Lowdesert Posted October 6, 2018 Author Share Posted October 6, 2018 7 hours ago, Yorkshire Knight said: You don't need big names to compete in the Championship, just decent players so whether or not they've signed big players is irrelevant, the point is that they're made up of Aussies and Brits which is not entirely a negative but it would be good to see local development Some more interesting numbers in this. Fortunately, at least for now, they don’t have the issues we have working with RU. https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/oct/06/toronto-wolfpack-rugby-league-europe-cities-million-pound-game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Funkhouser Posted October 7, 2018 Share Posted October 7, 2018 12 hours ago, Lowdesert said: HKR academy was a shambles. They weren’t allocating sufficient funds into it or resources. Good young lads left and we’re leaving. It’s arguable that they have halved it. The idea being, seeing that a small percentage ever make it, group the best and pick from it, not just cost cutting. What is your point? The opportunity to amalgamate and have 1 academy was an easy option. It didn’t include Archbishop Sentamu for education but Bishop Burton college. Excellent facilities. Far better than both clubs had and a short drive down the by pass. Hull is not a hotbed of world RL. If it was, it is not anymore. The people who formed and supported the community leagues are not involved any more, the LA funded development officer isn’t there anymore, the RL DOs aren’t. The CC leagues participation aren’t what they were either. What we have is a few select Pro Club/College/School partnerships and Foundations trying to catch up the void of a good few years foot off the gas recruitment and funding cuts. Parkyesque style quote but not far from the truth, unfortunately. The TWP approach has been happening for a couple of years and the optimism in Canada seems to be 100%. Whether individuals in the UK are sceptical won’t mean a jot to them. More people regularly pay to watch RL in Hull than any other city in the Northern Hemisphere...if that is not a hotbed of the game of RL then there are none outside of Australasia. And as you intimate the participation numbers are falling off a cliff, the ridiculousness of halving academy opportunities for anyone who would like to play the game will bear it's own fruit. Your second sentence is the crux. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Picture Posted October 7, 2018 Share Posted October 7, 2018 On 10/5/2018 at 7:23 AM, Bob8 said: Scotchy and Big Picture have already explained to me that he would not be interested in such things as playing in a Scandinavian capital city. I stood corrected. I hope he has consulted them first? You mentioned Oslo, which although it's a capital city would be some way down the list of preferred markets. In a potential future RL equivalent of Super Rugby and Pro14 it might come into the frame for the second or third round of expansion. Oslo likely won't be any warmer than Toronto during the early months of the season and quite possibly colder, which is another point against it. On 10/5/2018 at 3:59 PM, Yosser said: In that interview he says he wants Toronto games accessible for people to watch in "Latin America, Africa and most importantly China." He is constantly pushing boundaries and seems determined to take the game out of it's box. Interesting times ahead. If Toronto could play opponents who were based in Latin cities that could have strong appeal in Latin America, as I suggested once before. Big Latino broadcasters might be interested in that scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Picture Posted October 7, 2018 Share Posted October 7, 2018 18 hours ago, TboneFromTO said: Of course there will be big changes. Every team makes big changes when they get promoted. Leeds hkr and Salford need to make big changes if they want to be competitive next season too! I'm still waiting for the "struggle" of competing, we beat half the super league teams in the qualifiers. There hasn't been any real competition for them yet, I mean this time last year lots of people were shouting "you won't have that record in the championship". But here we are sitting at 50 - 7 - 2 lifetime. At this rate I should put a 5er on Toronto to win the grand final next year! Based on results in the Qualifiers, the current roster is probably good enough for the Wolfpack to avoid relegation next year and reportedly they have a few signings in the works already. 17 hours ago, TboneFromTO said: I think you'll find with promotion Toronto will become a very attractive team for players. I don't think they will have any problems finding the replacements they'll need/want. My only fear is that what everyone on here says about Rowley turns out to be true, and we dont perform well. I like him but there's alot of hate for him! Being in SL could make the Wolfpack a very attractive option for Canadian RU players. A while back I read something about a Canadian RU player who's been playing in France but is out of contract, he might worth their while to contact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowdesert Posted October 7, 2018 Author Share Posted October 7, 2018 4 hours ago, Marty Funkhouser said: More people regularly pay to watch RL in Hull than any other city in the Northern Hemisphere...if that is not a hotbed of the game of RL then there are none outside of Australasia. And as you intimate the participation numbers are falling off a cliff, the ridiculousness of halving academy opportunities for anyone who would like to play the game will bear it's own fruit. Your second sentence is the crux. Ok, hot bed regarding attendances, fair enough. I wouldn’t go that far regarding recruitment. The academy hasn’t and doesn’t work like that. I’ll agree, the more you have the more choice maybe, but the percentages of kids coming through to pro status doesn’t hit the heights. Never has. Occasionally you get a group all good enough, but rarely. Usually 1 or 2 from a group of between 25-35 kids. So you can see, a lot of attrition and cost. The approach now is when kids (borderline potential) get cut, they are given programmes and are monitored back at the CC more. It seems TWP have cleverly tapped into the ‘rugby’ development programmes in their region. Wed do well to look at how that works. I tried several years and ran into a ream of opposition, underhand tactics and nasty, unsigned letters through the door. Argyles mentioning 100,000 kids. Big numbers virtually overnight, while we struggle by keeping our net strictly over ‘hot bed’ areas and schools. In the DM today, he mentions more headline recruitment in ‘Rugby’. I’m sure he’s not looking at it through rose tinted glasses, but he doesn’t differentiate with any bias. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxford Posted October 7, 2018 Share Posted October 7, 2018 When I compare this .. “There is a strategy but we have to execute it. We have to increase the eyes on the broadcast. We have achieved a lot, we’re on three channels in Canada, we’ve got 11 Sports which is ultimately a channel owned by ATAT in the United States, Setanta in Asia and Fox Sports in Australia. “We are broadcast into 115 million homes, I’m not saying they all watch us but that’s a great platform. Once you create that awareness people will start picking it up. We’ve got to get the platform correct, if you get that, the product will engage sports fans. We’ve got to grow the size of the pie." with everything else on offer I'm slightly persuaded in David Argyles direction rather than say Parky's which offers: doom, gloom and do nowt! 2 warning points Non-Political Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TboneFromTO Posted October 7, 2018 Share Posted October 7, 2018 7 hours ago, Big Picture said: Being in SL could make the Wolfpack a very attractive option for Canadian RU players. A while back I read something about a Canadian RU player who's been playing in France but is out of contract, he might worth their while to contact. Sounds great, I'm curious how CRU would react to that though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxford Posted October 7, 2018 Share Posted October 7, 2018 4 hours ago, TboneFromTO said: Sounds great, I'm curious how CRU would react to that though! Er .... the CRU, well whatever they do, as with all Kick and clap 2 warning points Non-Political Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 On 10/7/2018 at 6:59 AM, Big Picture said: You mentioned Oslo, which although it's a capital city would be some way down the list of preferred markets. In a potential future RL equivalent of Super Rugby and Pro14 it might come into the frame for the second or third round of expansion. Oh come on! You practically made me beg for you to give logical reasoning and that was not it. You were certainly not considering either Oslo or Copenhagen for any second or third round of expansion. "You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wakefield Ram Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 On 10/6/2018 at 6:43 AM, Whippet13 said: https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/oct/06/toronto-wolfpack-rugby-league-europe-cities-million-pound-game A little more information on Arglye's plans, the player development idea seems to be that there is already a "rugby" structure so they will use that to identify potential League players. I understand he has taken a share in Skolars so perhaps the plan is to place them there whilst they develop. I can see the offer of living in London and geting paid to play rugby for a couple of years with the prospect of a long term career appealing to young Canadian RU players. Growing a sport in a new country is massively challenging. Remember NFL Europe? Sport has cultural roots, transporting those to other countries rarely succeeds. Football is the exception, but beyond football, can anyone name a successful export it a sport to a new country? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 12 minutes ago, Wakefield Ram said: Growing a sport in a new country is massively challenging. Remember NFL Europe? Sport has cultural roots, transporting those to other countries rarely succeeds. Football is the exception, but beyond football, can anyone name a successful export it a sport to a new country? Yup I've got one...Rugby League in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17 stone giant Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 6 minutes ago, Wakefield Ram said: can anyone name a successful export it a sport to a new country? Snooker to China? You're right, though - it's very difficult to change habits and sports tend to find their natural level. That applies within a country, as well as from one country to another. When you think about it - for all the money that rugby union in England has - the biggest teams are still places like Leicester, Northampton, and Bath. Exeter Chiefs are top of the Premiership, for goodness sake! Good luck to them, mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17 stone giant Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Just now, Kayakman said: Yup I've got one...Rugby League in Canada. It might happen, but it's way too early to say that it has happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Just now, 17 stone giant said: It might happen, but it's way too early to say that it has happened. Over 9 200 at the game on Sunday say different. They were there...it happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17 stone giant Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Just now, Kayakman said: Over 9 200 at the game on Sunday say different. They we there...it happened. He's talking about a sport becoming firmly established in another country. That means numerous teams, leagues, and people playing the game in significant numbers. Canada might one day get there, but it's nowhere near that yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Just now, 17 stone giant said: He's talking about a sport becoming firmly established in another country. That means numerous teams, leagues, and people playing the game in significant numbers. Canada might one day get there, but it's nowhere near that yet. Well you've got to start somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 30 minutes ago, Wakefield Ram said: Growing a sport in a new country is massively challenging. Remember NFL Europe? Sport has cultural roots, transporting those to other countries rarely succeeds. Football is the exception, but beyond football, can anyone name a successful export it a sport to a new country? How about hockey from Canada to Russia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayCee Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Rl in France in the 30' s really took off, not to mention RL in Australia c. 1908. The thing is that once several sports are established, it’s then becomes difficult to elbow your way in. It’s harder now than it was say 50 years ago. In the period from the early 1900's to WW II, people were looking for sports to play or follow as leisure time increased. They have those sports and RL has left it late to try. It’s not impossible but much more difficult. My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/ It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course. It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 4 hours ago, RayCee said: Rl in France in the 30' s really took off, not to mention RL in Australia c. 1908. The thing is that once several sports are established, it’s then becomes difficult to elbow your way in. It’s harder now than it was say 50 years ago. In the period from the early 1900's to WW II, people were looking for sports to play or follow as leisure time increased. They have those sports and RL has left it late to try. It’s not impossible but much more difficult. Since WW2, there has been a very stable sorts culture dominated by national media. International broadcasting and the internet are breaking that down. "You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damp squib Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 17 hours ago, Kayakman said: How about hockey from Canada to Russia? The Russians were playing a version of hockey centuries before Canada even existed as a country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 12 minutes ago, damp squib said: The Russians were playing a version of hockey centuries before Canada even existed as a country. No...we invented ice hockey...the exact location is debated but it was either Kingston, Ontario or Halifax, Nova Scotia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 14 minutes ago, scotchy1 said: Billionaire offering a bright new dawn or bitter man from a poorer part of Leeds offering a managed decline. Its amazing some people choose slow death. Its a shocker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxford Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 23 hours ago, scotchy1 said: Billionaire offering a bright new dawn or bitter man from a poorer part of Leeds offering a managed decline. Its amazing some people choose slow death. I agree but for some change is too much to ask because it represents the chance of loss, the certainty of uncertainty, the threat to what they hold dearest. TWP is just another EU in these terms so it's hardly surprising the reaction it gets. What's really amazing is that so many are willing to join the party and don't listen, not that people think that way in the first place. 2 warning points Non-Political Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damp squib Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 13 hours ago, Kayakman said: No...we invented ice hockey...the exact location is debated but it was either Kingston, Ontario or Halifax, Nova Scotia. If you mean the codified rules of modern Ice Hockey, possibly. If you mean skating around on ice and hitting a ball with a stick....no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 2 hours ago, damp squib said: If you mean skating around on ice and hitting a ball with a stick....no. Correct...the Americans are still doing that very thing south of our border....and they think they know hockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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