Steve Neale NWEM

[Bearman]

1 hour ago, RSN said:

Just copy the website link into the post then copy and paste the content. I doubt the evening mail would be bothered about that. 

You are right. Copying the website link is fine as it attributes the article to the copyright holder.

Cut and pasting sections of an article breeches copyright.

[TMF]

To everybody on this thread, iv'e been a victim of 'Contactable Information' to the tune of many thousands of pounds. lets just leave it at that. Good luck to all in sharing your information on the web. Thread closed.

[The Vet]

5 hours ago, TMF said:

To everybody on this thread, iv'e been a victim of 'Contactable Information' to the tune of many thousands of pounds. lets just leave it at that. Good luck to all in sharing your information on the web. Thread closed.

Absolutely no idea what this means but I hope you get your £1000’s back

I think only administrators can close a thread.

[TMF]

Cheers Vet, no hope of that. I'll take the abuse, I don't give a toss. I'm just trying to warn people about what information they give about themselves and to who. Why do the RL want this info? What is the purpose? How do you prove a member on the web is a true supporter? Encouraging businesses to encourage their workforce to provide personal details? Where are we going with this? It could mean a club with an average gate of 4/500 generating 20,000 hits. Does this mean they get more money than us? It just seems to me the RL are being swept up in the concept that social media means more than the supporters that actually attend games. A vote on the web is more valid than mine?

It might sound daft, but London Skolars have an audience of 8,000,000 people and businesses to reach out to. We have 60,000. That is what I am reading, or am I being stupid and paranoid? Please help me here but if 'hits' become more important than supporters in the gift of who gets money from the RL, well. By the way, I do use the web to pay bills to trusted and secure sites, banks, etc, but not the RL. Abuse expected, lol.

[barrowscuba]

Pretty much spot on, I think, TMF.

There will be central funding but some is attributed to social media. The club can use the contact details for newsletters ticket offers etc but if Sheffield have 10k members and we have 5K, they will get more cash than us in that particular aspect. Same with Twitter & Facebook.

The RFL can request numbers of members from clubs but have no idea if they could possibly validate any details as being real, it must all be based on trust.  

I'm told that the NRL do not have a TV deal but stream all games themselves. This is possibly the first step to moving away from Sky and streaming via the Our League portal.  

[TMF]

And you barrowscuba  understand my point. 8,000,000 v 60000, 10000 v 5000.  They will get more cash than us. You are right. There is no way of validating anything. Trust, on the ether? There are programs out there that can generate millions of responses from people who don't exist in one second. And the RL is basing this on trust? I would also point out you can watch any NRL game from anywhere in the world regardless if they stream the game themselves or not. The stranglehold of SKY, BT, etc has been broken. If it's broadcast, it can be shown anywhere, in real time, wherever in the world you are.

[NWDuk]

To the posts about copyright, it's perfectly ok to quote an article for the purposes of criticism and review. A discussion forum would fall under that pretty reasonably.

[Bearman]

1 hour ago, NWDuk said:

To the posts about copyright, it's perfectly ok to quote an article for the purposes of criticism and review. A discussion forum would fall under that pretty reasonably.

Yes, that is what I understand.  It is ok to take a brief quote but cut and pasting the whole article without the attribute  is plagiarism.

[Dave W]

On 12/13/2018 at 8:04 AM, millomite said:

For the benefit of the club, it makes sense for us all to have a twitter account which follows the Barrow RLFC twitter account. If you're reluctant/not keen on using twitter I understand the apprehension. however, it'd take 5 minutes of your time to set up an account, follow Barrow rugby and that's it done, you become a statistic which will contribute to increasing the funding received. You can even make your account private etc so no one sees you on there etc. Plus you'd get the benefit of having a notification on your phone whenever the club posts on social media.

 

The same can be said for Facebook. Like it or not, that the platform of the modern era. A vast majority of local businesses don't have websites, but rely on facebook to promote their business.

You don't even have to set up a Twitter account under your own name and it takes two minutes to set up a "valid" Gmail account under a pseudonym in order to be able to register.

Also, personally, I think it's an absurd idea to give funds to clubs based on Twitter followers due to this massive loophole: You can "buy" a 1000 followers for around £30. 

I don't know what the deal is with funding in this regard but even if the RFL only give clubs, say, £500 for every 10,000 Twitter followers, it makes a mockery of it all if you're able to purchase 10000 followers for £300. Every £300 you spend, you'd get £500 back. Ker-ching! 

The RFL can't even perform basic due diligence, how the hell are they going to monitor and measure individual clubs' social media operations?

[scrumhalf]

can we get a bot that does millions of hits for us then lol

[TMF]

39 minutes ago, scrumhalf said:

can we get a bot that does millions of hits for us then lol

I think people are starting to get the drift of what I am saying. And yes scrumhalf, that is precisely what I am saying. Do you not get technology? That is what exactly what could happen. How the hell have the RL gone down this road?

[NWDuk]

To be fair, we don't know just how much of the funding allocation is based on promotion and the club's media reach. It seems that there are a fair few measures now.

If it's only a small percentage then it may be a worthwhile venture. Even if it just gives club's a bit of a kick up the ###### to get doing what they should have been doing for years. I keep saying it, but Barrow have made a massive improvement. 

[Dave W]

West Wales Raiders' Twitter feed has over 10000 followers. 

Make of that what you will! 

[TMF]

On 12/17/2018 at 10:31 PM, Dave W said:

West Wales Raiders' Twitter feed has over 10000 followers. 

Make of that what you will! 

And if that doesn't explain my point I don't know what will? I just don't understand why the club are supporting this initiative? As for saying we need a kick up the #### NWDuk, why do you think we need that?

[tec]

NWDuk won’t reply he is still working out a way to get his season ticket to matches .

[NWDuk]

Don't worry, I've bought a new season ticket satchel. My ticket's snug as a bug now.

 

I don't think we need a kick now. I think it's given us one. The promotion and engagement with fans (new and old) has been massive over the past 6 months. The club has finally switched on to the fact that they need to be actively promoting themselves. I think that will translate to people coming through the gates.

 

I get that you can buy twitter followers, but you can also put the effort in and create a bit of buzz in the community. What was our average attendance last season? 1200? Keep putting the word out and I reckon we can can improve that by 20% this year. Closer to 1500.

I don't agree with the RFLs new funding initiatives but it's absolutely crazy for the club not to be doing these things regardless.

[Barty]

14 hours ago, NWDuk said:

….. What was our average attendance last season? 1200? Keep putting the word out and I reckon we can can improve that by 20% this year. Closer to 1500. ….

I think the important bit will be how many home supporters make up the increased gates. I assume that with Bradford in the league and London not we should automatically get a larger average. I think there will be some curiosity about how the PNG players add some sparkle to the team and if they play well it should encourage more to come. I hope so anyway.

[NWDuk]

Message from the club which echos some of the things said yesterday and provides more info on the breakdown of funding.

 

 

"An explanation of the Return on Investment criteria for RFL funding:
For the 2020 season 80% of central distributions will be determined by league position with the other 20% by Key Performance Indicators. These KPIs are broken down in to four categories each worth 5% of the overall funding for the Championships. The four categories are Financial, Crowds, Player Production and Data. The difference financially of being in the top 5 of a category and the bottom 5 of a category is around £20,000 so being in the top 5 for every category will give the club £80,000 more than if we were in the bottom 5 for every category. Being in the top 5 compared to 11th-15th is worth about £40,000 - so it is serious money. For future seasons the KPIs will have a much bigger % than league postion so we need to get ourselves organised.
The data category is the one that our fans really need to play a part. This is broken down in to 5 sub-categories; Website page views, Facebook Likes, Twitter followers, Our League Members and club members (contactable fans with names and e-mail addresses). 
Each sub-category has a league table and points are awarded which results in an overall category league table from which funding is allocated.
We know this is open to abuse but fundamentally if the criteria gives you a kick to engage with your fanbase then rugby league should get positive results. 
We know the days of doing a preview in a Saturday night's Evening Mail and expecting a 4000 crowd are long gone. It's our job to engage with our fans giving them as much information as possible so they feel part of our club.
So we urge all our fans to do their little bit. Like our Facebook page, follow our Twitter page, visit the website regularly, join ourleague and select Barrow as your chosen team and become a member of the club by providing contactable information. - Steve"

[walneyite]

Not being sharpest tool with this but a thought .... key performance indicators aren’t a choice they’re implemented so whether the club agree with them or not they will have to try to achieve targets to gain the identified financial support ..

I'm dont use Facebook twitter etc So can’t help there..  Ive joined and like the our league app and watched a few streamed games,entered competitions..  if Barrow set a fans forum up on the club website would they get us all under one roof to aid the cause , this offers them more hits (or whatever they are called).. encouraging other club fans to pop in for a bit of online banter or abuse increases “hits”.. 

I don’t know if I have missed the point or not and obviously that wouldn’t help this forum I’d people moved but it’s a thought.

[TMF]

11 hours ago, NWDuk said:

Message from the club which echos some of the things said yesterday and provides more info on the breakdown of funding.

 

 

"An explanation of the Return on Investment criteria for RFL funding:
For the 2020 season 80% of central distributions will be determined by league position with the other 20% by Key Performance Indicators. These KPIs are broken down in to four categories each worth 5% of the overall funding for the Championships. The four categories are Financial, Crowds, Player Production and Data. The difference financially of being in the top 5 of a category and the bottom 5 of a category is around £20,000 so being in the top 5 for every category will give the club £80,000 more than if we were in the bottom 5 for every category. Being in the top 5 compared to 11th-15th is worth about £40,000 - so it is serious money. For future seasons the KPIs will have a much bigger % than league postion so we need to get ourselves organised.
The data category is the one that our fans really need to play a part. This is broken down in to 5 sub-categories; Website page views, Facebook Likes, Twitter followers, Our League Members and club members (contactable fans with names and e-mail addresses). 
Each sub-category has a league table and points are awarded which results in an overall category league table from which funding is allocated.
We know this is open to abuse but fundamentally if the criteria gives you a kick to engage with your fanbase then rugby league should get positive results. 
We know the days of doing a preview in a Saturday night's Evening Mail and expecting a 4000 crowd are long gone. It's our job to engage with our fans giving them as much information as possible so they feel part of our club.
So we urge all our fans to do their little bit. Like our Facebook page, follow our Twitter page, visit the website regularly, join ourleague and select Barrow as your chosen team and become a member of the club by providing contactable information. - Steve"

Thanks NWDuk, at last some one has explained what this all means. I appreciate your effort but it still leaves questions. 80% of central distribution will be determined by league position. Fine. How much will that be then? Financial? What does that mean? Another 5% will be for crowds. What does that mean? In the top 5? Who provides those figures? The home club? Player production? Another 5%. Really. What the hell does that mean? As for data, well, i've had my say on that. I just think KPI's are clouding what should be a simple formula. Finish in this position and this is what you get. Barrow is my chosen team and I already feel part of my chosen club. Or do the RL not believe me?