside ref

[DavidM]

Usyk is exceptionally good 

[chuffer]

Bless bellew...he was doing so well early on but once the fight got to halfway you were waiting for the inevitable...caught with a big left, goodnight vienna

[Maximus Decimus]

36 minutes ago, chuffer said:

Bless bellew...he was doing so well early on but once the fight got to halfway you were waiting for the inevitable...caught with a big left, goodnight vienna

Yeh he was doing well but the tide was definitely turning. 

[Bedford Roughyed]

Bellew will be feeling that for a while.  

[GeordieSaint]

20 hours ago, DavidM said:

Usyk is exceptionally good 

He has sounded out Joshua... realistic? 

[Gerrumonside ref]

19 minutes ago, GeordieSaint said:

He has sounded out Joshua... realistic? 

I doubt Joshua would make a voluntary defence against him at this stage.

More likely that Usyk first fights at least one or maybe two common opponents who are top ten ranked like maybe Parker, Povetkin or Whyte.

If Usyk gets through that then maybe.

[Bob8]

1 hour ago, GeordieSaint said:

He has sounded out Joshua... realistic? 

Possible he might get to fight against him.  Whether he would win would be a very different matter.

[DavidM]

Entertaining fight . Bellew started strongly but I always felt Usyk was just warming to his task and controlled . Then from round four he started to go through the gears. Really has zero weaknesses and it was just a matter of time . He’s a superstar . Big Josh is something very different , massive natural size advantage and power . He’d be a technical problem for many heavyweights who are quite slovenly but to me Josh would be to much to bite off . I think he’s eyeing closely what Haye did , so it’ll be good to add him to the mix . There’s nothing for him at cruiser

Edited November 11, 2018 by DavidM

[Maximus Decimus]

51 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Entertaining fight . Bellew started strongly but I always felt Usyk was just warming to his task and controlled . Then from round four he started to go through the gears. Really has zero weaknesses and it was just a matter of time . He’s a superstar . Big Josh is something very different , massive natural size advantage and power . He’d be a technical problem for many heavyweights who are quite slovenly but to me Josh would be to much to bite off . I think he’s eyeing closely what Haye did , so it’ll be good to add him to the mix . There’s nothing for him at cruiser

His coming up to heavyweight adds a totally different dimension to the whole Joshua/Wilder/Fury thing. 

Wilder has the raw power, Fury has the awkwardness and Joshua has the more rounded mix of power and skills. Usyk brings a completely different level of boxing ability.

His problem might be whether his power translates to heavyweight. If it doesn't then he could have problems against a Joshua or Wilder who he could be outboxing for long periods but then get hit with a few big shots and be finished. 

Bellew managed to catch him a few times but he didn't budge. It might be different against the top heavyweights. 

[DavidM]

5 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

His coming up to heavyweight adds a totally different dimension to the whole Joshua/Wilder/Fury thing. 

Wilder has the raw power, Fury has the awkwardness and Joshua has the more rounded mix of power and skills. Usyk brings a completely different level of boxing ability.

His problem might be whether his power translates to heavyweight. If it doesn't then he could have problems against a Joshua or Wilder who he could be outboxing for long periods but then get hit with a few big shots and be finished. 

Bellew managed to catch him a few times but he didn't budge. It might be different against the top heavyweights. 

Yep . Very interesting . The sheer size of guys now is something to get to grips with but he is supremely talented . We’ll see how far it takes him . You’d expect him to be about 15’5 maybe . He’ll have the speed , agility and skills . Whether he has the chin or power is the key . All that boxing can be wiped out quick as you say

[Futtocks]

Evander Holyfield proved that, with solid technique and a focussed mind, a cruiserweight can do the job one level up. From what little I've seen of Usyk, he's a more skilful fighter than Holyfield in attack. All that needs proving is his chin.

[DavidM]

35 minutes ago, Futtocks said:

Evander Holyfield proved that, with solid technique and a focussed mind, a cruiserweight can do the job one level up. From what little I've seen of Usyk, he's a more skilful fighter than Holyfield in attack. All that needs proving is his chin.

He always reminds me of that guy in Predator - “ he ain’t afraid of no man “ . Probably the most mentally strong fighter I’ve ever seen . Riddick Bowe in his absolute pomp , Lennox , and the man the bully Tyson couldn’t bully . And that’s after he cleaned up at cruiser . If you look at everything in the round you could rank him higher than Tyson . Incredible , total granite . That’s some bar for Usyk but it shows him the blueprint 

[DavidM]

Usyk is the undisputed champ ... but . I watched the WBSS cruiserweights on YouTube and lo and behold one QF was for the WBC ‘ diamond belt ‘ , and one was for the WBO ‘ interim belt ‘ . Boxing really is killing itself with the ridiculous belt situation . The WBA can have about four champs in one weight 

Edited November 11, 2018 by DavidM

[Maximus Decimus]

20 hours ago, DavidM said:

Usyk is the undisputed champ ... but . I watched the WBSS cruiserweights on YouTube and lo and behold one QF was for the WBC ‘ diamond belt ‘ , and one was for the WBO ‘ interim belt ‘ . Boxing really is killing itself with the ridiculous belt situation . The WBA can have about four champs in one weight 

He does hold all 4 genuine titles but I know what you mean. Maybe it's just me but the whole silver belt and interim belt seems a rather recent development?

[Maximus Decimus]

On 11/11/2018 at 1:25 PM, Futtocks said:

Evander Holyfield proved that, with solid technique and a focussed mind, a cruiserweight can do the job one level up. From what little I've seen of Usyk, he's a more skilful fighter than Holyfield in attack. All that needs proving is his chin.

Exactly, the chin is key. If it's good he could cause significant problems for Joshua. 

Funnily enough I'd be less concerned as a Wilder fan. Wilder's power is the kind that would knock anybody out. All he has to do is catch them within 12 rounds and he'll probably win. I watched his fight with Ortiz and was surprised just how poor he was, but it didn't matter because he caught him in the end and more than once. 

Wilder is greatly aided by the fact that few of his challengers in this era are huge punchers; getting outboxed isn't that big a problem. I think only Joshua is likely to beat him, because not only can he outbox him but he's heavy handed enough to be able to make it count.

[DavidM]

6 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

He does hold all 4 genuine titles but I know what you mean. Maybe it's just me but the whole silver belt and interim belt seems a rather recent development?

Ridiculous . All about taking in sanctioning fees but it devalues holding a belt . Everyone has to have a belt now or be in a fight for one . They need to get a grip but they won’t with the self interest involved . Emeritus , diamond , interim , regular , silver , European - Asian etc etc . Promoters talk about them getting boxers a ranking but becoming a mandatory challenger doesn’t always guarantee you anything . That’s another farce , rankings . Fres Oquendo hasn’t boxed for four years and was the WBA number one . I think the thing is just watch fights on their merit without all the adornments 

[Maximus Decimus]

50 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Ridiculous . All about taking in sanctioning fees but it devalues holding a belt . Everyone has to have a belt now or be in a fight for one . They need to get a grip but they won’t with the self interest involved . Emeritus , diamond , interim , regular , silver , European - Asian etc etc . Promoters talk about them getting boxers a ranking but becoming a mandatory challenger doesn’t always guarantee you anything . That’s another farce , rankings . Fres Oquendo hasn’t boxed for four years and was the WBA number one . I think the thing is just watch fights on their merit without all the adornments 

As I've stated before, boxing is crippled by the lack of a top down governing body but there's far too much self interest for this to be changed. It's a miracle boxing has survived and it has no doubt contributed to the rise of UFC.

Rankings are meaningless although I've heard similar dissatisfaction mentioned in UFC. The best way is to look at Ring magazine and Boxrec rankings but these aren't perfect.

[Maximus Decimus]

So it's the big one on Saturday and the hype machine is in full force. 

I'm gonna put it out there, Wilder's gonna knock him out and relatively early. Then they'll both get what they want, Wilder can claim to have a name on his resume and Fury can make out like it was because of his time out of the ring. 

I do have a shocking boxing betting record though! 

[Gerrumonside ref]

If Fury is to win then he’ll need to box a messy fight, tying up the bigger puncher and just outworking him, as he did Klitschko all those years ago, for a points victory.  It will be one for the boxing purists only.

For someone with limited boxing skills like Wilder, the key will be landing one of those right hand bombs on a fairly big target.

Personally, I don’t think Fury was far enough into his comeback to take on Wilder, but I guess the lure of winning a world title would be enough for any man.

I think Wilder wins this in the 6th with Fury actually up on the cards.  Should be an interesting fight.

 

Edited November 27, 2018 by Gerrumonside ref

[DavidM]

I’d love Tyson to win , and being Tyson you wouldn’t be overly shocked . He has the blueprint from the Vlad fight , moving , jabbing and really making it a pretty boring fight . But has he still got that ? The last warm up wasn’t encouraging - he got hit way to much . If that’s wilder ...

Wilder is hideously poor in his basic skills, but he just needs to land . Big difference . My heart says Tyson but my head says wilder and it may be very early 

[Maximus Decimus]

12 hours ago, DavidM said:

I’d love Tyson to win , and being Tyson you wouldn’t be overly shocked . He has the blueprint from the Vlad fight , moving , jabbing and really making it a pretty boring fight . But has he still got that ? The last warm up wasn’t encouraging - he got hit way to much . If that’s wilder ...

Wilder is hideously poor in his basic skills, but he just needs to land . Big difference . My heart says Tyson but my head says wilder and it may be very early 

I actually don't think Wilder is quite as poor as many people think. I've heard a fair bit from boxers who've sparred him like David Haye saying he's better than he looks. They've also spoke unanimously about his unreal power.

This will be key. Fury will get caught at some point and it'll be lights out when he does. The only issue is when for me, Wilder isn't going to tire so he'll be dangerous from round 1 to 12.

Only Joshua can best Wilder I reckon because he's big enough, can seriously bang and has enough boxing skill to get there before Wilder gets him. 

[Gerrumonside ref]

10 hours ago, Maximus Decimus said:

I actually don't think Wilder is quite as poor as many people think. I've heard a fair bit from boxers who've sparred him like David Haye saying he's better than he looks. They've also spoke unanimously about his unreal power.

This will be key. Fury will get caught at some point and it'll be lights out when he does. The only issue is when for me, Wilder isn't going to tire so he'll be dangerous from round 1 to 12.

Only Joshua can best Wilder I reckon because he's big enough, can seriously bang and has enough boxing skill to get there before Wilder gets him. 

Which Wilder fights are you thinking of in particular where he’s displayed good boxing skills?

I must admit that I’ve seen him box 4 or 5 times now on television and seen him struggle to control fights in all of them.

I respect David Haye, but sparring is a different animal to the fights themselves.

[DavidM]

I can’t think of any basic technique he has . It’s actually quite laughable at times watching him even in his stance throwing punches . He swings from the fences and In the Ortiz fight he got exposed . He’s very very wild ,  but up to press he hasn’t needed anything else . He’s reached this level on phenomenal power , not any kind of boxing . But it’s freakish power and it overcomes anything else . Or has ...

Edited November 28, 2018 by DavidM

[Gerrumonside ref]

I think reading Lennox Lewis today, he is calling the fight properly.

The longer it goes it will favour Fury, the shorter the fight then the more likely that the Brit has succumbed to Wilder’s much greater power.