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new stadium - todays press


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33 minutes ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

Is nobody else worried about this?

Everyone agrees (including the aforementioned councilors) that modern sporting facilities are required in Allerdale, but I get the impression from the various stories in the paper, on Facebook etc. that the council are trying to forcibly justify the outlay by rushing everything through without properly costing it all up - and at any cost.

Don't get sucked in by the various statements saying 'this won't add anything to council tax bills', because if for any reason this goes #### up, then its the local authority (ie: us, the local tax payers) who will foot the bill and pay any shortfall, as these investors will want their full pound of flesh !

I'm surprised the Council are even considering a 'leaseback' as it recognised nationwide as the most expensive way of borrowing, with particularly aggressive terms and conditions attached. If its a 40 or 50 year lease, I would be amazed if the NHS or Sellafield would even be allowed to commit for such a long period, as surely they would insist on a release clause of some description, after all, who can predict what be happen in 5 years, never mind 40 or 50 years. So if they sign up for 10 -15 years and decide not to renew their lease because somebody has built cheaper office space over the road, then what then? 

Tells you something when a haven fan loves this post.

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15 minutes ago, unicorn106 said:

Without the stadium I would safely say that the future of both clubs is in jeapordy we can't carry on trying to keep 2 delapadated stadiums going. I know how much hard work and ridiculous amounts of money that have been put in to keep DP going and BP will be the same. I just don't see how it can't be in the interests of both clubs especially the Red's who are in a perilous league position and certainly need the boost of a new stadium if they are relegated. 

I agree with you and have been for the stadium all the way. I’m just not sure this private funded option is a viable option on the figures quoted in the star. Obviously have to wait and see what materialises and hope that what is decided allows the development but also allows both clubs to progress.

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Realistically, it's very difficult to see the stadium being finished and ready for the RLWC in Oct 2021. There's two years and 7 months to submit the planning application, obtain planning permission, identify contractors, begin construction and finish the work. That's a lot of work.

If you look at York's stadium as a comparable build, the planning permission which was submitted in December 2014, passed in March 2015 with construction beginning over 2 years later in December 2017.

There’s obviously a lot of split feeling/opinions towards the new stadium up in Allerdale which I’d expect to drag the planning application and approval process out somewhat, and given that hasn’t yet been submitted I’d be seriously impressed if approval was granted before the end of this year. That would then leave 22 months for construction of the stadium, which when you factor in all the contractual stuff and possible delays, doesn’t leave a lot of time to get it built.

Before folk start moaning that I'm a Haven fan etc, I'm not, I'm a rugby league fan from Cumbria. I'd love Town to have a new stadium, it'd be great. I just think there's a lot of work to do and even more hoops to jump through for it to come to fruition in time for the RLWC.

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1 hour ago, unicorn106 said:

No surprise DTTRR you've been against this from day one.

No I'm not - don't confuse pessimism with realism!

I'm absolutely 100% for the building of a modern stadium in Allerdale, but not at any cost!

The project needs to be sustainable and affordable, and you would hope this project has been properly costed and budgeted for, but the fact they are now considering going down the road PFI route says otherwise.

My main concerns has been about the capacity of the stadium as I still don't think there's any need for an 8,000 capacity in West Cumbria. I would rather have seen a 5,000 capacity stadium with a realistic average crowd of 1200-1500 at games than an 8,000 empty bowl.

IF, and its a big if, crowds were nudging towards an average of 5,000 for a couple of seasons, then you could argue the need to add to the capacity.

But hey, that's just my view on things, but on this forum some people take exception to you expressing your own opinion if it isn't the same as there's.

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4 minutes ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

No I'm not - don't confuse pessimism with realism!

I'm absolutely 100% for the building of a modern stadium in Allerdale, but not at any cost!

The project needs to be sustainable and affordable, and you would hope this project has been properly costed and budgeted for, but the fact they are now considering going down the road PFI route says otherwise.

My main concerns has been about the capacity of the stadium as I still don't think there's any need for an 8,000 capacity in Westy Cumbria. I would rather have seen a 5,000 capacity stadium with a realistic average crowd of 1200-1500 at games than an 8,000 empty bowl.

IF, and its a big if, crowds were nudging towards an average of 5,000 for a couple of seasons, then you could argue the need to add to the capacity

At 8000 capacity it is not going to look that big,remember that is smaller than derwent park and even I've been in borough  park with 8000 in back in 1980 ,the only way you will save money is build it with nothing behind the posts which is a poor alternative. Chances to improve the cumbrian stadiums have been missed before and I get the feeling if we want the possibility of any decent level of sport in the area we have to take a leap of faith

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I'm fully behind a new stadium and the area needs one but if it was an option between an 8k stadium with three world cup games or a 5k stadium with room to build on id certainly take the latter, its possible to be a Town fan and also have a different view on the stadium. DTTRR has always talked sense on issues relating to the club

It feels like theres too much bickering amongst ourselves on here hopefully that can change

Forget Chuck and Chad I am the real legend killer

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9 minutes ago, Route66 said:

Chances to improve the cumbrian stadiums have been missed before and I get the feeling if we want the possibility of any decent level of sport in the area we have to take a leap of faith

Totally agree with you, the area needs it, both clubs need it and while I don't think  either club would fold as a result of not having the stadium, it would certainly hinder their development for good without a modern sporting facility

 

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3 hours ago, unicorn106 said:

Tells you something when a haven fan loves this post.

I liked the post because as much as I would be pleased to see a new stadium in West Cumbria it would not be at any price. I think the poster was right in what he was saying. I think a PFI built stadium would be a disaster and a millstone round Allerdales neck. If I was a Town or Reds fan I would be concerned as to how much that would be costing my club.

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1 hour ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

No I'm not - don't confuse pessimism with realism!

I'm absolutely 100% for the building of a modern stadium in Allerdale, but not at any cost!

The project needs to be sustainable and affordable, and you would hope this project has been properly costed and budgeted for, but the fact they are now considering going down the road PFI route says otherwise.

My main concerns has been about the capacity of the stadium as I still don't think there's any need for an 8,000 capacity in West Cumbria. I would rather have seen a 5,000 capacity stadium with a realistic average crowd of 1200-1500 at games than an 8,000 empty bowl.

IF, and its a big if, crowds were nudging towards an average of 5,000 for a couple of seasons, then you could argue the need to add to the capacity.

But hey, that's just my view on things, but on this forum some people take exception to you expressing your own opinion if it isn't the same as there's.

I'm all for opinions and I just gave mine based on what I've read in your stadium posts. I didn't say you were out of order and I'm certainly not opposed to anyone having a different view from mine and I don't call people out as haven fans when they post something slightly negative regarding the club ( apart from Big Yin who is ). Some of your ideas on a smaller stadium makes sense but I think we are all getting a bit frustrated with some of the people who are on a mission to wreck this project. We've seen one scuppered and are just keen to see  this built. Marrafan loved your post because like the rest of them he would love this scheme to fall through like Pow Beck did. ( Awaits predictable confused emoji from Davo )

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1 hour ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

Totally agree with you, the area needs it, both clubs need it and while I don't think  either club would fold as a result of not having the stadium, it would certainly hinder their development for good without a modern sporting facility

 

You are entitled your opinion DTTRR but you are clearly anti stadium.  Thats upto you. 

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6 minutes ago, town4me said:

You are entitled your opinion DTTRR but you are clearly anti stadium.  Thats upto you. 

I AM NOT ANTI-STADIUM ! 

As a rate payer I'm asking for reassurance on how its going to be funded and sustained moving forward without bankrupting both Town and Reds and saddling the rate payers with a huge bill for years to come!

But once again, it's likely ok to have an opinion as long as its the same as yours eh! 

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30 minutes ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

I AM NOT ANTI-STADIUM ! 

As a rate payer I'm asking for reassurance on how its going to be funded and sustained moving forward without bankrupting both Town and Reds and saddling the rate payers with a huge bill for years to come!

But once again, it's likely ok to have an opinion as long as its the same as yours eh! 

No you are entitled to your personal opinion mate. However your persistent negativity around the stadium subject is clear to see. As i have said to you before it wouldn't  have got this far if it hadn't been  costed properly IMO. Do you really think the council would saddle rate payers with huge bills for years to come?????

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1 hour ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

bankrupting both Town and Reds and saddling the rate payers with a huge bill for years to come!

Sorry that may be your opinion but I personally think thats a ridiculous thing to say.  

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Rock and a hard place. Without the 8k capacity. We wouldn't get world cup games. Meaning we miss out on massive revenue for the local area and a good chunk to pay for the stadium to.

Would the council look at funding a stadium that limits the events you can hold in it? 

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I honestly cant understand why anyone thinks basing it on a 5k capacity makes any sense, when its already been proven rep games can bring in 7k+ attendances. Why limit the grounds potential by being overly pessimistic when the actual costs of the extra capacity would be minimal during the design and build stage. Build in capacity now and aim to fill it, rather than limit capacity and aim down to it. 

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1 hour ago, rockerlad said:

a quick note on the council. they could easily get voted out of office in the may elections, then what? 

Why would a council who strive to improve the borough , " easily " get voted out ? We need to vote them back in and keep the dinasours and self publicists out.

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15 minutes ago, unicorn106 said:

Why would a council who strive to improve the borough , " easily " get voted out ? We need to vote them back in and keep the dinasours and self publicists out.

because there is a ridiculous amount of folk in allerdale against the stadium and would vote them out in an attempt to stop it going ahead.

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6 hours ago, dkw said:

Warrington did this to great effect, as did Wigan and St Helens.

Dave Whelan funded the building of the DW stadium,Warrington & Saints had Tesco to help fund their stadiums as a condition of them building new stores and are solely owned by the clubs,with no leaseback involved.

Hopefully it's sorted out soon as God knows West Cumbria is crying out for a modern sports venue.

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27 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

Dave Whelan funded the building of the DW stadium,Warrington & Saints had Tesco to help fund their stadiums as a condition of them building new stores and are solely owned by the clubs,with no leaseback involved.

Hopefully it's sorted out soon as God knows West Cumbria is crying out for a modern sports venue.

They all had the stadiums part financed by others, not just tesco and whelan as far as I can remember. Saints for example:

"Spawforths secured permission on behalf of Langtree Group PLC for a new 18,000-capacity Stadium which was cross funded by a new 140,000 sqft Tesco Extra," 

https://www.spawforths.co.uk/langtree-park-stadium

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6 hours ago, Marrafan said:

I liked the post because as much as I would be pleased to see a new stadium in West Cumbria it would not be at any price. I think the poster was right in what he was saying. I think a PFI built stadium would be a disaster and a millstone round Allerdales neck. If I was a Town or Reds fan I would be concerned as to how much that would be costing my club.

thanks for your sage advice about our borough. You're not a town or reds fan and your club went to just giving to survive so I'm not sure you are in any position to give your view (cue confused/laughter emoji)

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