Damien Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 27 minutes ago, southwalesrabbitoh said: I'm a Celt, my grandparents' surnames are/were Morgan and Williams. Anyway, a common word has to come from somewhere, Wales comes from a Germanic word for foreigner. You seem to have some sort of romantic notion of what a Celt is: A DNA study of Britons has shown that genetically there is not a unique Celtic group of people in the UK. According to the data, those of Celtic ancestry in Scotland and Cornwall are more similar to the English than they are to other Celtic groups. The study also describes distinct genetic differences across the UK, which reflect regional identities. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-31905764 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Make this stop FFS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southwalesrabbitoh Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 14 minutes ago, Damien said: You seem to have some sort of romantic notion of what a Celt is: A DNA study of Britons has shown that genetically there is not a unique Celtic group of people in the UK. According to the data, those of Celtic ancestry in Scotland and Cornwall are more similar to the English than they are to other Celtic groups. The study also describes distinct genetic differences across the UK, which reflect regional identities. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-31905764 That's contradictory, lol. It's saying we're the same then saying we're different, that's the most stereotypical BBC piece i've ever read. But as i've said before, the Celts are quite mixed, as Gareth Edwards' DNA said, his maternal side come from the Basque area and his paternal from Eastern Europe, northern Russia i think they said. Alun Wyn Jones is mainly Norman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southwalesrabbitoh Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 8 minutes ago, Scubby said: Make this stop FFS! Okay, but words are important, you cannot call the team the GB Lions or the British Lions and include Ireland, that must not happen again. I will be supporting the Aussies when they play the Lions, and i don't want to do that, obviously i support every team who play against England. And i must get off this phone for a while. Nos da/Good night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Just now, southwalesrabbitoh said: Okay, but words are important, you cannot call the team the GB Lions or the British Lions and include Ireland, that must not happen again. I will be supporting the Aussies when they play the Lions, and i don't want to do that, obviously i support every team who play against England. I meant the farcical GB tour not some petty forum squabble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davo5 Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 3 minutes ago, southwalesrabbitoh said: That's contradictory, lol. It's saying we're the same then saying we're different, that's the most stereotypical BBC piece i've ever read. But as i've said before, the Celts are quite mixed, as Gareth Edwards' DNA said, his maternal side come from the Basque area and his paternal from Eastern Europe, northern Russia i think they said. Alun Wyn Jones is mainly Norman. You do realise this is a Rugby League forum and not Ancestry.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris22 Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 It is sadly ironic that we scrapped the four nations at the precise moment that a "fourth nation" could provide a genuine challenge to the other three teams. If I recall correctly, the Great Britain revival concept was the brainchild of the now-departed Nigel Wood, and I suppose this has lumbered the likes of Rimmer with the problem. It may have worked if it was a 3 match series against Australia, but a thrown together at the last minute tour was destined to struggle. If anyone knew that this tour was planned, it would be embarrassing for the sport. But the reality is, many even within the sport didn't know the tour was planned. To be honest, it may be a bit embarrassing now, but some good may come of it, in that the Great Britain concept is left alone. I wasn't necessarily for scrapping GB, but once that decision was made, we needed to stick with it and go all-out for the England brand. Hopefully there is some kind of back-up plan to host some England internationals over here this year (at World Cup host venues), building to the test series next year and World Cup in 2021. Or, maybe that's wishful thinking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughyedspud Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 3 tests v Australia or NZ and then a couple or 3 tour games v Tonga,samoa,Fiji or PNG would have worked... Plain & simple.. OLDHAM RLFC the 8TH most successful team in british RL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man of Kent Posted February 11, 2019 Author Share Posted February 11, 2019 My bet is there will be some lame attempt at face-saving with a perhaps a couple or three Tests but not a full-blown tour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southwalesrabbitoh Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Ah, okay, Scubby. See. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17 stone giant Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 The moment that Australia said that they wanted to tour here in 2019, and said that they wouldn't play us if we toured the southern hemisphere in 2019, we should have backed down and taken them up on their offer, while at the same time putting pressure on them to accept a tour or visit from us down under in 2020. It would have made absolute sense to do that. There would have been a CHANCE that we could have won the Ashes at home in 2019, meaning that interest down under would have been far greater for a tour/another Ashes there in 2020. It would also have meant the Aussies not having to travel here in both 2020 and again for the 2021 World Cup. There would also be the marketing advantage of building upon the cricket ashes which is taking place later this year. That ends mid-September, so had we played a home Ashes series in November time, it would have only been a couple of months after the cricket, so the concept of England vs Australia for the Ashes would have been relatively fresh in the minds of the wider public. Get the matches on the BBC, maybe invite along some of England's cricketers to be interviewed pre-match and talk up what the Ashes rivalry means etc., and you'd have a nice extra bit of promotion. Instead of that, we're scratching around trying to cobble together some sort of GB tour when the biggest name in international RL (Australia) has already said it wants no part of it. Only rugby league and rugby league administrators could be so stupid. When I asked in a previous post whether it was too late to still have Australia here this year, I wasn't actually joking! I have never bought into this logic that we need them here in 2020 in order to 'build momentum' for the World Cup in 2021. That simply isn't how things work, in my experience and in my opinion. I follow numerous other sports and major sporting events, but I don't take an interest in them because of what happened the previous year - I become interested in them as they come along. I follow the rugby union six nations, British Lions tour, Autumn internationals and World Cup, but ask me about club rugby union or anything to do with rugby union in between times, and I'm not interested. I can barely remember what happened in last years six nations, yet it hasn't stopped me being interested again this year. Likewise, I would be interested in the RLWC in 2021, irrespective of who or where we had played in 2020. I've been watching RL world cups since 1995 - I put them in my diary and take interest in them when they come along. In terms of me watching the world cup in 2021, it makes not a bit of difference to me whether we play a home or away series in 2020. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughyedspud Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 No we shouldn't have backed down... The RFL & ARLC agreed in 2017 that GB would tour Australia in 2019,Australia would tour here in 2020 because the RFL wanted a home series before the 2021 RLWC and 2020 is also the 125th birthday of RL in the UK. *edit - England beating Australia in a series in 2020 would boost RLWC21 tickets sales no end.. And then last summer Peter beattie took over at the ARLC,tried to change all the plans everyone & RLIF had made,failed, and chucked all over Australia's toys out the pram...cancelled the GB tour saying it won't make money...which has no doubt scared off NZ sponsors now....& effectively banned NZ from playing England mid season... So no we shouldn't back down to bullies OLDHAM RLFC the 8TH most successful team in british RL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17 stone giant Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 10 minutes ago, roughyedspud said: No we shouldn't have backed down... The RFL & ARLC agreed in 2017 that GB would tour Australia in 2019,Australia would tour here in 2020 because the RFL wanted a home series before the 2021 RLWC and 2020 is also the 125th birthday of RL in the UK. *edit - England beating Australia in a series in 2020 would boost RLWC21 tickets sales no end.. And then last summer Peter beattie took over at the ARLC,tried to change all the plans everyone & RLIF had made,failed, and chucked all over Australia's toys out the pram...cancelled the GB tour saying it won't make money...which has no doubt scared off NZ sponsors now....& effectively banned NZ from playing England mid season... So no we shouldn't back down to bullies The fact is that those bullies were willing to come and tour here this year. Maybe those same bullies weren't keen on a GB tour this year because they thought it wouldn't be a financial success - given that the 2017 world cup in Australia didn't exactly seem to enthuse the home crowds - they didn't even manage to sell out the final! They maybe know their market better than the people do who proposed this resurrection of GB. Maybe the 2017 world cup caused the ARLC to have a rethink about what they had signed up to earlier that year - perhaps if matches against England in Melbourne and the final had sold out, they would have felt a GB tour would be a good idea and that crowds would be interested. I don't know exactly what caused them to change their minds, but clearly something did. While we're standing up to so called bullies, the likelihood is that the GB tour will either be cancelled, or will go ahead and not be anything special - because even if they do now manage to arrange something, time is running out for fans from the UK to be able save up or get organised to go. Plus we're not even going to be playing the team that most people associate with GB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughyedspud Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 What part of it was already agreed are you struggling with? OLDHAM RLFC the 8TH most successful team in british RL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattrhino Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 4 hours ago, 17 stone giant said: The fact is that those bullies were willing to come and tour here this year. Maybe those same bullies weren't keen on a GB tour this year because they thought it wouldn't be a financial success - given that the 2017 world cup in Australia didn't exactly seem to enthuse the home crowds - they didn't even manage to sell out the final! They maybe know their market better than the people do who proposed this resurrection of GB. Maybe the 2017 world cup caused the ARLC to have a rethink about what they had signed up to earlier that year - perhaps if matches against England in Melbourne and the final had sold out, they would have felt a GB tour would be a good idea and that crowds would be interested. I don't know exactly what caused them to change their minds, but clearly something did. While we're standing up to so called bullies, the likelihood is that the GB tour will either be cancelled, or will go ahead and not be anything special - because even if they do now manage to arrange something, time is running out for fans from the UK to be able save up or get organised to go. Plus we're not even going to be playing the team that most people associate with GB. I Agree and said similar earlier on in the thread, if you look at it without the emotion the best course of action would have been to accept the Aussies offer and have the ashes this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 3 hours ago, roughyedspud said: What part of it was already agreed are you struggling with? Sometimes in life you have to be pragmatic and compromise. Being stubborn has left us where we are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingerjon Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 3 hours ago, roughyedspud said: What part of it was already agreed are you struggling with? There'll be a signed contract, or at least MOU, then? Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeordieSaint Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 28 minutes ago, Dave T said: Sometimes in life you have to be pragmatic and compromise. Being stubborn has left us where we are now. I agree with that. But we have a World Cup here in 2021 to sell. England has to play at home in 2020 to market the World Cup. That’s why Australia coming here in 2020 can’t and shouldn’t have been moved IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 2 hours ago, GeordieSaint said: I agree with that. But we have a World Cup here in 2021 to sell. England has to play at home in 2020 to market the World Cup. That’s why Australia coming here in 2020 can’t and shouldn’t have been moved IMO. I think the need to have the Aussies here before World Cup year is a touch short sighted tbh. This is a big year for the World cup, having them here this year would have kept momentum going and in 2020 we could have maybe had Tonga and NZ here to show off some of the other nations. We may as well go back to the early 2000s where we host everything as the Aussies and Kiwis are incapable. We have talked ourselves into having to play the Aussies the year prior to the WC, but that didn't happen in 2012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 5 hours ago, roughyedspud said: What part of it was already agreed are you struggling with? Stuff gets agreed in international Rugby League all the time and I have seen more plans and cycles than I thought possible never come to fruition. When the major player simply isn't interested and wants no part of it then you have to be pragmatic and change the plans accordingly. It's folly to do otherwise and is very poor leadership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 36 minutes ago, Damien said: Stuff gets agreed in international Rugby League all the time and I have seen more plans and cycles than I thought possible never come to fruition. When the major player simply isn't interested and wants no part of it then you have to be pragmatic and change the plans accordingly. It's folly to do otherwise and is very poor leadership. Indeed, it is all just a bit dumb. It is ok putting your fingers in your ears and saying 'but we agreed' - well done, but we are not now playing the Aussies 'as we agreed' so it means nothing. Most people seem to understand this, apart from Spud. We have agreed all sorts that hasn't happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoneslessBishop Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 I find it hard to believe that NZRL, who have been desperate for home fixtures for years, can’t get any traction now to host some. Supposse the haven’t built the sponsor and supporter base. I can understand that with Oz and Tonga fixtures in place, NZ fans are more excited by that than the ephemeral GB, but surely one fixture is doable. That and games for GB v Tonga and in PNG wouldn’t be terrible. Maybe the problem is that there will be more focus on tonga GB after the england Tonga semi in 2017 than on a NZ GB game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yipyee Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 17 hours ago, southwalesrabbitoh said: Okay, but words are important, you cannot call the team the GB Lions or the British Lions and include Ireland, that must not happen again. I will be supporting the Aussies when they play the Lions, and i don't want to do that, obviously i support every team who play against England. And i must get off this phone for a while. Nos da/Good night. Why would you support every team that plays England?? That is stupid and people who do this clearly have some chip on their shoulder over something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southwalesrabbitoh Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 I'm stupid, yeah, everyone is at times. Why do i want England to lose in football? It's an unconscious thing, BUT i want England RU to win as i believe that that is good for RL outside England, and possibly in England too. Think it's largely to do with money, and lies/propoganda by the London media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damp squib Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 20 hours ago, yipyee said: Why would you support every team that plays England?? That is stupid and people who do this clearly have some chip on their shoulder over something Another way of looking at that is why support England against the other team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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