MADREDNIGE Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 10 hours ago, Phil Loxton said: Its a 'debt' Coolie. Not 'arrears'. You have debt Coolie. Most of us have debt. So hold on to your Fev are doomed annual prediction Weekly! But we still love him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Phantom Horseman Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 10 hours ago, Phil Loxton said: Its a 'debt' Coolie. Not 'arrears'. You have debt Coolie. Most of us have debt. So hold on to your Fev are doomed annual prediction I'd have thought that given the news yesterday that Guzdek & Aaron Brown have signed for Sheffield he would have been too busy hunting down an Eagles forum to proclaim financial doom and ruin on to bother with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Tonks Sidestep Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 22 minutes ago, Cardypaul said: So what is the timetable from here. First apply for change of status of the land, fairly quickly - I think to get it included in the next local plan meant by the end of this or next month. Then it's a wait for it to go through process - likely 3 years. In the meantime real discussions with potential partners can begin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Loxton Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Les Tonks Sidestep said: Debt growing doesn't necessarily mean it's unaffordable by any stretch. Would moving into a new house with a bigger mortgage, or buying a new car on finance (both of which would increase your personal debt) make your debt unaffordable? They are grasping at nettles. They want to be the first to announce Fevs decline even though some have been eagerly awaiting Fevs demise since 2009. Rugby league fans are weird always wanting other clubs to go under. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Blues Ox Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 What happens to the land if the development company goes belly up after it is signed over? What is in place to stop anyone intentionally busting a company and setting up again to take total control? Building companies do not tend to be the most trustworthy of people in my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeymagic22 Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said: What happens to the land if the development company goes belly up after it is signed over? What is in place to stop anyone intentionally busting a company and setting up again to take total control? Building companies do not tend to be the most trustworthy of people in my experience. I’m sure that there will be something written into the contracts. Not something for us fans to worry about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Private Baldrick Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Phil Loxton said: They are grasping at nettles. They want to be the first to announce Fevs decline even though some have been eagerly awaiting Fevs demise since 2009. Rugby league fans are weird always wanting other clubs to go under. It's strange that the typical rugby league fans psyche is to look at the doom and gloom scenario. No one has posted yet about what if everything exceeds the projections and we make £50k per month on the deal? Everyone seems to be willing us to fail in this venture just to satisfy their own morbid agenda. There is risk in everything we do in life so let's just get on with what needs to be done, sit back and enjoy the ride and in a few years time remind the naysayers how foolish they looked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Private Baldrick Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 24 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said: What happens to the land if the development company goes belly up after it is signed over? What is in place to stop anyone intentionally busting a company and setting up again to take total control? Building companies do not tend to be the most trustworthy of people in my experience. What if it doesn't? How do you know there is nothing in place to prevent what you say could happen? Is there anyone in life you can trust 100%? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamescolin Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Didn't it say in the notes that we would retain a controlling interest in the land if there were snags like the ones just mentioned? Haven't got the notes to hand just speaking from memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamescolin Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 This is obviously , now the details are to hand, the best option. We have been sitting doing nothing for a long time. Let's now look to the future with eagerness. I feel the management are confident about things otherwise we would not have gone out signing overseas players and outlining other plans. Let's rest easy until the wheels start turning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddwarf Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 I have followed this topic for the last few days . Is my understanding correct . The club have sought permission to develop the land , having got that permission they are to enter into talks with interested parties. This is to secure a long term capital investment into the club . All risk is carried by the third party . All this sounds good . I assume there will be no immediate cash available to add further playing staff , the whole program is for securing the future after the expected central funds decrease or stop . If so looks like good forward planning . I hope it works as with fev sometimes it is to good to be true . I for one wish the venture success . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Tonks Sidestep Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 45 minutes ago, Reddwarf said: I have followed this topic for the last few days . Is my understanding correct . The club have sought permission to develop the land , having got that permission they are to enter into talks with interested parties. This is to secure a long term capital investment into the club . All risk is carried by the third party . All this sounds good . I assume there will be no immediate cash available to add further playing staff , the whole program is for securing the future after the expected central funds decrease or stop . If so looks like good forward planning . I hope it works as with fev sometimes it is to good to be true . I for one wish the venture success . No the Club do not yet have permission to develop the land. The next step is to get the 'land' into consideration for development in the next WMDC's Local Development Plan, the deadline for which is in the next few weeks (unless you pay a late fee of £15k). The final plan is due to be published in 2021/2 so it could be 3 years before any final decision is made. There will likely be no actual cash coming into the Club until the development is complete, or at least well underway with some buildings being rented out. The main thrust of the first phase is to get at least the charges on the land paid off, with hopefully some of the other 'debt' too. If agreement can be reached to just pay off the charges (ca£500k) and then the whole thing fails to materialise the Club will have gone from owning 12 acres of unproductive/undevelopable land that is costing in interest payments to owning 6 acres of unproductive/undevelopable land costing nothing - essentially £250k worth of land will have been sold for £500k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grinder Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, The Blues Ox said: What happens to the land if the development company goes belly up after it is signed over? What is in place to stop anyone intentionally busting a company and setting up again to take total control? Building companies do not tend to be the most trustworthy of people in my experience. Due to the fractious nature of the meeting last night the details are not totally obvious, however my understanding of the principles to be employed are that there will be a separate company set up to go through the process of redeveloping the land, which Fev will have a 51% share in and the equity firm 49%. Therefore if the equity firm was to go bankrupt the control of this company will still belong to Fev and the 49% would be an asset that could be sold by the administrator/liquidator instructed to deal with the equity firm going bust. I suspect we will not get to see the fine detail of the agreement. 42 minutes ago, Reddwarf said: I have followed this topic for the last few days . Is my understanding correct . The club have sought permission to develop the land , having got that permission they are to enter into talks with interested parties. This is to secure a long term capital investment into the club . All risk is carried by the third party . All this sounds good . I assume there will be no immediate cash available to add further playing staff , the whole program is for securing the future after the expected central funds decrease or stop . If so looks like good forward planning . I hope it works as with fev sometimes it is to good to be true . I for one wish the venture success . RD - thanks for this it is much appreciated. Just one clarification though it is not "...long term capital investment..." it is a long-term regular income to the club. I.e. estimated at £25k per month once everything is in place (this could take 6 years or even longer). I'm sure I'll think of something funny to say soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddwarf Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 I think I’ve got it now . It’s a long term business plan . That will benefit the club down the line . Thanks for the clarification Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Blues Ox Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 2 hours ago, Private Baldrick said: What if it doesn't? How do you know there is nothing in place to prevent what you say could happen? Is there anyone in life you can trust 100%? Its a question you as fans should have been told the answer on before having a vote on rather than something that should be written in the contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Blues Ox Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 17 minutes ago, The Grinder said: Due to the fractious nature of the meeting last night the details are not totally obvious, however my understanding of the principles to be employed are that there will be a separate company set up to go through the process of redeveloping the land, which Fev will have a 51% share in and the equity firm 49%. Therefore if the equity firm was to go bankrupt the control of this company will still belong to Fev and the 49% would be an asset that could be sold by the administrator/liquidator instructed to deal with the equity firm going bust. I suspect we will not get to see the fine detail of the agreement. From experience of our time when someone tried to buy the Shay its easy for fans to get taken in by something without knowing the full details, although not really the same situation this does remind me of that where fans are not given the full picture. PS. I do not want Fev to go bust or fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeymagic22 Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 minute ago, The Blues Ox said: From experience of our time when someone tried to buy the Shay its easy for fans to get taken in by something without knowing the full details, although not really the same situation this does remind me of that where fans are not given the full picture. PS. I do not want Fev to go bust or fail. Given that Fev aren’t investing any of their own money with the option taken, I really don’t see the risk?. At the end of the day the finer details of the deal will be dealt with by the clubs legal representatives, who I’d assume know more than us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Tonks Sidestep Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 2 hours ago, The Blues Ox said: What happens to the land if the development company goes belly up after it is signed over? What is in place to stop anyone intentionally busting a company and setting up again to take total control? Building companies do not tend to be the most trustworthy of people in my experience. I reckon you were one of those present last night finding fault with everything and seemingly wishing to return to how the Club was run the 1960s..... But anyway, if the Development company does go bust, as Fev will own 51% of said company I suspect there would be more important things to be worried about regarding the existence of the Club itself. But, if it's just the Development company in trouble and the land is 'lost' then the potential worst case scenario is that the land will have been effectively sold for its current value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamescolin Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Our management now are not idiots. We have gone down the best route available to us to clear the debts and have income generated in the future. 'IFS' can go on and on. I have looked at it closely and taking everything into consideration what is the alternative? Just to sit and wait until Doomsday? Action was needed and we have taken it. Now we have to act sensibly and in a business like manner. As I have said earlier I talked at length to Davide Longo and was impressed with his business acumen. I am sure he will look at all loose ends and tie them up as far as he can. We have taken action anticipating the future set up of the RL and our position financially. We have had the vote now let them get on with it. As I have said, we have looked at all the alternatives and none was feasible, so let's get on with what is the best option. If you have any grumbles come up with a better proposition that has creditability. Looking at other clubs at least we have assets to bring to fruition. A lot of them are hanging on to the whims of their owners who seem to be in cloud cuckoo land half the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eltel Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Well I have been sitting back reading most comments honestly I thought I was a person who mostly looked on the black side but alas there seems to be quite a few doom merchants. The game is on its knees and fev will continue to suffer especially with the superleague elitism and moneybags Toronto not to forget we owe shed loads of money Bradford but not to worry as they can spend money like there is no tomorrow once again if my memory serves me right the last liquidation in 2017 amounted to over 2 million in debt. Fev need to take a risk with option C it may or may not be our saviour but risk quite often reaps reward but continuing to plod along in the current system is poor management of the club in my opinion. Tip for top 4 Toronto Bradford Toulouse Widnes followed by Fax and Fev told you I looked on the black side but not to forget leigh if some moneybags come along ?... koukash may want back in somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MADREDNIGE Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 2 hours ago, Private Baldrick said: It's strange that the typical rugby league fans psyche is to look at the doom and gloom scenario. No one has posted yet about what if everything exceeds the projections and we make £50k per month on the deal? Everyone seems to be willing us to fail in this venture just to satisfy their own morbid agenda. There is risk in everything we do in life so let's just get on with what needs to be done, sit back and enjoy the ride and in a few years time remind the naysayers how foolish they looked. One word - jealousy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Slater Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 One impression I got, although not clarified and I may have got the wrong end of the stick, is that if the debt is paid off the club will immediately be £100K p.a. better off in not having to pay interest on the loans? If I'm right on this it would put them in a much better position over other Championship and League 1 clubs come 2021 if central funding is greatly reduced? Can someone please clarify this, because if that's the case the biggest risk to Fev would be that they would have no-one to play against- It's the other clubs I'm more worried about than Fev. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mightyship Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 27 minutes ago, Steve Slater said: One impression I got, although not clarified and I may have got the wrong end of the stick, is that if the debt is paid off the club will immediately be £100K p.a. better off in not having to pay interest on the loans? If I'm right on this it would put them in a much better position over other Championship and League 1 clubs come 2021 if central funding is greatly reduced? Can someone please clarify this, because if that's the case the biggest risk to Fev would be that they would have no-one to play against- It's the other clubs I'm more worried about than Fev. I got that impression too Steve - what I heard was that the development company would clear the charges on the land so removing some of the debt that Fev have - including the £200k that Colm is owed presumably. With less debt obviously comes less interest and potentially captial payments to make each month so we're better off in that respect. Even if the proposed development and income from that never materialises then surely we're in a better position because some debt has been repaid - and not by us but by the development company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Tonks Sidestep Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 55 minutes ago, Steve Slater said: One impression I got, although not clarified and I may have got the wrong end of the stick, is that if the debt is paid off the club will immediately be £100K p.a. better off in not having to pay interest on the loans? If I'm right on this it would put them in a much better position over other Championship and League 1 clubs come 2021 if central funding is greatly reduced? Can someone please clarify this, because if that's the case the biggest risk to Fev would be that they would have no-one to play against- It's the other clubs I'm more worried about than Fev. Pretty sure £10k per month was mentioned as being current interest payments so potentially £120k pa - even just CC's loan paid would be a saving of £36k pa! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grinder Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Steve Slater said: One impression I got, although not clarified and I may have got the wrong end of the stick, is that if the debt is paid off the club will immediately be £100K p.a. better off in not having to pay interest on the loans? If I'm right on this it would put them in a much better position over other Championship and League 1 clubs come 2021 if central funding is greatly reduced? Can someone please clarify this, because if that's the case the biggest risk to Fev would be that they would have no-one to play against- It's the other clubs I'm more worried about than Fev. Steve, that was my assumption too, however I doubt it would be the whole £10k per month, since I assume that not all the loans are secured against the land we wish to develop. It would be easier to get a loan secured against the stadium than it is against the land in question. So I'd expect a reduction but not all of it, howver even if it is 50% and therefore £60k pa reduction it would be significant. The question that I was going to ask, but never got the chance, was "when would the chanrges be paid off" since it is only at that point when the loan payments would be reduced. I'm sure I'll think of something funny to say soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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